Civics Kick Ass

Originally posted by YogsVR4


Since when has "qualified" been a prerequisite for stating ones opinion ;) :)

Anyone is free to state thier opinion.
But an opinion is not a factual statement.

Im quite free to state my opinion on how to remove a brian tumor, but would you want to take it as advice?

if a muscule car is a heavy american car with lots of horse power well than you can say the U.S. still makes some. think of the new mercury(4000+ lbs) , impala ss (around 4000) , lincoln mark VIII (3900lbs).
I own a mark VIII and now it hase the same 4.6 twin cam as the mustang cobra. I have frends that only have $200 super chips in theres and get 14.4 in the1/4 and still can get 25 mpg. plus the factory and many mags clame .86-.87g's with its stock full indipendant suspension.
with out any mods im sure these cars would compare nicely with the old muscule and I know the can saprise most imports.so you can say muscule cars have come a long way.:) :)

For me, I LOVE the old Mopar musclecars, and I will own a Plymouth Barracuda one day. But it won't be a daily driver. In my own experience, the imports I have owned or had experience with were of vastly higher quality, reliability, and longevity than the domestics I've owned or had experience with. For a daily driver, that's important. I had a Honda, it was stock and older and SLOW, but reliable and economical. Good college car. I don't like the new Honda VTECs because I don't like to have to wind the crap out of my engine to get anything out of it. My personal preference is TORQUE, the lower the better, but a light, tight-handling car is also important to me. That and reliability and economy eliminates the Mustangs, Camaros, etc. The only Camaro I drove which handled really well was an 88 2.8, and it was a POS as far as quality. So I guess I wanted a high-quality Japanese car, that got acceptable mileage, handled well, and had decent low-end torque, and I could afford.

So I've found my own personal happy medium, though it wasn't easy to find, they are quite rare and I got hella-lucky to find one in my area. My 88 Nissan 200SX SE has the 3-liter out of the 300ZX, with better low-end torque than any 4-banger, but is lighter than the Z, is very reliable, gets mid-20's to the gallon (pushes 30 mpg on the highway). I think I'll keep it forever. As long as I don't take it up North to often, so it doesn't rust.

I think that everybody has to decide what properties of a car are important to them personally.

Originally posted by hondasuck
that's whack, civics are slow. i'm sorry but if you notice, when you look at mostly any "kill list" forum, they all say "too many civics to count." why, you ask? because they are like practice on the novice corse for street racing. all that aside, doesn't mercedes make the V-12 for the mclaren?

i think the V12 in the mclaren is from bmw.:bandit:

Originally posted by del


i think the V12 in the mclaren is from bmw.:bandit:


It is. :smoka:

Unless you put money into a Honda it will not beat a stock muscle car.And who cars about gas.It you have the money to buy a V8 then you can afford the gas.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
Unless you put money into a Honda it will not beat a stock muscle car.

Define a stock muscle car?
There are plenty of "muscle" cars my Civic will beat in both a straight line and around corners.
There more that it wont of course.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
Unless you put money into a Honda it will not beat a stock muscle car.And who cars about gas.It you have the money to buy a V8 then you can afford the gas.
A stock muscle car is more expensive in most case's to begin with. Modifying a cheaper car (in this case a honda) will prove to be more cost efficent. I do enjoy the hum of a V8, but i've grown quite acustom to the sound of a well tuned B18. (this is my car of choice) Other ppl may choose a muscle car, it vary's according to the preference of the individual. For instance I've found that a shorter stroke and a higher revolution serves my need for speed quite nicely. (4 grand 4gen CRX)

You know what a muscle car is...a Vette,Trans Am,Mustang,Hemis,etc.You Honda can beat those?Highly doubt it.a stock Honda will not beat a stock muscle car.I just hate it so much when people say stupid things like "my stock Honda Civic can beat your Vette anyday man."

True muscle cars are more expensive to start out with in general, but one you try to build a civic up to the speed and ability of the muscle car, you have just destroyed the driveability part it had over the muscle, and spent just as much if not more.

I have nothing against people building up civics and integras, but i don't think its fair to say "well, its better to mod an import than a domestic b/c you get more return". Guy around here has an internally stock '00 Z28 with a supercharger (running 8 or 9 pounds, can't remember) and dyno's 544rwhp. Either can be built to be fast, its where your tastes and abilities lie.

Imports ownz joo bonez.

