Where does coolant go?

[czgu]

I have a 2000 Pontiac Montana. About a month ago, it displayed "Low coolant level", so I added more coolant. Now this signal displays again. I checked my garage, I don't see any coolant leak. Where does the coolant go?

[czgu]

OK, I got it -- INTAKE MANIFOLD GASKETS leaky!! I called Pontiac, told them the problem, they called the dealer. I call dealer and ask them what is going on now. They told me that is intake gasket leak, and that problem is covered by warrenty (my original warrenty has expired 1.5 years ago and didn't buy any other warrenty). That warrenty is from the dealer not from Pontiac, I was told. But the manager also said that Pontiac called them and OK to fixed my van. So I think that the dealer and Pontiac has a deal on fixing that common problem. Pontiac don't want to say they give the warrenty, (otherwise they have to recall), but they DO have to pay to the dealer. I was told that fixing the problem will cost me about $790.00, but I only need to pay $100 deductable (which I think is a good deal for me). I suggest that if anyone has same problem, send the car to your original dealer, then call Pontiac. You should get warrenty on INTAKE MANIFOLD GASKET.

[chatty]

Thank you, Thank you, Bingo, I happened upon your post, brought my van in to dealer. Same exact thing. Thank you for arming me with the info. You saved me $700.00!!! I only had to pay the $100 and they also fixed my blower resister which I learned from this forum. I did not know what we were gonna do. Thank you so much.!

[jguckiean]

Hey czgu,
I thought I had a bad thermostat, so I replaced it. Five hours later, after it was all back together, I tested to see if the heat was working again. It wasn't. I thought that the selenoid had gone bad or something, so I did some searching on this site and came across a boat load of information. So last night I went home and took the radiator cap off and my worst fear came true. Brown gunk inside the radiator. We are going on a trip this weekend and I needed it temporarily fixed, so I took it to a repair shop to have it chemically flushed. I then went to the dealer and made an appointment for when we get back to have the intake gasket replaced. I told them I knew about the "quiet" warranty that I read about in this thread, provided by Pontiac. He said that he has never heard about it. He then asked how many miles are on the van, I said 54K or so. He said that even if there was a warranty, the milage is too high. I think they are BSing. Do you know the specifics about the warranty from Pontiac? That I way I am armed to the teeth if I have to fight it. Thanks!

[chatty]

[jguckiean] When I arm myself with info. I dont really tell my dealer right off the bat what I know, they will say "you cant believe what you hear yadayada... I also have 54,000miles on my van. I just said "My dh noticed the low coolant light was on and I heard from others who have this van there has been problems with manifold gasket leaking and we have not seen any antifreeze dripping out anywhere, with this vehicle and I want to make sure thats not it especially internally so I dont ruin my engine. " I didnt let them know about the $100. I tell my dealer all the different problems. My dealer called me and sure enough yes, gasket needs replaced. However they said for sure it was leaking externally a bit but also said they could not rule out an internal leak. (what a surprise) They said it doesnt matter either way it needs replaced. They did not flush it just emptied most and refilled with dexcool which they said only use that. Then they told me the price $790.00!!!! Same as the other posts were talking about. I called the main Pontiac told them there is no way I can pay for that and I heard there has been many problems with this. Pontiac and Dealer called each other and called me with the news of "OK we will replace the manifold intake for a $100.00 deductable and they replaced my blower resister! (my blower motor for heater/ac only worked on high) I ended up after repair bringing it back because engine light was on they said code p0440 evap. I left gas cap off. Well under the paper I saw it written that purgeline was loose on purge valve!! That is what was written word for word that I was not suppose to see. Obviously the repairman fault I didnt have to pay but they just dont admit when they do things wrong they like to blame customers for trouble. Sometimes you have to keep fighting nicely because they will do what they can get away with. The squeaky wheel gets the oil. good luck. Make sure to read the other posts about this.

[dtweeter]

Originally Posted by chatty

[jguckiean] When I arm myself with info. I dont really tell my dealer right off the bat what I know, they will say "you cant believe what you hear yadayada... I also have 54,000miles on my van. I just said "My dh noticed the low coolant light was on and I heard from others who have this van there has been problems with manifold gasket leaking and we have not seen any antifreeze dripping out anywhere, with this vehicle and I want to make sure thats not it especially internally so I dont ruin my engine. " I didnt let them know about the $100. I tell my dealer all the different problems. My dealer called me and sure enough yes, gasket needs replaced. However they said for sure it was leaking externally a bit but also said they could not rule out an internal leak. (what a surprise) They said it doesnt matter either way it needs replaced. They did not flush it just emptied most and refilled with dexcool which they said only use that. Then they told me the price $790.00!!!! Same as the other posts were talking about. I called the main Pontiac told them there is no way I can pay for that and I heard there has been many problems with this. Pontiac and Dealer called each other and called me with the news of "OK we will replace the manifold intake for a $100.00 deductable and they replaced my blower resister! (my blower motor for heater/ac only worked on high) I ended up after repair bringing it back because engine light was on they said code p0440 evap. I left gas cap off. Well under the paper I saw it written that purgeline was loose on purge valve!! That is what was written word for word that I was not suppose to see. Obviously the repairman fault I didnt have to pay but they just dont admit when they do things wrong they like to blame customers for trouble. Sometimes you have to keep fighting nicely because they will do what they can get away with. The squeaky wheel gets the oil. good luck. Make sure to read the other posts about this.

We have also replaced the intake manifold gasket on our 2000 Montana at 60,000 miles. Two of my uncles and four cousins have also replaced them at around 60,000. We also have several friends with the same problem. GM knows this is a problem but there has not been a recall because it is not a "safety" issue. We were given a toll free number to call. 1-800-762-2737. Customer Service number is 1-800-222-1020 . In Regards to Document ID#1396678 (10/24/2003)Corporate Bulletin. It affects several makes and models which have the 3.1L or 3.4L engine. The Montanas affected according to this document are the 1999-2003.My family has paid between $400 and $800. If not caught soon enough, it can go into the oil and cost you about $2000.

