Supercharged GM minivan

[savage_with_wrench]

Does anyone have information on fitting a Gen II Supercharged 3.8 into a recent GM minivan (Montana, Venture, Sillouette)? The transmissions seem to be the same as what the 3.4 uses. I am looking for someone who has already done this and kept it street legal. Details I would need are: Fuel system upgrades, needed exhaust fabrications, PCM transfer and 'pin-outs' and CV joint issues. Any details on reliably dropping the center of gravity on one of these minivans would be much appreciated.

[Redcivic3]

Why do a swap ?


RSM Supercharger Kit - 80+ HP gain

Includes Vortech Supercharger, all Brackets and Oil Lines, Belt and Pulleys, ECU programming, Adjustable Blow-Off Valve, FMU, Induction Piping and K&N Cone Filter. Gain is 80 HP and 75 ft/lbs of torque with 8 PSI boost. Options include Bigger Injectors and up to 12 PSI boost for $999.99


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[savage_with_wrench]

Good idea but has a couple of drawbacks: 1. Engine internals for blown GEN II are engineered for forced induction. I don't know how well the 3.4 would hold up. 2. If I were to go for a centripetal type supercharger with it's 'spool up' characteristics I might as well turbocharge and maintain a turbo's superior efficiency and unlimited boost capacity.(no worries for belt wrap and accessory shaft loading) 3. I am looking to pass emissions testing.
I definitely will look into the suggestions though. Thanks!

[Redcivic3]

Originally Posted by savage_with_wrench

Good idea but has a couple of drawbacks: 1. Engine internals for blown GEN II are engineered for forced induction. I don't know how well the 3.4 would hold up. 2. If I were to go for a centripetal type supercharger with it's 'spool up' characteristics I might as well turbocharge and maintain a turbo's superior efficiency and unlimited boost capacity.(no worries for belt wrap and accessory shaft loading) 3. I am looking to pass emissions testing.
I definitely will look into the suggestions though. Thanks!

umm unlimited boost no, effiency no, and yah im 14 but hell i know what im talking about
a turbo can only flow so much and effiency willl leave quickly. and i wont want to imagine the turbo lag on it

[savage_with_wrench]

Au Contraire! Turbos CAN produce boost up to the point that the engine comes apart. When intake gasses and fuel are combined and spent they produce a volume of gasses ALWAYS GREATER than the intake volume. The only restrictions to boost are 1. The Throttlebody-which limits flow to intake. 2. The Wastegate-which bleeds exhaust past the exhaust section of the turbocharger. 3. Fuel system capacity- Only a tertiary limiting factor. With unlimited fuel system capacity and not wastegate an engine could produce boost until it suffered a catastrophic failure.
Turbo lag is multifaceted. It should be noted first that a centrifugal supercharger is one side of a turbocharger with a belt driving the other. Without positive displacement(i.e. roots type supercharger) the turbine must "spool up" to create boost meaning that it's boost curve is NOT LINEAR - similar to a turbocharger. Another factor that affects turbo lag is intake plenium volume vs. compressor size. This ratio determines how quickly boost is built up once the turbine is at an efficient speed.
You may have a point at efficiency; however it is still unlikely in application to happen. Efficiency of a turbocharger and centrifugal supercharger are similar and heavily dependent upon compressor blade shape and "trim". This efficiency is not static but dependent upon compressor speed. Superchargers have a loss of power caused by parasitic loss by their belt and gearing. Turbochargers have no such loss. That is why efficiency ranges usually follow these guidlelines: roots type supercharger 35-55% eff, centrifugal supercharger 65-70%, turbocharger 70-75%

[Redcivic3]

the turbine will melt before the engine comes apart

[savage_with_wrench]

School is in session again...
Most turbines are fabricated with a high nickel or chrome-moly steel and can handle temperatures in excess of 3500 deg F. At this temperature there are several other things that will fail first: Tubular exhaust manifolds, copper gaskets, exhaust piping(any type), seals within the turbo and pitting would occur on the exhaust side turbo housing. Chances are that the engine would have any of the following before high temp problems: blown head gasket, cracked piston, melted piston, "burned" exhaust valves, bent/cracked connecting rod.
Some homework basics can help you understand these principles better. I recommend getting your hands on a Strength of Materials and Applied Thermodynamics textbooks. (A little brush up on integral calculus may be needed) Once you have a grasp on the thermodynamic principles, there are several "do it yourself" books on forced induction. I recommend the books authored by Corky Bell.

[supervan]

Originally Posted by savage_with_wrench

Does anyone have information on fitting a Gen II Supercharged 3.8 into a recent GM minivan (Montana, Venture, Sillouette)? The transmissions seem to be the same as what the 3.4 uses. I am looking for someone who has already done this and kept it street legal. Details I would need are: Fuel system upgrades, needed exhaust fabrications, PCM transfer and 'pin-outs' and CV joint issues. Any details on reliably dropping the center of gravity on one of these minivans would be much appreciated.

i put an L 67 in my 93 transport se and now drive the fastest minivan anywere i know, my friend asked me yesterday if it could be put in his newer model transport. i think if you had some time and money you could stuff it in there. my swap took alot of dickin around, but was worth it in the end, i dont recomend putting turbo,s or superchargers on any mill that hasent come stock built to handle the power these blowers have on internal parts,if you wanna have a reliable vehicle stay away from juicin up a stock motor,zoooooooooom KABOOOOM. DOC OUT

[jveik]

i wanna see someone put a 400 smallblock chevy in an 80's accord. that would kick sum ass until the engine that is sitting where the back seat should be gets warm and makes the driver sweat their balls off...

[drbenway]

I have asked the same question and have gotten no response, although I would bet that among the thousands of GM 3.4 minivans, somebody has tried this, especially with the availability of crate gen II supercharged 3.8's.

I agree with you that this would be a sensible thing for a gentleman to do - I have a 2000 Montana with 99K that has been remarkably reliable - it has never been tuned, although I do run Mobil 1 in it.

I live in CA, and I am wondering how the smog people would regard it - I can't see why it would be a problem, but it might be - then there are all those physical and electronic issues that you raise. I would be most comfortable if I could find someone who had already done it and passed smog - please pass on anything you hear.

Thanks,

[pastaben]

I think I posted something similar a while ago, but this thread is interesting.
I would love to have a relatively easy engine swap that will boost horsepower. Plus, after my 99 Venture passes 100K miles, if the rest of the body is still good, I'd like to see if anyone has done a trans swap also...say for a manual? Woudl that be too major an overhaul?

A manual trans that can still hold my family is my dream car (most of the week, I dont' carry passengers).