Ping & Pong present: Two VERY Red Ferraris

Welcome to a double WIP from me - Mr. Ping - and my friend - Mr. Pong.

Guidelines for our project were:

We haven’t seen it done before;
We must include as many totally crazy and impossible ideas as we can;
We MUST try to finish this project :D ;
This project must include pain! After all, did not Confucius himself say: “No pain, no gain!”So, what we do?

We came up with this idea:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_03.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_01.jpg


These are two standard 612 Scagliettis that made a 15.000 mile promotional tour around China.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_map.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_04.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_05.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/ref_06.jpg

The pair are essentially standard factory equipped 612s with some additional underbody protection, raised suspension and wire grilles over the headlights. The cars made the tour around China without breakdowns and in one piece – sometimes going through terrain that a 4x4 wouldn’t like too much.



But the real reason we like the project was the livery!! :D
But it is not existing so……..


First Mr. Pong make design from reference photos (bravo Mr. Pong :worshippy ) and we have Alps decals made. They look…good, but not perfect.

Then Mr. Ping (that’s me) said “Dude [ed note: colloquial Mandarin for “Buddy”], it’s waterslide decals or nothing!”

Glad to say that Mr. Pong agreed to this crazy idea. We commissioned a limited edition run of 250 sets of waterslide decals professionally printed by a company that produces decals for model manufacturers. Crazy nuts, or what!? :lol:

Here is scan of what we make.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/REFERENCE/decalsheet.jpg

Each sheet contains all decals necessary to complete both Red and Silver cars as well as improved dials and other gratuitous decals like VIN plates, chassis plates etc. etc. etc.

Now I hand over to Mr. Pong who is making the silver 612.

Enjoy the ride!

As a start I've to Thaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanks my friend Mr.Ping to trust in this forgetful designer, it wouldn't be easy ;)

Great intro beside: you'll do copywriter mate. So no much more word in my shitty english and down with WIP images, good luck!

To the Revell stuff now: it have some points that could be improoved: weel arches and general smooth appeal:
Revell stuff, front weel arch:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/1.jpg
.. and the pininfarina designed stuff, the real one
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/frontarch.jpg

Like you'll see the revell arch's edge is very wide, almost 3 or 4 times more; also the shape of the arch is more smooth, rounded. The same in the rear one:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/2.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/reararch.jpg

Ok I guess image better than 1000 words with my crappy english:

handy mill down fenders

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/3.jpg
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/4.jpg

finished with wet sandpaper

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/5.jpg
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/6.jpg

start to look better to me ;)

Well I cleaned up all mold lines and sand down until 1500 grit, panel line was scribed (dymo tape as guide) and I done a couple of hand of white primer (Lecher kind) and sand down it with 2000 grit under runny water:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/primer1.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/primer2.jpg

I'm redy to try some new materials: I bring a kind 3M tape for masking jobs, used from "custom bike" decorator: seem good. The paint workflow would be done with body shop flat base (Lecher mixed Ferrari Colors, Late Rosso Corsa and Grigio Alloy) and 2K clearcoat.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/colors.jpg

Well, job started, Rosso Corsa is on

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/red.jpg

Day after: I masked off teh red area, 3M kind tape for edge, standard M tape for fill the rest

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/mask.jpg

Grigio alloy is gone... comming good

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/silver.jpg

(don't worry for the stange reflex on the fron fender: it's just a shade of the blackboard I'm pulling to limit hilight)

masked off:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/ok2.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/max.jpg

And... decal job done: decals are really superthin, transparent almost invisible after done:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/unbranded2.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/unbranded1.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/scaglietti%20china/unbranded3.jpg


Thanks for looking, stay tuned ;)

Hey Mr.Ping, buddy I leave the thread all your ;) :D

awesome, love the progress!

Wow, nice start... Keep up the good work and keep us posted.

P.S. welcome to the forums.

Fantastic and very original job :)

Any chance I could purchase a couple sets of those decals? Please PM me.

John B

Great work so far! Where will those decals be available? They look great!

wow wow wow... great model and awesome job. Hope we can get hold of the decal sheet

Nice job, looking excellent and great attention to the smallest detail.

I would love a set of the decals, please PM me if they are available.

AJ

This thread is great with the commentaries. Great idea for a project too! Keep up the awsome progress dudes.

Wow this is so cool. Interesting livery. I like whats being done here, very awesome!!

Ooooooooooh!! :thinkerg: RED!!! I get it now (after the 10th time I've looked at this thread! I kept thinking, "WTF? That one's silver!")

:banghead: :lol2:

you two badasses...:icon16:

Whoa! I will DEFINETLY follow this!

