Is The Tide Turning For American Sport Compact Cars?

[CHRIS/SR/SE]

So Theres The Question, Is The Srt4, Saturn Ion Red Line And Other American Sport Compact Cars Going To Be Sucsessful In This Market, Or Are The Japeneese And Europeans Still Dominating This Catogory In Sales And Performance?

[Polygon]

It is hard to tell. Chrysler made cars like the SRT-4 back in the late 70s to the mid 90s. They weren't a huge hit then and I don't understand why. Though I hear that they are going to have a Evo coupe with the SRT-4 drive-train. These are just rumors though.

[YogsVR4]

If they can stay price competative and keep the quality steady, they'll move more and more into the market. It won't be overnight, but it'll happen.

[CHRIS/SR/SE]

What I Am Looking For Is Specifics Is The Srt & Red Line Going To Find The Same Kind Of Croud As Imports, We All Know That With The Exception Od The Ford Svt It Has Not Been Able To.

[MioCLK]

The SRT-4 is really a big surprise to the auto industry.
No one had ever thought of a 14 sec Neon would actually be available, and sold at abuot twenty thousand dollars, with full warranty.
But besides the performance, Dodge also needs to work on the reliability issues, which is the advantage which Honda and Toyota owns.
Also, fuel consumption is another issue.
One might say fuel consumption shouldn't matter with sports cars, but the SRT 4 is still considered as an "economy car" with its price.
In this category, besides performance, both reliability and fuel consumptions are still big issues.
Even though the EPA had estimated a 30mpg on the highway, but from the information I got from the SRT 4 owners, thats something nearly impossible to achieve.
Most of the owners had told me they get around 20-22mpg on average, mixed of city and highway dirving.

[Polygon]

Originally Posted by MioCLK

The SRT-4 is really a big surprise to the auto industry.
No one had ever thought of a 14 sec Neon would actually be available, and sold at abuot twenty thousand dollars, with full warranty.
But besides the performance, Dodge also needs to work on the reliability issues, which is the advantage which Honda and Toyota owns.
Also, fuel consumption is another issue.
One might say fuel consumption shouldn't matter with sports cars, but the SRT 4 is still considered as an "economy car" with its price.
In this category, besides performance, both reliability and fuel consumptions are still big issues.
Even though the EPA had estimated a 30mpg on the highway, but from the information I got from the SRT 4 owners, thats something nearly impossible to achieve.
Most of the owners had told me they get around 20-22mpg on average, mixed of city and highway dirving.

1. What reliability issues? Dodge had some minor issues with some transmissions in the mid 90s and now they are crap? There is also no head gasket problem since this a different engine.

2. They must be on the throttle a lot then. My LeBaron GTC, which has a 2.2L I4 and a Garrett T03 pushing 13PSI, and I still got an average of over 32MPG combined city and highway. I don't see how the SRT-4 would be vastly different. Also, when buying performance cars, most people aren't looking for economy.

[syr74]

Dodge needs to expand it's SRT line more IMO to attract the attention and diversity of customers SVT has. The SRT4 Neon is great as are the new Viper powered Ram and the Viper itself, however, Dodge needs something in the mid-range to compete with cars like the SVT Mustang Cobra.

They have both the high end and low end markets covered, now they need something for people who aren't rolling in it or just out of high-school. And, I would be very surprised if Dodge doesn't do just that in relatively short order.

Also, there is a learning curve to things like this. Ford learned a hard lesson with the SVT Focus IMO. The car handles great and feels a lot more expensive than it is, but Ford took the approach of "build a great car for the money and if hp is a little short they will forgive you"...Ford was wrong. It is almost like they built a great little sport compact car and forgot to do anything with the engine.

This concept works for the import crowd from time to time, but never has seemed to fly in the world of domestics. IMO if the Focus SVT had the same turbocharged drivetrain in it the European RS does it would be a cult classis, just like the SRT4. And, the SVT handles and rides much better than the SRT4 to boot.

However, Dodge is the one who proved they know how to sell a hot compact in the states which is all that really counts at the end of the day. Ironically Ford has built super hot compacts for the Euro market for decades, but never has seemed to figure out people over here might like them too. Don't make the mistake of thinking things like this are obvious to car companies, they aren't.

I don't hold out much hope for Redline because they seem ashamed of their affiliation with GM. Yeah, GM needs bigtime help with their compact cars, but you would think by now they would figure out that a little self confidence might go a long way. Cheesing out and buying engines from Honda is just lame.

