Some of you Honda boys Confuse me...

[Rein]

I just wanted to make a comment on all the exterior body styling mods. Simply put, to each his (or her) own. When I first got my civic all I could think about was making it look better and I couldn't give a shit about performance. I have since then matured and realized my necessity for performance mods. Now in college I find myself needing a slightly bigger sedan, and that's why I'm buying an A4 next weekend. Now, I think subconsciously I wanted to make the exterior better on my civic cause I am not pleased with how it looks stock. With the A4, I'm just gonna drop a chip in there, exhaust, enjoy my 240 ft lbs, and not even modify the exterior except for getting some HRE wheels and maybe a front grill. In my opinion the A4 is perfect looking stock, so it doesn't need the extra body kits and whatnot. Being a fellow German owner, 911GT2, you can appreciate how they already look great stock as I do. To each his own, the only person who knows what you like is you.

[911GT2]

I'm not a German owner, just an enthusiast.

I noted earlier in the thread that I drive a 2001 Civic in fact.

But hopefully by the end of the summer I can pick up an old Porsche (914 hopefully). Being a college student really limits my choices.

[CivicRacerX]

WARNING: Very long, contains excessive rambling.

You've got to understand a couple of things. First, it's a matter of opportunity cost in many cases. If I need a car next month, I'm gonna buy the car I like most within my price range. Civics are easy to find, relatively inexpensive, and have more aftermarket support than just about any other car (you could make some argument for some domestic platforms, perhaps the Mustang).

Not everyone wants to buy an old 914 and try to mod it (even if you argue that it has aftermarket support, there's no way it's as plentiful as a Honda platform). I'm not getting down on you about it, because I think it's a cool car, and you'll arguably be more of an individual on the road, because you don't see that many. I imagine, however, that your insurance is going to be significantly more than any Civic of the same year, as well as the cost of gas, and maintenance. People buy what they can afford, and they mod it because maybe it's what they're stuck with, but they want it to be different. If someone else has the same bodykit and the same tail lights, does that make their car less of an individual? Not really. The car owner is expressing himself. Maybe you don't agree with the styling. Personally, I agree that 95% of bodykits, and I'd say an even higher number of Altezzas/clear tails look absolutely horrible (I had Altezzas for a couple years, though I pulled them off this spring). Most spoilers are pointlessly huge, and only serve as comic relief on the highway. You won't find any of that stuff on my car, and most of my friends are the same way, so there are tons of exceptions to your "rule". I don't have any stickers, I don't have a bodykit (I did just buy an SI lip), and neither do my friends.

In support of your arguments, I will admit that after owning 2 Hondas (my current civic since 1999), I've recently been wishing someone would come along and buy mine so that I could buy a DSM or an old Z. I'm only leaning away from Hondas because of the performance potential in some other platforms. Before all the Honda kids jump on me, I know that there are several Honda engines which do have decent potential (aside from torque, of which they are devoid), but I don't feel like dropping $5k on an engine swap when I could go buy an old Talon TSi for the same price and it'd be faster.

My point in all of this is that you shouldn't hate on people for tuning their Hondas. Yeah, they're cheap, yeah their performance potential is questionable in many cases, and yeah it gets annoying when some dude rolls by you with a 4" APC exhaust, primered body kit, and windshield banner, but that's the price Honda pays for their popularity. Honda's real commitment is to economy and reliability. That's why even the S2000 meets ULEV standards. Show me another car that will run with a new Porsche/BMW roadster and meet ULEV. Ha.

It's unfortunate that more people don't "get it" about the performance/appearance ordeal with their cars, but not everyone can afford a $30k car payment on a regular basis (or even want to - I probably could, I don't want one, I'd rather buy a used ride with no payment and spend the money on legitimately tuning it - you'll notice I have no performance modifications on my Honda because the D-series motor is useless. I went for my stereo and a set of rims.)

In the end, you gotta let people express themselves. The best you can hope for is that eventually they WILL get it, that after some time they'll realize that a single wiper mod and plastic "windowshadez" are best left on the shelf at Pep Boys. In the meantime, buy your 914, acknowledge the rest of us who understand why you don't have a bookshelf wing, and sleep peacefully knowing that you probably do "get it". Hate only breeds hate.

-C

[Rein]

Originally posted by 911GT2
I'm not a German owner, just an enthusiast.