Fantastic build!

I'd be very interested in getting a set of those decals too ...

Decal seem not bad, I can't say the same for the job of Pong :grinyes::lol::lol::lol::screwy:

Go Mr.Ping show us something wonderful :smooch:

I would have 1 sheet :icon16::icon16::icon16:

You guys are nuts... you know that, don't you? :screwy: :grinyes:

wow. seeing those great WIP pics sure woke me up in the middle of a sleepy workday in the office. :D

Excellent thread and very interesting subjects. I love the commentary also, kinda reminds me of someone......:naughty: Keep up the great work guys and will be following along for sure. Those decals are the cat's pajamas, as is the sublime paintjobs and masking work.

Hi guys,

welcome in AF.

Great project, great idea.

Have you seen the real 2 cars when they drove through your country - and maybe have some ref-pics??

Cool project! These will be one of a kind models you make there!

OK time for Mr. Ping to show he’s been doing something (nothing so fance as my friend, Mr. Posh Pong!!)

IMO this is a pretty good kit. It is full-engine, fairly well molded, there is minimal flash/mold lines and ejector pin marks have been well placed to be out of sight.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_profile_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_top_02.jpg

The only rather strange thing about the kit I have noticed so far are the wheels/rotors.

They are a strange “sandwich” design with the wheel in 2 halves and the rotor sandwiched between. My original plan was to replace these but I think that the results might not be too bad so I will be going with the stock parts.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_rotors_b_07.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_rotors_a_06.jpg


Here is a shot of the engines parts and a dry test fit.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_engine-bits_08.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/kit-body_eng-in-situ_b_10.jpg


I will not be modifying the body in any way but I decided to do something abort the little side indicators – the Revell „pips” will be too hard to point well ;)

I drilled out a little marker hole and then sanded off the pip. I have not decided yet how I will replace them – maybe clear sprue maybe pin head…?

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/side-indicator_01.jpg

An interesting part of painting the 612 is the headlight luster. They are to be painted in body colour as is the „stick” with the light bulb. These sticks are clear parts so I put a drop of maskol on the top to keep it clear during painting.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/body-colors_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/frontlight.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/body-colors_02.jpg


Body’s with color base coat

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/finish-paint-red-silv_01.jpg

and for fun ;)

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/chess-board_01.jpg

I have started to do some detailing and detail painting and have started to use the decals from our set. I have to say I’m mighty pleased and impressed with them J - the detail/resolution of the printing is very high and they go down really easily.

The calipers are painted with Tamiya gloss acrylic and some Ferrari decals applied (the set includes quite a few of these - in both white and black). Tamiya black acrylic wash applied.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/rotors-painted_01.jpg

Next was the engine head.

This was probably the most complicated part I have ever painted in my short modeling career. It took 4 colors, BMF, decals, detail painting and wash - and it is all molded in one piece. I did think about cutting it up beforehand, but fortunately I decided against it.

First of all the whole part was primed in white and then painted with Alclad White Alu.

I then applied BMF over the ribs on the cylinder head, masked off and airbrushed heavily thinned Tamiya Flat Red from a distance to get the rouch/crackeld effect.

Following this, I re-masked to paint the hoses from the air filters with Vallejo Black and finally re-masked yet again to paint the two I-don’t-know-what-they-are hoses at the front with a mix of Tamiya X-18 and a couple of drops of German Grey (this color mix came out perfectly IMHO).

After the painting, I used a chisel shaped toothpick to scrape the red paint off of the BMF to bring out the effect of ground down ribs.

I applied a metal transfer Cavallino from the Crazy Modeler set (I strongly recommend this set to Ferrari Fans!!)

“Ferrari” decals from my China set were placed to the air filter boxes. I had originally planned to apply P/E scripts before painting but I didn’t have anything suitable. In the final result though, I think the color of the decal is spot-on and the effect is fine with me. A china set data decal was also applied to the hose.

Finally acrylic black was was applied.

Reference picture:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/Engineref_01.jpg

My parts:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/engine-header--painted_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/engine-dry-fit_01.jpg

The engine bay surround (if I can call it that) was painted with a base of Tamiy semi-gloss black (X18). The front part was masked off and then painted with Alclad Aluminium. The two reservoir caps were masked off with maskol and detail painted.

Finally, another one of the data plates from the China set was applied as per reference photo.


http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/engine-bay-frame_01.jpg

Thank you!

Mr. Ping

Great job Ping, not so cool as Pong :D :D :D :smokin::evillol: but great, very clean engine details: can't wait to see more :D :licka:

Great job Ping, not so cool as Pong

True, but perhaps we could both learn something from Mr Ping's admirable dedication and excellent progress. :grinyes:

This kind of thread shows what modelling is.......fun!