[nissan240sxdude]

I think it might take quiet a while before people actually start to begin to take a hard look in the mirror as to think other wise of getting a domestic over an import. I mean seriously not many of us new much about imports until Fast and the Furious came out or at least it wasn't as well known. But as soon as that came out everyone went crazy over them.

Of course so am I, but I turned away from that ricey junk like speakers, neon lights, and spoilers 5 feet high...it almost makes me want to gag...anyway I think the only way that domestics can make it back into the car scene is to be more like imports. I think the Dodge SRT 4 is a perfect example such as a turbo, big brakes, modible, and it is well...looks like an import.

I have heard mixed opinions on it from friends but I like it, that is a lot coming from me since even when I hear the word "domestic" it sends chills down my spine.

-nissan240sxdude

[OoNismoO]

Originally Posted by Polygon

It is hard to tell. Chrysler made cars like the SRT-4 back in the late 70s to the mid 90s. They weren't a huge hit then and I don't understand why. Though I hear that they are going to have a Evo coupe with the SRT-4 drive-train. These are just rumors though.

part of the reason why i think those early chrysler cars werent a huge hit, is because of the way they looked. i saw on world news or something like that, a couple months ago, that american car companies were known for being a bit bland in their design department compared to foreign named brand car companies, and that this is one of the major reasons why they re losing sales, cause people are almost first attracted to the way the car looks. they said that they didnt work on their overall designs enough, like interior, and exterior, but they were working on it. i forgot when they did this survey or whatever, but i think it was for the 90s, and recent.

[GTStang]

As far as the SVT Focus and hp you also need to remember it has to fit into marketing strategy and price planning of the fleet of cars. If they started making Focuses that were puttin numbers too close to GT Stangs then the whole price/market strategy would be in trouble. Dodge right now at the moment doesn't have to deal with this issue when it comes to the SRT-4.

[Polygon]

Originally Posted by OoNismoO

part of the reason why i think those early chrysler cars werent a huge hit, is because of the way they looked. i saw on world news or something like that, a couple months ago, that american car companies were known for being a bit bland in their design department compared to foreign named brand car companies, and that this is one of the major reasons why they re losing sales, cause people are almost first attracted to the way the car looks. they said that they didnt work on their overall designs enough, like interior, and exterior, but they were working on it. i forgot when they did this survey or whatever, but i think it was for the 90s, and recent.

That could be true of most of the Turbo Dodges, though I think that the Daytona and LeBaron GTC were damn good looking cars inside and out, better looking inside in the 90s. Then again with my GTC it seems that people either loved it or hated it.

[GTStang]

Originally Posted by Polygon

That could be true of most of the Turbo Dodges, though I think that the Daytona and LeBaron GTC were damn good looking cars inside and out, better looking inside in the 90s. Then again with my GTC it seems that people either loved it or hated it.

I think Dodge ran into the issue same as Ford did with some of it attempts at Turbo cars. American car buyers even into the early 90's were just not sure about turbo engines. Turbos were not looked at as reliable just a short decade ago buy american buyers. Dodge's build quality was in question more than the other american manufacturers also at the time so this didn't help. I think those cars were just victims of bad timing.

[Polygon]

Originally Posted by GTStang

I think Dodge ran into the issue same as Ford did with some of it attempts at Turbo cars. American car buyers even into the early 90's were just not sure about turbo engines. Turbos were not looked at as reliable just a short decade ago buy american buyers. Dodge's build quality was in question more than the other american manufacturers also at the time so this didn't help. I think those cars were just victims of bad timing.

Very true, I remember the Probe and Cougar/Thunderbird being availible with a Garrett T03 on board. Yeah, most people didn't understand how to take care of a turbo back then.

[stealthj]

dodge neon?? saturn ion??

these are sport compact cars?????????

and what are the japanese sport compact cars??

honda civics?

[9ball]

I agree with the above in that people are comparing the srt4 to this seemingly vast range of japanese sport compacts, but that crowd that once existed is thin now even in Japan. What would the crowd consist of, the Civic Si? Not quite. The SRT4 is a god send in my opinion, because aside from the WRX and EVO which are really in a class above, the SRT4 sits alone as an affordable turbocharged car. To me it's a continuation of where the DSM's left off.