I noted earlier in the thread that I drive a 2001 Civic in fact.

But hopefully by the end of the summer I can pick up an old Porsche (914 hopefully). Being a college student really limits my choices.

I hear ya man. Once you go german, cant go back.
deutsche Autos sind das beste

[911GT2]

Alright racer, I can agree with most of what you said.

And look at where this thread is, I never bashed tuning, I bashed stupid, ugly body kits and body mods that are expensive and useless.

And yes, the Honda aftermarket is quite large, but it's also quite overpriced because of the demand. Case in point: headers for a F-body V8 cost the same or less than Civic headers, despite having twice as much fabrication.

And while nobody's gonna totally want what I want, it's pretty clear alot of people would much rather look fast than be fast, which is just retarded.

And because of their ridiculously narrow powerband, an S2000 would have a very tough time keeping up with a Boxster or a 3 liter Z4.

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally posted by 911GT2
...And because of their ridiculously narrow powerband, an S2000 would have a very tough time keeping up with a Boxster or a 3 liter Z4.

Actually, not very hard at all. Simply put, the S2000 is QUICKER and faster than BOTH the BMW Z4 and the Boxster, and not the baseline one either, quicker than the Boxster S. Quciker in 0-60 acceleration as well as the quarter mile. Check your facts, and you'll find out just how true this is. Never underestimate the power of a 4 cylinder. Honda would have never made a car like the S2000 if it couldn't at least trample over and PASS up it's competition. And the powerband of the S2000 isn't as narrow as you think. Name another car like it (nothing exotic) that runs it's best ABOVE 6000 RPMs. Perhaps you forgot the S2000 has 9000 RPMs to play with?

[911GT2]

I stand corrected.

But in R/T's Sibling Rivalry test, the Boxster S and the S2000 got practically equal lap times (2:17.66 for the S2000, 2:17.46 for the Boxster) despite accelerating quite a bit slower in this test (5.6 as opposed to 4.9).

The only thing that sucks is that to get that 4.9 seconds you gotta do a 6500 rpm clutch drop.

[emerge]

Originally posted by 911GT2
The second you get your car, you try and make it into something different, often spending inexorbitant amounts of money doing so (which could actually buy you something else, something better in fact).

Explain yourselves.

And to quell the flames, I myself an a Civic driver (2001) and still can't imagine why you'd ever do this.

that's the very first post in this discussion. you can even look at the title of the discussion. you should've expected this kind of feedback when you posted something like that. i just hope you got your question answered...

[911GT2]

Originally posted by emerge


that's the very first post in this discussion. you can even look at the title of the discussion. you should've expected this kind of feedback when you posted something like that. i just hope you got your question answered...

Not particularly, because the only people that attempted to retort weren't the people the comment was aimed at.

The real riceboys just said something inane and stupid like "fuck u a-hole" or something like that.

[SilverY2KCivic]

Originally posted by 911GT2
I stand corrected.

But in R/T's Sibling Rivalry test, the Boxster S and the S2000 got practically equal lap times (2:17.66 for the S2000, 2:17.46 for the Boxster) despite accelerating quite a bit slower in this test (5.6 as opposed to 4.9).

The only thing that sucks is that to get that 4.9 seconds you gotta do a 6500 rpm clutch drop.

The advantage and beauties of a M/R type car (mid engine, rear drive)

The Boxster is way more balanced for auto-x/road racing type courses, not to say the S2000 isn't because it certainly is as well, but that powerful motor riding over the fronts doesn't help things any in the handling department which directly relates to slower lap times unfortunately. I see LOTS of S2000's at the Solo2 races I participate in with my Civic, and next to the Miatas and other similar cars, they do exceptionally well and get fantastic lap times. Sadly no one really ever brings Porsches (weather it be 911's, Boxsters, 914's or even 944's) to these events, and I'm dying to see how any of those would do on that type or course.

The 6500 clutch drop launch is the price one has to pay for owning a high reving car if they plan to straight line race it and get a respectable launch. Nothing unlike the 7000 RPM launches some Skyline GT-R have to endure when built up certain ways to get a good launch, AWD like that ain't as easy as launching a Z06 Vette, that's for dang sure!

[crankwalk 2g]

I agree with 911GT2, Idon't see any point in making a slow car look fast. Most people who take offence to what he is saying probably fall into that category. All 911GT2 did was ask a simple question, telling him that he is stupid or ignorant just makes u look ignorant.

