g20 vs a4 thread

[P10DET]

Originally posted by Anthony
I should think that the Primera and a FWD Audi A4 would be a close call, but a Quattro would blow it away.

Only when it rains. The A4 vs SE-R lap times from the track event were for an A4 Quattro. I should think a G20 or Primera (150PS model) should give it a good run. I think a P10 (lighter weight and no log rear axle) would blow the A4 into the kitty litter.

[P10DET]

First of all, please believe me when I say I'm not an A4 hater (I do like the car, however over rated). I also am not blind to the fact the G20/Primera is not a world beater. I am simply replying to some of the comments that have been made and in large part I've stayed away from pure opinion.

Originally posted by b-b00gie
I guess the problem is: there is little aftermarket for the G20.

In large part, that is true. Nissan just never figured out how to market the G20 in North America. They initially tried to market it as a sport sedan, just as the Primera is in the rest of the world. But, being part of the Infiniti line, they got cold feet and decided it should be a baby luxo car. I've always thought they were stupid for that. BTW, I remember very clearly when the G20 came out (I wanted one then) and at the time they did try to market it as a BMW 3 series competitior. From purely a performance/dependability stand point it was (remember the early E30 was a dog). But, the gold chain and yuppie crowd would rather pay for the image of owning a "beemer."

Originally posted by b-b00gie
Anyhow I'll drop this whole performance thing, but just as Justin said: you may say you can modify your G20 to surpass an A4 per say, but dont forget that you can also modify that A4 also. A simple ECU upgrade ($650) will add 45 wheel HP to a 1.8T, adding 45 wheel (ahem real) HP to an SR20DE is much more expensive.

Oh, that reminds me, the A4 that I've been talking about being beaten by an SE-R......

SEaRl has a A41.8T Quattro with the chip, a full suspension and race tires. With all that crap, he was beaten by 4 seconds a lap by a bone stock SE-R with street tires and bad dampers. That is the truth and there are several witnesses.

Originally posted by b-b00gie
I like cars in general, not just the one I own, so I try to stay pretty open minded.

Same here, whether you believe it or not.

I'm not trying to argumentative, but again, when it comes to the performance, I'm quoting facts.

[jprimera]

Hi there is no way that a a4 can beat a p11 in any contest of speed ,my brother have a A3 1.8t , the last time we run in a road racing I beat him for about 8 seconds ,I have 2 magazines that include a test with the A3 ,primera ,renault megane,honda civic ,almera gti,astra gsi....etc in parana circuit ,I will post the result ,you will see audi owners that there is noy WAY with the A3(the a4 have nothing to do if you compare even with the A3) in slalom brake and laps in the circuit ,can beat a almera and not even close to the primera .Hope you can undertan my bad english.

[primera_gte]

my intention was to recruit you in the war against some smug a4 owners on edmunds.com. i didn't intend to start a flame war.

boogie,

you're right, it's going to cost more to get your g20 the hp, but it's also going to cost you a lot more to buy one. 4 more gs is typical. and the audi is less reliable. not everyone goes through a car every two to four years.

i've also heard that chipping an audi/vw comes at a cost. i've heard from some audi owners the chip made their car a b#tch to drive. don't know how much water that holds.

as for nissan's/infiniti's handling of the g20 line. terrible

when the p11 was re-introduded they should have had these options.

1. g20 with sr20de
2. g20 with sr20vvl with stick or cvt
3. g20 with sr20det, with and awd- i'd pay 28 gs for that.

that would have been a killer line up.

i'm just waiting to buy another p10 or p11.

[2002G20Racer]

I was actualy going to buy a Audi A4 Quattro before the dealer at Audi wouldnt lower the price and my friends Dad (a Infiniti dealer) gave me a real good price on my G20. I actually wish I got the Audi a lot. I love my G20 but the Audi is just better. I mean you get a chip and you got 200hp! It takes a lot to get a G20 up to 200hp unless you go DET.

[flylwsi]

hi... this is the voice of reason.

there are three(four?) options for an a4.
1.8t fwd
1.8t quattro
2.8 quattro

so what are we comparing to?
the turbo motor which is a little underpowered in that big awd car, or the v6 which kicks it around pretty nice?

this is like comparing a civic si to a v6 camaro...
you cant take a top o line car from one line and dog on the "lowend of the totem pole" car from the other make...
if you take your top end g20 vs the 2.8 w/ quattro, who would win?
not "topend g20 vs 1.8t fwd"

at least make it logically fair...

and i love audi.
i dont know much about the g20, but i know it is a nice car...
and i wont dog it at all...
but it just needs to be looked at on what is an even ground...

and i agree that the nissan aftermarket sucks here, but that doesnt mean it doesnt exist... the only downside to importing an sr20det motor is that you can only have it fwd... kinda shitty...
but it would be hella cool...

and i am glad the point was made about audi being banned from btcc w/ its quattro b/c it wooped ace on everyone... but i talk too much...
just see what i meant... and at least compare evenly...

[P10DET]

Originally posted by flylwsi
so what are we comparing to?
the turbo motor which is a little underpowered in that big awd car, or the v6 which kicks it around pretty nice?

