Help Me Build My Beast...

[Hypsi87]

89IROC&RS .... Would a stock TPI support that much power?? espically with forced induction? I mean after you get the BIG ass injectors, ETC. What kind of computer management would you use. Us Buick guys have stuff like Accel DFI 7.0 and Fel Pro's F.A.S.T. computers. What could he use on that setup. Also I would think that to reccomend what gear to run you would need to know what size slicks he is going to run. ( Lets face it to keep that kind of power on the ground your gonna need slicks.) and what kind of RPM he wants to turn. I agree with you fully on what you said about cam size... It matters even more on a forced air car. Cams for forced cars are generally smaller lift and lower duration. If you took a huge lift and long duration cam and put it in a forced air car. The ammount of air/fuel that you would let in would be way too much for 99% of blocks that are out there. That and forced induction cam's have less valve overlap. To give you an idea a huge street cam for a turbo buick is only a .471 lift and a 218 duration. yea that's only for a 231 v-6 but compare that to perfomance cams for a 281 v-8 mustang. It's only a 50 cubic inch difference. I'm kinda thinking that your going to have to back half the car to get enough tire under that thing to hold that power. If you don't there is no way you will get enough slick under that car to even think about driving it. Man thinking of what you need to be legeal at the track to safely run this car I don't think you can keep it a street car. You will need a chute asuming you break 150 MPH or what ever the dragstrip you run at requires. Plus all the personal protection equipment. (including fire proof underware ) I don't think a stock GM block big or small can survive 900 HP. I would look into a motown block.

[89IROC&RS]

easier to stomach but i would agree that if you built a 900hp NA engine, and then put a turbo or blower on it, you could drop the lift alot to get to the same 900hp mark. but why not keep the big lobes, and make more power besides, as the xtream energy cams have proven, the lift is irrelevent to power, its the cam profile. with a roller cam, you can run very aggressive lobes with optimized area "under the curve" thats where the power comes in.

[Hypsi87]

Originally Posted by 89IROC&RS

easier to stomach but i would agree that if you built a 900hp NA engine, and then put a turbo or blower on it, you could drop the lift alot to get to the same 900hp mark. but why not keep the big lobes, and make more power besides, as the xtream energy cams have proven, the lift is irrelevent to power, its the cam profile. with a roller cam, you can run very aggressive lobes with optimized area "under the curve" thats where the power comes in.

to keep the big lobes with forced induction you would "overstuff" the cylinder. That could cause hydrolock

[89IROC&RS]

hypsy, well no, a stock TPI has no chance in hell of supporting 900 hp. but a forced induction superram system has a good chance. i mean alot of drag cars use a dominator carb. that flows around 1200cfm, the superram flows 1000cfm so its pretty close air wise. and yes you would have to use larger fuel injectors, thanx for bringing that up, i totally forgot about that. but the stock computer has a chance, im not really sure about it exactly, no experience of pushin it taht far. but it has the same programable perameters as the aftermarket stuff. just maybe not quite as how you say, designed for the task. if he has the money you also brought up another very good point with the accel DFI 7.0 to go with the superram intake. im just stuck in a budget state of mind cuz thats where i am. but i have seen naturally asperated superram smallblocks (406cid) running around 600hp, add another 48ci, and forced induction, and i think that 800 is pretty much a no brainer, and then an additional 100 is in the details, fuel mapping spark curves, thermal coatings, anti friction coatings. and all that. better cam, (think they were using an LT4 HOT cam.) so its very doable.

[89IROC&RS]

eh, it would really only "overstuff" if you kept a high compression. you would have to lower the compression of the naturally asperated to run the forced induction. the cam size is pretty much irrelivent. it would just determine the rpm peak and range of the engine.

[Hypsi87]

At max boost of lets say 15 psi even if your compression is 8.0:1. your cylender pressure is still 240 PSI

[Hypsi87]

Originally Posted by 89IROC&RS

hypsy, well no, a stock TPI has no chance in hell of supporting 900 hp. but a forced induction superram system has a good chance. i mean alot of drag cars use a dominator carb. that flows around 1200cfm, the superram flows 1000cfm so its pretty close air wise. and yes you would have to use larger fuel injectors, thanx for bringing that up, i totally forgot about that. but the stock computer has a chance, im not really sure about it exactly, no experience of pushin it taht far. but it has the same programable perameters as the aftermarket stuff. just maybe not quite as how you say, designed for the task. if he has the money you also brought up another very good point with the accel DFI 7.0 to go with the superram intake. im just stuck in a budget state of mind cuz thats where i am. but i have seen naturally asperated superram smallblocks (406cid) running around 600hp, add another 48ci, and forced induction, and i think that 800 is pretty much a no brainer, and then an additional 100 is in the details, fuel mapping spark curves, thermal coatings, anti friction coatings. and all that. better cam, (think they were using an LT4 HOT cam.) so its very doable.

to take that 600 HP and to just strap on a method of forced induction. could not happen to do that as you know you would have to drop the compression so your base of 600 HP is gone becasue to get 600 hp out of a NA engine has to be running some high compressionn raitos. Your talking about another 300 hp . Thats not just a piddly ammount of power to just add.

Hope you don't take this as an arguing and trying to prove you wrong. Just a little discussion between two gearheads.

P.S. I know this is off topic but is anyone watching the packer raider game?? Farve had like 380 some yards of passing in the first half . I hate the packers but damn. Thats good

[madyak]

does anyone have a video of a tt camaro? I want to see/hear it.

[70 Z UC]

www.grapeaperacing.com

[89IROC&RS]

Quote* to take that 600 HP and to just strap on a method of forced induction. could not happen to do that as you know you would have to drop the compression so your base of 600 HP is gone becasue to get 600 hp out of a NA engine has to be running some high compressionn raitos. Your talking about another 300 hp . Thats not just a piddly ammount of power to just add.

Hope you don't take this as an arguing and trying to prove you wrong. Just a little discussion between two gearheads.

hey no prob hypsy, love a good challenge but that is a good point about dropping compression ruining the baseline. but its also a matter of how much boost are you running? you can run a 10:1 with 5-8 psi boost with proper tuning. ive seen it done. and on a 350 V8 that small ammount of boost can add 150hp to the baseline. on a less than optimized engine. the engine he is talking about is optimized to get every last bit of power, so the boost, especially on the bigger engine, would make more power, say 200. much less added than to the weaker motor, say 150 added to 300 as opposed to 200 added to the 600, but very doable. with no major changes to the engine. to run the 15psi you are talking about, yes you would have to drop compression, but the ammount of boost you are talking about would make up for it. at least from my experience. i could be wrong, but hey, its me, so thats very unlikely lol

[Hypsi87]

yea it's doable. Just my main consernn is the stock block that would be used to make this power. 900+ hp is alot of lateral force on the main and rod berings and jornals. and alot of RPM. Has anyone accually established if he wants this to be a street car or not??? if not then who cares. Build it to go fast then fix it when it breaks. If so then this is going to be one hell of a project.

[89IROC&RS]

oh no doubt, for 900 hp, i think a well preped stock 400 would work, maybe with some hardblock in the water passeges. but aftermarket is always better for that kinda deal

[madyak]

Yes I want to use this car on the street, and yes I know its gonna use gas like there's no tommorow. I was thinking of an aftermarket race block. Any recomendations??

[89IROC&RS]

world, merlin, bowtie, motown, ......... um thats all i can think of off the top of my head.

[1992RS]

World, Merlin, and Motown are all from World products by the way.