Ya imports own...especially jetta's. Oh ya, i raced my friend's mod'd jetta a few months ago (i forgot what he has, but he has put some good money into it), and i can only count the space between us in buses. It wasn't from a stop (my torque would have given me an advantage there), it was from a roll so its not like there was much driver skill involved.

True muscle cars are more expensive to start out with in general, but one you try to build a civic up to the speed and ability of the muscle car, you have just destroyed the driveability part it had over the muscle, and spent just as much if not more.


If the stock muscle cost more that still don't matter.If some stupid 17 year old thinks that there Civic can beat a Trans Am,so be it.let them get beat.If you race a Civic with 10 grand in mods against a Trans Am,though the same amount of money was put into both,its still not a fair race.Know what Im saying?If you put 10 grand into both,then its a fair race,even though the Civic would be smoked,its still fair.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
You know what a muscle car is...a Vette,Trans Am,Mustang,Hemis,etc.You Honda can beat those?Highly doubt it.
yes it can. How far do you live from williamsport?

No they can't.Williamsport where?

Originally posted by -cy-
True muscle cars are more expensive to start out with in general, but one you try to build a civic up to the speed and ability of the muscle car, you have just destroyed the driveability part it had over the muscle, and spent just as much if not more.

I have nothing against people building up civics and integras, but i don't think its fair to say "well, its better to mod an import than a domestic b/c you get more return". Guy around here has an internally stock '00 Z28 with a supercharger (running 8 or 9 pounds, can't remember) and dyno's 544rwhp. Either can be built to be fast, its where your tastes and abilities lie.
Depends on your knowledge of the automotive being modified. For instance a b18c b16a or h22a just to name a few are built with the intention of withstanding a much higher cr(ductile), making it easy for a civic or any honda to handle much more boost/compression than most domestics. Furthermore the two engine designs are completely different domestic manufacturers have traditionally built engines with lots of torque, Japanese manufacturers build engines with less torque, but the ability to rev much higher. This typically means that honda's don't accelerate as quickly right off the line as their domestic counterparts, but they are able to accelerate for longer in the same gear -9,000 rpm redline vs. a 5,500 rpm redline for example. You see domestics use a longer stroke and a shorter bore, while imports use a shorter stroke and a larger bore. There is a drawback to a long stroke because the piston must travel a longer distance, there is a physical limit to how many RPM the engine can achieve. On the opposite end of the spectrum, an engine with a large bore and short stroke will produce less overall torque, but has the ability to reach much higher revolutions per minute, and subsequently more horsepower. As for the remark reffering to me as a 17 yr old, I'm 22 and a mechanical engineer.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
No they can't.Williamsport where?
you need to do some research. and PA.

There are Williamsport towns all over the country smart one.I don't need to do research on a place I will never visit.And yes,Im fairly close to there.Couple hours maybe.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
There are Williamsport towns all over the country smart one.I don't need to do research on a place I will never visit.And yes,Im fairly close to there.Couple hours maybe.
........ I meant research the vehicle............ I live on maple ave. which is a few blocks up the street from the college. Or just go to D-house and check out the X-board for location. (I can PM you with directions.)
PS- your location says sacramento ca.? you live near Pa.?

I used to live in Binghamton, New York.You live near State College?(PSU)?Let me know if you do.And a ctock Honda CANNOT beat a HEMI,Vette,Trans Am or Mustang.

Sure it can... Hybridsol's cars are stock by all means... Stock as they come... If you believe that then... well ... then you're an Idiot. hehe.

But, yeah his car can beat all those... and it has. His cars are so badass Honda Motor Corp. calls him up for ideas.

Dont believe me? Take a lil road trip up there find out. I garauntee you'll have fun!

And all thats coming from a diehard Domestic fan... If that doesnt mean something then I've no clue what does.

Originally posted by WakkaWu
I used to live in Binghamton, New York.You live near State College?(PSU)?Let me know if you do.And a ctock Honda CANNOT beat a HEMI,Vette,Trans Am or Mustang.
I never said it was stock...... I simply stated that it was (and is) more cost efficent for me to build a fast car using a honda. I was a student at main, and am now attending a branch campus (specified ecu design). My sister goes there to, were lion kids. :D But yea I have lots of friends there. Mostly around UT and the towers.