Great work Mr.Ping and of course Mr.Pong.

this is a great thread! mr. ping and/or mr. pong... who makes that cool painting stand you used to hold the bodies and where can i get one?
:)

great work Mr.Ping & Pong~~~!you're so faster than me~~~~

this is a great thread! mr. ping and/or mr. pong... who makes that cool painting stand you used to hold the bodies and where can i get one?
:)
I that it's a Tamiya paint stand. I have one just like it - it is even just as dirty as Mr. Ping's :D

You can buy it easily for around 15$. It's a great tool and very much worth the money. You just need to make sure that you push the two parts WELL together otherwise you will be as pissed as I was when my freshly painted Dino dropped on the floor ;)

I that it's a Tamiya paint stand. I have one just like it - it is even just as dirty as Mr. Ping's :D

I would say the same but mine is clean now :D :D :D

cool

Fantastic work on that engine head, hard to believe its just one piece. The complete engine is a jewel. This is really gonna be neat!

Planning on producing those decals? im sure there are people that would be interested ! could at least earn u back something :P

Planning on producing those decals? im sure there are people that would be interested !
Anyone who is interested can contact me by PM


Small step forward.

The Scaglietti has two panels that cover the underside of the engine and the transmission. In the 1/1 I guess these are to improve aerodynamics and airflow under the car but in 1/24 the effect is to completely cover any detailing you do to them!

The panels themselves have quite a lot of bolts and rivets molded in which could be detail painted or p/e and or turned parts could be used.

The price of aftermarket turned rivets shriveled my chopsticks!
I decided to do some turned metal parts of my own. Don’t get too excited though, in this case “turned” just means that I “turned” on my Dremel motor tool.

Apart form my Dremel, I used my pin vice and a packet of around 50 sewing pins I picked up for $1.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_02.jpg



The under plate was drilled to accept the sewing pins

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_01.jpg



To hold the pin securely and safely during cutting with my Dremel I made a jig out of styrene sheet the approximate thickness of my target length of pin shaft. I drilled a hole in the middle to feed the pin through.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_03.jpg



A second disc was placed over the pin head to hold it in place and the sandwich was held together with pliers during cutting – secure and safe.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_04.jpg



Next stage was to trim the pin to length using my Dremel with a cutting disc. First I cut it more or less to length (I hope you like the pyrotechnics in the photography)…

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_05.jpg



… and then ground it down to the desired length.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_06.jpg


Useful/important tips at this stage:

The pin heats up very quickly from the friction and this heat in turn softens the plastic disc. Therefore I found it much better to apply the Dremel to the pin in short bursts so as to keep the temperature down and allow any heat to dissipate. also. I replaced the top, “holding” plastic disc with a piece of metal. This acted as a heat sink and greatly reduced the problem (but did not completely eliminate it).



With very little time and effort you should end up with a nice little pile of “turned” real metal rivets for under a dollar.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_07.jpg



In the last picture you can see the rivets in place on the under plate. They were fixed in place with a dab of thick CA glue from behind set quickly with dab of Zapper.
(BEWARE of using thin CA, I did first time round and glued my finger to the front of the piece and had to strip and repaint LOL)


http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/underplate_08.jpg

brilliant idea Ping!!;)pay attention to details like that and made great effect that's something i can't achieve.respect!!!

Haven't been able to model much lately but managed to finished painting the exhaust assembly.

Heat staining with Alclad2 Burnt Metal and Tamiya Clear Blue followed with wash of flat black.

Heat shielding is done with MFH self-adhesive heat shield. Very nice product but quite difficult to work with on complex shapes – it is quite thick and stiff and does not conform easily. However on simple shapes and bulkheads I am sure it will look very nice.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/stained-engine_03.jpg


http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/stained-engine-and-exhaust_.jpg

this is probadly the most interesting build i've ever seen!
welcome to the forum!

the whole Mr. Ping and Mr. Pong is great!
and the project is so professional, its too real to be true

im going to be constantly watching this thread!!!

The bottom panel sure looks good now. Thx for the idea of making those rivets.

Wow cool job Mr.Ping, great engine so far. Now push lazyPong to do something! :D LOFL ;)

:D LOFL ;)

whats that supose to mean?

laughing out floor loud... :screwy:

Gorgeous looking engine!

whats that supose to mean?

laughing out floor loud... :screwy:
I think you'll find it's a secret code :iceslolan

slow down Ping...slow down...you guys are too fast...- -||

I've managed I think to finish off the chassis, drive train and suspension sub-assemblies.