[fishhead65]

I just had this problem on my 2000 Montana. Called Pontiac /GM customer service with no success. Costing me ~$1000 for the fix. The Customer service rep said "This is not a common problem" and "i can't find any documentation on this problem" Either she was BSing me or is being told to say that. Not to metion there is a GM service Bulletin dated March 2003 (#03-06010-010) describing this gasket problem and how to fix it! I heard there is a Class Action suit filed against GM to pay for this bad Gasket.

I guess I'll try the number posted by dtweeter, (1-800-762-2737)

Chatty... Any luck with this number?

[kpn]

My 2000 went at 50k. I had the extended warranty, so cost wasn't an issue with me. I would call any 1-800 numbers you could and even demand to speak with a regional/district manager if you can't get anywhere, because it is quite obvious a poor design. The most you will be out is a little time. Good Luck.

Keith

[Jack4161]

Originally Posted by chatty

[jguckiean] I ended up after repair bringing it back because engine light was on they said code p0440 evap. I left gas cap off. Well under the paper I saw it written that purgeline was loose on purge valve!! That is what was written word for word that I was not suppose to see. Obviously the repairman fault I didnt have to pay but they just dont admit when they do things wrong they like to blame customers for trouble. Sometimes you have to keep fighting nicely because they will do what they can get away with. The squeaky wheel gets the oil. good luck.

Don't always trust the dealer. Saw a Pontiac dealer mechanic broken down at the Stop and Go market while test driving a customers car. Asked if I could help him. He told me he had done the intake manifold repair and likely did not tighten something. He elected to fill the expansion tank with water and drive it back to the dealer. First water does not go from the expansion tank into the system when the system is still hot or in an overheat condition but he took off speeding down the road for 2 miles (steam coming out so badly that you could not see the vehicle at all from behind). I suspect he could have done enough damage to the heads and likely the customer will be told they should have brought the car in earlier before they (the customer) damaged the engine. My

[Samw115]

Hi,I just wanted to post a thank you on here for the info on the Intake Gasket problem. Took my 2002 Montana V6 in for std 3000 Mile maint. Dealer called me said the intake valve was leaking coolent, needed to fix or it would get worse and cause damage. Cost of $720. The dealer did say the gasket was poorly designed and the new re-designed one was fine, I asked about a re-call, he said no re-call was issued. I then did a google on this and found this forum. After calling Pontiac they said they would call the dealer and check into my maint records. They asked what I wanted them to do, I said well most stuff I read said it was fixed and the customer paid a $100 deductable. They called back the same day and agreed to splite the repair 50/50 at the warranty rate of $445.00. So instead of costing me 720 this will cost me 222.50, not as good as what I asked for - but a lot better then 720. The only other pblm we had with our Montana, was a few months after we got the van it kept blowing fuses, and you would replace the fuse and it would blow again (on the starter circuit). This was a chaffed wire that was shorting to the frame. So besides these 2 pbms we had no other major issues (knock wood) only routine maint and it runs pretty good. It's an 2002 with about 56K miles. Once again thanks for the info. Saved me $500 !!!

[chatty]

Good for you!! Isn't it great to save some money! Yes, I am thankful to this forum too. Its great!

[Samw115]

Ok, got another question on 02 Montana. I just go my van back from the dealer who replaced the intake Valve Gasket. Went to try the AC this weekend and nothing but hot/warm air is blown out. Worked fine the last time we used it (not sure when) could this have anything to do with the dealer not hooking things back up after doing the gasket ?

I am hoping the this is something simple that the dealer forgot to do, or something the dealer did that they will be honest and fix.

Any suggestions on what this could be ?

Thanks

[GregA]

It could be something they did, maybe not.

I would take it back there and see what they say.

I had a problem with a crack near one of the mounting brackets in my 2001. There is a tech bulletin on it and it had to be replaced. You can see pictures of it at the link below.

Chevy Venture Air Conditioner Condenser

Let us know what happens.

Take Care,

[Samw115]

Greg, your right on the money there. That is what mine is, a cracked bracket on the AC condensor. The service manager told us this was a common problem on Venture, Aztak and Rondevues (sp?).

The service manager said cost from him would be around 700 or so, he offered me the same deal on this as on my intake valve gasket (50/50 on the dealer to GM warranty repair charge) That comes down to about 300 out of my pocket. The servicer manager suggested that I call GM to see if I could get a better deal. So I did, so far no word back yet.

So this oil change has cost me the following.

225 for Intake Valve Gasket (after 50/50 deal)
175 for new front brakes and re-surfacing of disc (Reg wear/tear)
165 for new rear brake calapiers (leaking fluid)
Now 300 for AC Condensor.

The service manager said both these major problems are common. I asked if there are any other "common" problems with this van. I am almost thinking about getting rid of it, but don't want to start making payments again, and this thing is only 4 years old with 57K. I really expected to get 10 years out of it.

I guess I should not complain since GM is covering part of this and the van is out of warranty, and this is just a fact of owning a car, but come on all these problems on a regularly maintained newer vehicle. No wonder GM is loosing market share and edging near bankruptcy.

[GregA]

If that $300 include EVERYTHING (Parts, labor, recharge), I would say "Go for it." Mine was about $700 total.

As for getting rid of it: If you like the van, I say hang on to it. It sounds like you have found a rare dealer (one that treats you right). You put $865 into it and MAY have the major bugs worked out now. Plus, you now know about this forum to get help if you need it

Let us know how it works out.

Take Care,