I am specifically comparing it to a car whose owner (a former owner of a monster turbo SE-R that was featured in SCC) boasted that his 1.8T Quattro A4 with chip, suspension, and race tires, could beat any SE-R in any contest of speed. A bone stock early SE-R with blown struts and crappy street tires kicked his ass.

Originally posted by flylwsi
at least make it logically fair...

I'd wager that a stock G20 would beat a stock A4 (any version) on a road course. I'm not trying to dog the A4, but guessing (admittedly) based upon the above ass kicking, the mods to the A4 and knowing the SE-R and G20 intimately. The G20 is an excellent handling car and while the later G20 (P11) is way underpowered for its heft, the handling would make up for the power deficiency on a road course. This is certainly speculation, but it's not without any basis either.

Originally posted by flylwsi
the only downside to importing an sr20det motor is that you can only have it fwd... kinda shitty...
but it would be hella cool...

Thanks. See December's Sport Compact Car.

Originally posted by flylwsi
and i am glad the point was made about audi being banned from btcc w/ its quattro b/c it wooped ace on everyone... but i talk too much...
just see what i meant... and at least compare evenly...

Oh most definitely. They've been banned from virtually every series they ran. I think there was some talk at one point (over ten years ago) of banning them from WRC. Now everyone has AWD of course. But, I don't see Audi kicking ass there now.

Anyway, the A4 is a nice car. I probably wouldn't buy one even if I was in that market, but then again, I couldn't tell you what I would buy. I normally stay out of comparison discussions, but I entered this one with direct comparison information. Now it's come down to speculation (even my part), so this is where I will bow out.

Both are excellent cars. Both are under powered and certainly over weight.

[flylwsi]

im not sure...
an awd car like the audi has a lot of grip...
not as much as an s4, but hey, im not complaining...
the se r is also designed to be more of the sporty car... the a4 is a luxostyle car... and i agree, im glad your cocky a4 guy got whooped...

however, if it were really fair, since the se r is top o the line for the sentra... why not compare it to top of the line s4? it handles like rails and you would need two se r's stock to catch it... and im not doggin, but if the se r is the top of the line w/ great susp and all that, then the s4 is your man... but hell, when you gotta double the price to get an s4, i d take the se r...
hmm...

and yeah, i read the whole g20 motor swap, that is why i brought that up...
i get all those issues about a wk before they come out, b/c the place i work at advertises in em, so we get free copies... luv it...

[F20C]

Originally posted by NismoPC
I do not know how actual these are, but I am not impressed at all. I got this from http://www.car-stats.com/

1997 A4 Quattro 1.8T
0-60: 8.3 1/4: 16.3
1998 A4 Quattro Avant 1.8T
0-60: 7.4 1/4: 15.9
1999 A4 Quattro 1.8T
0-60: 8.4 1/4: 16.2
2001 A4 Quattro Avant 1.8T
0-60: 8.5 1/4: 16.3

That isn't much better than a P10 G20 doing 0-60: 8.3 1/4: 16.3

Sorry but that doesn't sound right. 2001 A4 1.8T had 170bhp and it weights the same as 2000. So it is faster than 2000 but yet you state it's slower. 2000 and prior only had 150bhp. 1997 A4 is lighter than 1998 A4 and yet you state 98 is faster.

[P10DET]

Originally posted by flylwsi
however, if it were really fair, since the se r is top o the line for the sentra... why not compare it to top of the line s4?

Well, if we really want to be fair, let's compare it to a Skyline GTR.

Hehe. Just teasing you. I said I was through with this thread, but I couldn't resist the jab. :right:

Thanks for the kind words about my article.

[Apeman]

Originally posted by P10DET


I am specifically comparing it to a car whose owner (a former owner of a monster turbo SE-R that was featured in SCC) boasted that his 1.8T Quattro A4 with chip, suspension, and race tires, could beat any SE-R in any contest of speed. A bone stock early SE-R with blown struts and crappy street tires kicked his ass.

I will have to go check the SER list archives but I always thought the A4 in question was a 2.8 model, pre the 5 valve head.

I know, I know George, check the archives

BTW the way I read your article, very well done and great pictures as we've come to expect from you. Good pic of the power steering cooler rerouting, I like to think I helped a little with that. Also the intercooler is a very nice setup, much cleaner than what I had, although likely more expensive.

Regards,
Antony

[junglist]

Sorry guys...I have driven the A4 1.8T Quattro...I have ridden in a 2000 G20....and I love my 92 G20...but that A4 just puts the G to shame...
it is damn fast..handles like an indy car

[G-Forces]

Originally posted by junglist
but that A4 just puts the G to shame...
it is damn fast..handles like an indy car

You've driven an indy car?

Bring that A4 to Shannoville this summer I'll give it a run!

[junglist]

first off..the A4 I drove is not mine, it is a friend's....second...it was stock..no add-on parts needed to smoke a G
third...no I have not driven an indy car...figure of speech. Forth...if I could bring it Shannonville..it would smoke your G.

[G22DET]

show up or shut up bring the A4..since you started this..and we'll see who smoke who?