To answer the original question the only reason to spend money on a body kit for an econo car is because the owner likes the way it looks, if the reason is anything else its a lie.

As far as originallity or trying to be different goes, i admit there are a few that try but most people are monkey see monkey do. Where i live you won't belive the amount of lookalike hondas here, they are blue with white rims clear lights and a white interior, there must be at least 15 or so just in my area. So much for originallity.

[911GT2]

Originally posted by SilverY2KCivic


The advantage and beauties of a M/R type car (mid engine, rear drive)

The Boxster is way more balanced for auto-x/road racing type courses, not to say the S2000 isn't because it certainly is as well, but that powerful motor riding over the fronts doesn't help things any in the handling department which directly relates to slower lap times unfortunately. I see LOTS of S2000's at the Solo2 races I participate in with my Civic, and next to the Miatas and other similar cars, they do exceptionally well and get fantastic lap times. Sadly no one really ever brings Porsches (weather it be 911's, Boxsters, 914's or even 944's) to these events, and I'm dying to see how any of those would do on that type or course.

The 6500 clutch drop launch is the price one has to pay for owning a high reving car if they plan to straight line race it and get a respectable launch. Nothing unlike the 7000 RPM launches some Skyline GT-R have to endure when built up certain ways to get a good launch, AWD like that ain't as easy as launching a Z06 Vette, that's for dang sure!

944s, 914s and Boxsters RIP UP at AutoX events. The 944 was called "the best handling car in the world" by Motor Trend when it was released, 914s have extremely low weight and the MR balance, and Boxsters have an a amazing suspension and the MR balance. 911s are trickier, but if you can control the off-throttle oversteer, they're nothing short of amazing. Still more of a road course car than an autocrosser however.

And from what I've heard, GT-Rs are one of the easiest cars to launch out there. Ham it up to 6K RPMs, drop the clutch and let the computer sort it out

[911GT2]

Originally posted by crankwalk 2g
I agree with 911GT2, Idon't see any point in making a slow car look fast. Most people who take offence to what he is saying probably fall into that category. All 911GT2 did was ask a simple question, telling him that he is stupid or ignorant just makes u look ignorant.

To answer the original question the only reason to spend money on a body kit for an econo car is because the owner likes the way it looks, if the reason is anything else its a lie.

As far as originallity or trying to be different goes, i admit there are a few that try but most people are monkey see monkey do. Where i live you won't belive the amount of lookalike hondas here, they are blue with white rims clear lights and a white interior, there must be at least 15 or so just in my area. So much for originallity.

Finally, someone actually agrees. Too bad it isn't a Hondaboy, but a DSMer.

[branman_crx_guy]

The real riceboys just said something inane and stupid like "fuck u a-hole" or something like that.

Why am I thinkin ur talkin about me? Just in case u r, u need to reread my first post, which wasn't hatin on u at all.....except the props part, which i cant really back up seein as how i know nothin bout ur car, but other than that I was just saying that u cant judge a car simply by a few things u see. You cant judge my car by racing either lol, u can only judge my car by listenin to wat will eventually be done and then believing it and being "Wowwed" by it.


In conclusion: I wasnt tryin to say " f u asshole" just kinda came out like that...I should say "sorry" here but i dont appalaugize (dont remember how to spell that right now) so ill just leave it as....um.....yeeeaaahhhh.

[911GT2]

Originally posted by branman_crx_guy


Why am I thinkin ur talkin about me? Just in case u r, u need to reread my first post, which wasn't hatin on u at all.....except the props part, which i cant really back up seein as how i know nothin bout ur car, but other than that I was just saying that u cant judge a car simply by a few things u see. You cant judge my car by racing either lol, u can only judge my car by listenin to wat will eventually be done and then believing it and being "Wowwed" by it.


In conclusion: I wasnt tryin to say " f u asshole" just kinda came out like that...I should say "sorry" here but i dont appalaugize (dont remember how to spell that right now) so ill just leave it as....um.....yeeeaaahhhh.

Once again, I convinced the real performance enthusiasts. I see you as on the bubble solely because of your manner of speech, I haven't seen your car.

And the public at large judges a car solely by looks. Does that mean you've gotta cater to them? Fuck that.