Originally posted by RedNeck383
Sure it can... Hybridsol's cars are stock


honest...... they are. ;)

PS- I don't want it to sound like I dislike domestics. I myself am obsessed with 60's stangs. Redneck has a kickass nova as well.:)

Sure it can... Hybridsol's cars are stock by all means... Stock as they come... If you believe that then... well ... then you're an Idiot. hehe.

But, yeah his car can beat all those... and it has. His cars are so badass Honda Motor Corp. calls him up for ideas.

Dont believe me? Take a lil road trip up there find out. I garauntee you'll have fun!

And all thats coming from a diehard Domestic fan... If that doesnt mean something then I've no clue what does.[QUOTE]


It is impossible for a stock Honda to beat a car with 405HP(Vette Z06).You are an idiot to belive that that is possible.1997 Honda Del Sol SI SOHC VTECH 1.6 Liter; 4 Cylinder; 127HP;5 Speed...thats a stock,127 HP against 405HP.Im probably making a bad choice here but Im going with the Vette that has 405HP:D







[QUOTE]I never said it was stock...... I simply stated that it was (and is) more cost efficent for me to build a fast car using a honda. I was a student at main, and am now attending a branch campus (specified ecu design). My sister goes there to, were lion kids. But yea I have lots of friends there. Mostly around UT and the towers.


You have a lot of friends and PSU?

I think what hybridsol is trying to point out to you is that most muscle cars are more expensive to begin with. like alot more expensive. In his case it is more "cost efficent" to buy a honda which is thousands of dollars less and modify it. Also wakkaWu hybridsol has DOHC over 300 hp delsol and his CRX beat a hemi cuda.

Originally posted by WakkaWu



You have a lot of friends and PSU?
:huh:
yea I have friends there.........(I think thats what your asking, but I already stated that?) Do you go to main?

Originally posted by Civicgurl
I think what hybridsol is trying to point out to you is that most muscle cars are more expensive to begin with. like alot more expensive. In his case it is more "cost efficent" to buy a honda
Bingo

Originally posted by F20C


Yes you could with aftermarket parts. However the main part of how car handles is the chassis. If you have a soft chassis doesn't matter how big anti-roll bar you put in the car still have it's limits for improvment. You need a solid chassis to work with or else you be down big time.

That is why they invented subframe connectors. But older muscle cars were never made for good handling since the public wanted straightline performance but it is hard to avoid that a 2003 Mustang Cobra with IRS does not have handling.

You are saying the Cobra with IRS has bad handling?

doh It did not come out right I meant to say that ford improving Even though it is run by a bunch of chickensh** old farts

doh It did not come out right I meant to say that ford improving Even though it is run by a bunch of chickensh** old farts

doh It did not come out right I meant to say that ford improving Even though it is run by a bunch of chickensh** old farts

most interestingly stupid argument ever... i really think we need to divide import apart though into japanese and european. kuz they are really different. there are cars from all markets i would choose but on the whole id say that german interiors are the nicest jbl.

-GTi-VR6_A3

I think what hybridsol is trying to point out to you is that most muscle cars are more expensive to begin with. like alot more expensive. In his case it is more "cost efficent" to buy a honda which is thousands of dollars less and modify it. Also wakkaWu hybridsol has DOHC over 300 hp delsol and his CRX beat a hemi cuda.


Yes I know he's trying to say that but if your willing to race a stock car that cost thousands more and that is faster with your car then go ahead.But what Im saying it is not a fair race to put 10 grand into the Honda a leave the muscle car the same.Stock Honda and stock Vette is fair.Honda with 10 G put into it and Vette with 10 G put into it,fair race.Stock Vette and Honda with 10 G put onto it,not a fair race.
HIs DelSol has got to be modified some then because before I posted my last post I looked up how much HP they had and I had seen 127HP.His CRX is not stock because is impossible to beat a Hemi Cuda with a stock CRX.

Originally posted by WakkaWu



Yes I know he's trying to say that but if your willing to race a stock car that cost thousands more and that is faster with your car then go ahead.But what Im saying it is not a fair race to put 10 grand into the Honda a leave the muscle car the same.Stock Honda and stock Vette is fair.Honda with 10 G put into it and Vette with 10 G put into it,fair race.Stock Vette and Honda with 10 G put onto it,not a fair race.
HIs DelSol has got to be modified some then because before I posted my last post I looked up how much HP they had and I had seen 127HP.His CRX is not stock because is impossible to beat a Hemi Cuda with a stock CRX.


