This is what happens when you don't think.

[taranaki]

DMC has launched a sustained and vitriolic attack on the concept of speed controls.I feel that the other side of the argument needs to be put clearly and at length.

My most poignant memory of the danger of speed was the one that sticks in my mind...I was following a car on a rural road,in the rain,at 'open road' speed.....viz,5mph faster than the limit.

The weather deteriorated ,and I cut my speed considerably,as I could barely see the car ahead.He disappeared into the sheets of rain...and in a few seconds died a most awful death.

At the speed that he was travelling,he would not have seen,let alone had time to react to, the loose stones on the road that the weather had washed down the dirt driveway on the apex of the bend.I'd guess that he was still travelling at about 60mph when he slid on the mess, overcorrected and ploughed into the oncoming semi-transporter....

I slid to a stop on the wet gravel....the scene of carnage blocking the road is etched on my memory forever.The transporter truck laid in the drain,it's driver having swerved in a futile attempt to avoid the car in his path...the front axle of the semi lay naked in the middle of the road,the wheel neatly sheared from one end.The box truck that had been the transporter's cargo had broken from its moorings, slid up the trailer deck and fallen onto its side beside the crippled tractor unit.

The dead man's car had imploded into a small cube on impact,its engine and gear box tossed down the road like a child's toy.There could be no doubt that the driver was killed instantly,and I decided that there was nothing that I could do to help him.Iquickly turned my car around,picking my way through the jungle of sharp and broken debris.

I spent the next half hour standing in the middle of the road in the pouring rain,crying as I waved down every car tha approached the bend.Several were going just as fast,it seemed,as the dead man.Thankfully,only one person died on that day.It could so easily have been more.The fire crew and police arrived in due course and set up a detour while they cleared the road.The ambulance was of little use except to carry off a deeply shocked truck driver.

The only good thing that came of this collision was that it etched forever on my mind that the speed limit is a guide only.It is not there to generate revenue,to guarrantee your safety, or as a benchmark for all traffic.Sometimes you live or die by the pressure of your foot on the gas pedal.

[boingo82]

Nicely put, and sorry to hear the story. I think everyone needs to remember that a speed limit is not a recommended speed, but a limit, a maximum, and shouldn't be treated as a minimum like it so often is today. My uncle perished in the first rain of the season, as the oil deposited by a summer's worth of cars had floated to the surface and handling the car was impossible. Speed needs to be adjusted for conditions, even if you're the only driver on the road doing so.

[Oz]

Very apt and timely. Something I need to be reminded of frequently. A good onya to Mr T.

[Melt]

True, a sad story and a good lesson. But you must take into account the WEATHER condition which you pointed out.

I slow down in the rain, as do a lot of other people. But DMC12 is talking about wide open conditions, dead straight road, nice sunny day.

[tazdev]

but there are soo many people out there that don't slow down and drive to the conditions and these people are the ones that put the rest of us in danger

[TerminalVelocity]

its not somuch just the limits, but the people abusing them. If everyone always drives 90 on a 75 and there are low accident rates, maby make that the limit?

[Steel]

yes but, people that tend go go 90, go 90 no matter if its raining or sleeting or what. I go fast on clear sunny days. I dont in rain. I've already rearended someone TWICE in the same part of the city for driving to fast in the rain (plus my ABS didnt work, but that's no excuse) So don't tell me that water on the road isnt really THAT slippery, becasue, yes it is. Speed limits aren't around for people to break, And i don't want to hear you cry and whine if you get caught doing 95 in a 65. It isnt your RIGHT to break the speed limit, nor is it even a PRIVILEGE. its everyone elses RIGHT to be safe!

And how fast were you going in order for the cops to nail you that hard? because if i hear that you were doing 140 on a highway, i will have no sympathy at all.

[DantesInferno]

Good topic, Taranaki. I know that speed guides in California are very rarely followed, and those who do follow them seem to be put at a greater risk than those who don't. Recently on the East Coast, I had a friend who was nearly arrested for excessive speeds. He was doing 125, racing a friend of his. When the police pulled him over, the officer was further enraged to see that he had his racing harnesses on. He was placed into the police car and strapped in, but then, through a moment of mercy, or a great deal of smooth talking, he was given the option of an arrest and court, or a very expensive ticket. Of course, he opted for the ticket. He realizes that he endangers not only his life, but others on the road, but I highly doubt this experience will curb his activities. He seems to have become more and more reckless in the recent months.

It's unfortunate that so many have to pay for another's lack of respect for the rules of the road.