I wasn't too happy with the way the rotors came out when painted and so I covered them with BMF and then applied a liberal amount of oil paint wash.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/BMFed-rotors_01.jpg

The outer rims were painted with Alclad2 Aluminium and detailed with Cavalino decals from our China set (They went down smooth as cream with Micro Set and a touch of Micro Sol), the fillwe valves were detailed and a wash applied over all.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/detailed-rims_01.jpg

Here are the finished wheels. TBH, I am happy with how they turned (no pun intended) out.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/complete-rims_01.jpg


This is the completed drive train.

First shot is a bird's eye view from the top

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/drivetrsin_01.jpg

The second shot is form underneath (a worm’s eye view? ;) )

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/undertray_01.jpg


The undertray panels sadly cover a lot of detail :-[
Therefore, I'll bore you with a couple of shots now– that way the detail will be saved for posterity ;-)

Engine underside

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/front-drivetrain_01.jpg

Exhaust train….

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/exhaust-train_01.jpg

The rear drive train assembly…

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/rear-drivetrain_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/rear-drivetrain_02.jpg


A close-up of one of the rear mufflers. This was stained with Alclad2 Burnt Metal and washed with burnt senna oil paint.

I am very happy with how the alu tube exhaust tips came out – my best to date.

Silver is proving difficult for me to photograph and I couldn't really get a shot to show just how good this in fact looks!

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/rear-muffler_01.jpg


I did a test fit with the body

Everything went together well with all parts meeting pretty much as they should. I discovered a slight warp in the chassis but I managed to straighten it out by CA gluing the sub-assemblies in to stiffen it into shape.

Seems I still have a hood closing fit problem :-(

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/test-fit_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/test-fit_02.jpg


Here's the stance. I think it looks pretty OK but would appreciate your thoughts.

The China Scagliettis had slightly increased ride hight due to the terrain that they needed to traverse.

At first I was a bit mad about the size of the front wheels – they look too small. I found a lot of complaints on the internet about this aspect of the Revel kit but when I looked at my reference shots (not many in straight profile) IMHO the 1/1 looks pretty much the same i.e. the wheels look too small for the wheel arch. Maybe the Revel wheels are too small but I don't think there is much in it.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/front-stance_01.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/rear-stance_01.jpg


There is one thing that I still need to fix – the track of the rear wheels.

They stick out too far from the body. I will grind out the wheel axles from inside the wheel so that they fit a few mm closer.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y247/klutz100/WIPs/612%20China%20Tour/WIP/track-problem.jpg


Thanks for looking and I hope you are enjoying this. Next stop either the interior or decaling the body.....

:D

When you correct the wheel position, turn around the rear brakes, too! Revell made a mistake here! Take a look:
http://www.cavallino.cc/albums/album13/012_G.jpg

Thanks :thumbsup: - but too late :( :banghead:

I'll fix it on the silver one :D

W:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: W....can i post only some "wow"s?

Unbelievably interesting, inspiring and funny.
/Joel

nothing much to say with...
absolutely perfect build
great man

Puns and all, this wip is amazing. Extremely keen building skills.

Puns and all, this wip is amazing. Extremely keen building skills.

:iagree:

What an excellent thread! I'll be sure to watch the progress closely!

Never was fond of this car, but your build ups are making me like it alot more. Thanks and keep up the amazing work.

Mike.

Few days ago a forum's badass , mr. MPWR :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: :evillol: wrote in his S7 fabulous thread "try to convert this cheap $10 Tamy kit in an Enthusiast Model" or something similar :D, well my attempt to do it with the Revell thing:

real thing ref:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/refeng.jpg

BTW > Andy: you know, I follow ever your steps ;) :)

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/2stepg.jpg

close -up on the fuel-rai, something I ever loved ;D :lol::grinyes::wink:

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/2stepf.jpg

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/2steph.jpg

Injectors: since I've to do a dozen, it's supposed I'll learn to seam before :D


http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c159/gionc/2stepi.jpg

I guess Mr. Ping (shit I have 4 fault trying the log in as Ping ;) ) that you'll show soon who we are, or not Pinsky :popcorn::grinyes::naughty::smokin::evillol:

bye bye evelyone ;)

And you my friend are a dramatic exception to my usual PE rant. Spectacular set of parts there- :eek: looking forward to seeing them assembled! More parts = more fun, right? :grinyes: :rolleyes:

The mechanical links there at the front of the airbox adjust the throttle butterfly positions?

Spectacular- can't wait to see how it comes out.

:eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2:

miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnn********** LOFL

:eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: :eek2: !!