Well Gee Golly... Im glad you just now realised that his car's are not stock.

And to be fair, the Hemi Hybridsol beat was not stock either. It was a Cuda with extensive modifications for Drag racing. Roll cage, Slicks... motor that made 6 bajillion horsepower. So, it according to you... it was a Fair race.

Hybrid won, fair and square. Ask HemiGeorge the own of the worlds cleanest Cuda. He'll admit he didnt win, he's cool as hell.

Gah... Lunch time. Im done babbling for now.:D

Originally posted by RedNeck383



Well Gee Golly... Im glad you just now realised that his car's are not stock.

And to be fair, the Hemi Hybridsol beat was not stock either. It was a Cuda with extensive modifications for Drag racing. Roll cage, Slicks... motor that made 6 bajillion horsepower. So, it according to you... it was a Fair race.

Hybrid won, fair and square. Ask HemiGeorge the own of the worlds cleanest Cuda. He'll admit he didnt win, he's cool as hell.

Gah... Lunch time. Im done babbling for now.:D


damn i hate being up on renecks jock like this but mayn he OWNED J00. all with the facts and no hearsay... hahah jp man you should check out the story about that race though its a kool read.

-GTi-VR6_A3

Originally posted by WakkaWu

Yes I know he's trying to say that but if your willing to race a stock car that cost thousands more and that is faster with your car then go ahead.But what Im saying it is not a fair race to put 10 grand into the Honda a leave the muscle car the same.Stock Honda and stock Vette is fair.Honda with 10 G put into it and Vette with 10 G put into it,fair race.Stock Vette and Honda with 10 G put onto it,not a fair race.
HIs DelSol has got to be modified some then because before I posted my last post I looked up how much HP they had and I had seen 127HP.His CRX is not stock because is impossible to beat a Hemi Cuda with a stock CRX.


I'd like state in defense for the [H] owners, stock vs stock still isnt fair. Allow me to explain.

A Stock
98 Z28 Camaro = 13.7
99 Civic Si = 15.7

To me thats still not fair, obviously the Z28 has the advantage. You'd need to dump some Green into the Civic to match the Z28s capabilities. Then it would be an even match. Given equal performing cars.. it would be up to the drivers who won.

Now, of course if the Z28 was given the same budget the Civic was for performance upgrades. Then by all means the Z28 would just kick the Civic upside the ear and insult it by telling 'yo momma' jokes. (Hypothetically speaking of course)

So as you may or may not see... stock vs stock usually isnt a fair comparison between two cars that aren't in the same class.

Hope I didnt offend any Honda owners.:p

Originally posted by WakkaWu



Yes I know he's trying to say that but if your willing to race a stock car that cost thousands more and that is faster with your car then go ahead.But what Im saying it is not a fair race to put 10 grand into the Honda a leave the muscle car the same.Stock Honda and stock Vette is fair.Honda with 10 G put into it and Vette with 10 G put into it,fair race.Stock Vette and Honda with 10 G put onto it,not a fair race.
HIs DelSol has got to be modified some then because before I posted my last post I looked up how much HP they had and I had seen 127HP.His CRX is not stock because is impossible to beat a Hemi Cuda with a stock CRX.

there are 3 fair comparisons. same car, same class, or same price that is it. stock shevy vs stock civic is soo not a fair race. 30k vette vs 30k civic thats fair although i would guess the vette would still win but man you have really gotta think your posts though first or at least make some edits soon.

-GTi-VR6_A3

Here is the thing, a new civic and a new (stripper) Z28 aren't that far from eachother price-wise as some people would have you think. The corvette has an LS1 and costs like 30-40k. Then there is the f-body, which has an LS1 and can be found for nearly $20-21k new for a stripper Z28 (no leather, etc). I got my firebird with all the options, used, for around $15,000 (was in really good shape too).

Anyways, once you mod a car all bets are off. Will a mod'd civic beat a stock Z06? Well, yes if he has done enough of the right mods. Once you mod a car, you can't compare the stock vs. stock anymore. You can only really compare specific cases, like exact cars with exact mods and drivers.

Originally posted by -cy-
Here is the thing, a new civic and a new (stripper) Z28 aren't that far from eachother price-wise as some people would have you think. The corvette has an LS1 and costs like 30-40k. Then there is the f-body, which has an LS1 and can be found for nearly $20-21k new for a stripper Z28 (no leather, etc). I got my firebird with all the options, used, for around $15,000 (was in really good shape too).