[TerminalVelocity]

I never said water isnt wet, I dive around 40 on the freeway when its wet, and thats when i'm in a hurry. I have people pass me at 90+.

When I had car troubble and had to drive slightly below the limit, I was almost killed several times. Maby where you are the freeways are safe to drive the limit, here, they litterally arnt. Where DMC12 got his ticket there was no need to speed, but it was just an empty highway. To go riping through there dosent have any harm other than to himself.

To go speeding on mountain passes, thats just foolish, that defentally causes problems

[darkness]

The thing that pissed me off about DMC's comment wasn't the fact that he was speeding, and I agree that is stupid, but the fact he called the cops jerks or whatever for giving him a ticket. Yet he was knowingly speeding. It doesn't matter wether he was on a lonely stretch of freeway or a busy city street, speeding is speeding.

The roads here in New Zealand are pretty shocking. The main motorway through the city of Auckland is smaller than many city streets in Los Angeles, 2 lanes either side thats it. And the main highway between cities is a 2 lane country road most of the way. And as like the rest of the world, people do not drive to conditions here. And on a 2 lane country road, that will kill you really quick.

I have no sympathy for people who do stupid stuff on the road, knowlingly breaking the law. I only feel sorry for the innocent people that end up on the receiving end of the stupidity.

[carnut]

It's very unfortunate that you had to be a witness to such carnage. I've seen some pretty horrible accidents here in California. I guess my post to the "Stupidity" thread just a few minutes ago could have easily been for this thread.

LET'S BE CAREFUL OUT THERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111

[DMC12]

Originally posted by taranaki
Several were going just as fast,it seemed,as the dead man.Thankfully,only one person died on that day.It could so easily have been more.

I'm sorry to hear that you had to be involved in the aftermath of such stupidity. This just goes to show you that you should drive according to the prevailing conditions. When it is pouring rain... SLOW DOWN a little, but not so much that people begin to plow into the back of your car.

[taranaki]

Originally posted by DMC12


When it is pouring rain... SLOW DOWN a little, but not so much that people begin to plow into the back of your car.

CRAP.UTTER CRAP.



I will slow down until I believe that I am in full control of my vehicle.It is my responsibility to maintain control of my own vehicle and avoid hitting the vehicle IN FRONT.

This is a fundamental principle of traffic law the world over.Until you can get that into your head,I suggest you hand in your car keys to somebody with a bit more maturity.

[Ssom]

all of you but DMC12 make very good points, I like Mr T have seen stupidity on the road lead to death on the Desert Road way back in 1995 and to make it worse, I was an impressionable 9 year old, so no doubt it took a lot to get over witnessing the carnage of looking at the blood-soaked Ford Escort that was 4 cars ahead, it turned out two cars collided at 130 kph and killed two of the occupants, sparking a chain reaction of 4 other cars, which had slowed down considerably from about 100-110 k's reducing the carnage..............

I have no problem turning the open road into my Grand Prix track, but road condition, traffic and weather must take first priority before even pushing beyond 100 ie. If there is a wide one-laned straight road with no traffic and the road was bone-dry I would quite happily make best-advantage of every last one of my 90 horses........

Remember........

THE FASTER YOU GO THE BIGGER THE MESS

[TerminalVelocity]

taranaki...I have seen you to be a mature and well versed individual here in AF, and this is the first time I have ever see you attack anyone. This has gone from argument to blatent attack. He means not just slaming onto your brakes...he knows slowing down enough not to hit the person ahead of him. I have seen hundreds of drivers, and DMC12 is one of the safest, most cuterious drivers I have ever seen. He also is one of the calmest under pressure of bad situations there is. He helped in part teach me how to handle the road, and I have taught many many others. My only accident was -being hit- not hitting. This was from someone driving when they cant see and -SPEEDING- so I do know the affects ofit. But this person couldnt see my car RIGHT INFONT OF THEM. This is part of his point, speed limits are designed for people who cant handle the road above it. This man saw a green light, and slamed onto his gas as he was aproaching, I was already mid turn, he was goingprobally 80 in a 40. Knocked my trans am through an intersection, I had timetoslam on my breaks and stop and try to swerve so my friend wouldnt die in the passenger seat...he didnt even tap his brakes till the end. This person shouldnt even have a licence, and should have been driving the speedlimit. Now going 100 through well populated areas and such isnt right, but through an area completly dry, on a large streach of road,with nothing but sand arond you, and no ther cars for large distances...75 limit going about 90 dosent sound wrong when the only other car is a hiding cruser.