I'm still failing to see your point? Are you aware that a 2003 base model, or (stripped) as you referred to it as Civic Coupe is 11 grand? My friends and I built with 4 grand, a CRX capable of outstanding quarter mile times. Just imagine what people could do, with that kind of money left over by purchasing a civic (with knowledge of the 7th gen of course). All I was saying, is that I am able to make a honda faster than a muscle car with limited funds.
PS- the 2003 corvette runs from 44-51 grand.

Originally posted by WakkaWu


HIs DelSol has got to be modified some then because before I posted my last post I looked up how much HP they had and I had seen 127HP.
they make many del sol models = (b16a3 is 158 hp) (straight b16a from japan is 168 hp) then there's the base models. but my sol has a motor swap.

Originally posted by hybridsol

they make many del sol models = (b16a3 is 158 hp) (straight b16a from japan is 168 hp) then there's the base models. but my sol has a motor swap.

i wonder if anyone ever looks at you signature...? i mean it kinda hints performance...ack people

-GTi-VR6_A3

Originally posted by GTi-VR6_A3


i wonder if anyone ever looks at you signature...? i mean it kinda hints performance...ack people

-GTi-VR6_A3
I think your one of the few ppl that did. lol :D

All I see is custom Turbo Piping.. and Intercooler... thats perfectly stock.

Straight from the factory right?

11K for a civic...never heard of that. I have a friend who bought a brand new civic, but got a good deal on it...wasn't 11K.

Originally posted by RedNeck383
All I see is custom Turbo Piping.. and Intercooler... thats perfectly stock.

Straight from the factory right?

man everytime i read one of your posts man. all you say is stupid stuff. i heard your sarcasm in that last one so im gunna tell you now. according to GT3 honda civic's ARE factory bread racecars. duh i mean look at the game once in your life. all that stuff in his car is totally stock man. i swear redneck you give af a bad name

-GTi-VR6_A3

What was I thinking? Video Games have all the correct answers of course!...


Sorry... I do give AF a bad name.. look at me Im just a Redneck... What do I know?:D

Quoting facts from a video game is pretty silly, its not exactly a reliable source.

However there are plenty of thrack bred Honda's sold in Japan and Europe.
There have been weekend race ready versions of the Civic since the RS version of the 1st gen in the early 70s.
My car is a classic example, the orginal SiR was produced as a week end race car.
The Type R civic and Integra including the new 7th gen Type R Civic were designed with track use in mind, and the most famous of Honda track bred cars.

Unforunatly the US only got a fat over weight version of the Type R Integra. It is the only track bred Honda sold in the US.

Originally posted by Moppie
Quoting facts from a video game is pretty silly, its not exactly a reliable source.

However there are plenty of thrack bred Honda's sold in Japan and Europe.
There have been weekend race ready versions of the Civic since the RS version of the 1st gen in the early 70s.
My car is a classic example, the orginal SiR was produced as a week end race car.
The Type R civic and Integra including the new 7th gen Type R Civic were designed with track use in mind, and the most famous of Honda track bred cars.

Unforunatly the US only got a fat over weight version of the Type R Integra. It is the only track bred Honda sold in the US.

moppie dude. right as always but me and redneck are just going for a run of being assholes we know all this stuff already but i guess its good just incase some noob strolls along and reads this

-GTi-VR6_A3

Originally posted by Moppie


Unforunatly the US only got a fat over weight version of the Type R Integra. It is the only track bred Honda sold in the US.
what?????? what about the NSX or the civic si or how bout the gsr integra? Not to mention the rsx type-s, but now that I think about it they always keep the best stuff in japan........:(

Originally posted by hybridsol
but now that I think about it they always keep the best stuff in japan........:(

I was just about to justify what i said, but I guess you got it. :)

Originally posted by Moppie


I was just about to justify what i said, but I guess you got it. :)
sorry moppie should have waited a few min.:) didint mean to jump on your back.

in my opinion civics are just slow... i have seen a few tricked out ones but i still beat the shit out of them. me and my dad both race alot around the city and neither have ever lost to a civic. he drives a 1994 formula firebird and i have a 1993 dodge stealth. now i know there are some civics somewhere in the world that would beat me easily but like moppie said they keep that stuff in japan

Please read this (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=162405) and do not resurect ancient threads.


Welcome to af btw.