99 Alero 3.4L Wont Start (no dash lights)

[aaron0986]

Hello I have a 99 3.4 Alero that wont start. Parked it at the grocery store turned it off, the decided to turn it back to on position to roll down windows RIGHT after, and it wouldn't work. No dash lights no windows. Radio and interior lights fine, as well as headlights when in highbeams. Tried getting it boosted (suspected maybe a dead/dying altenator) but with no luck still no lights or anything. When I try to turn it over to start I get nothing at all radio shuts off no click no dash lights nothing at all.

This car had a issue with the key where i would have to play around with it in the ignition to turn (looks as tho it had a attempted breaking before me).

If anyone has a idea of what this could be I would appreciated it.

PLEASE NOTE there is NO flashing security light. NO dash lights are on while in any position.

[procaddytech]

First, in your underhood fuse block check the IGN SW-BATT 1 and IGN SW-BATT 2 fuses. If one is blown there is most likely a short between the fuse block and ignition switch. If not, there are quite a few sets of contacts in the ignition switch that can fail, you can also try gently tapping on the dash under the switch while you turn the key back and forth from off to run or crank. Of course there are alot of other things to check but this is a quick parking lot check.

[aaron0986]

Originally Posted by procaddytech

First, in your underhood fuse block check the IGN SW-BATT 1 and IGN SW-BATT 2 fuses. If one is blown there is most likely a short between the fuse block and ignition switch. If not, there are quite a few sets of contacts in the ignition switch that can fail, you can also try gently tapping on the dash under the switch while you turn the key back and forth from off to run or crank. Of course there are alot of other things to check but this is a quick parking lot check.

Thanks alot first fuse I checked was it started right away. Didn't think fuse at all

[aaron0986]

The reason it wouldnt turn over before was because of the fuse for sure, i replaced it got it to start about 4 times at different times. Originally in the on position there car had no life at all no dash lights only radio and interior lights. NOW With no fuse/blown fuse my dash lights are working as well as the interior lights are working as well as radio BUT I keep popping 40A fuses every time i try to crank the engine..

I am sure there is a short somewhere, is there anywhere that someone can direct me to start looking for it considering my symptoms (remember I have a issue with my ignition (part the key turns) where i have to keep playing with and turning it to make it move from the off position to ACC/ON/RUN positions.

Thanks in advance.

PS. The fuse that is blowing is the IGN SW-BATT 1 I believe (its the 40A fuse)

[procaddytech]

The 40A IGN SW-BATT fuse Feeds the ignition switch through a red wire from the underhood fuse block, through the firewall and into the switch. With the switch in Accy, Run, or Start it feeds the PCM ACC fuse and the IPC/BFC ACC fuses in the left I.P. junction block through a green wire from the switch. If it only blows when you turn the key, focus on the green wire from the ignition switch to the left I.P. fuse block for being chaffed or shorted. It does not get power until the key is turned past the off position. The short can't be after the I.P. fuses or one of them would blow.

[aaron0986]

I have begun taking some of the dash apart to get to try and trace the green wire so far with no luck (wondering if there are any specific things i can remove to access it without removing the whole dash as it seems to run fairly far back. I does indeed only blow once it is turned into the on position for about 2-3 seconds. As is there any chance that my ignition switch could be faulty and causing the fuse to blow?

[procaddytech]

I left out some impotant info. I missed. The fuse is also linked to another set of contacts in the ignitin switch. It's not just the green wire. It could also be the one of the 2 orange wires that come out of one cavity of the ignition switch connector. One runs over to the right I.P. junction block and the other goes back out to the underhood junction block OR the yellow wire which runs from switch out to the Park Nuetral Position Switch, comes out purple and goes to the starter solenoid. The fuse would only blow in the crank position if it's the yellow ckt. If the fuse blows in "ON" only it could be orange or green, if if blows in "START" only it could be yellow or green, and if it blows in "ACCY" only it is green. Reading back through your posts I would stop taking the dash apart, put the car in a drive gear and turn the key to "START". (the engine should not crank in a drive range) If the fuse does not blow, focus on the purple wire from the PRNDL on the trans to the starter solenoid. This wire could be melted / chaffed or the starter solenoid may be shorted. Carefully unhook it from the solenoid (battery disconnected) and insulate the ring terminal with tape. Hook the battery back up and try to crank the engine. If the fuse doesnt blow the Starter Solenoid is shorted. Sorry I missed that buss in the switch schematic. It bothers me that you could have found something by now. Remember, if it happens in "START" only, car in park or neutral = purple wire or starter.

[procaddytech]

To sum up the babbling above, put the shifter in low gear and try to crank the car. It shouldn't crank. See if the fuse blew. If it did not blow the purple wire to the starter is shorted or the starter is.

[aaron0986]

Originally Posted by procaddytech

To sum up the babbling above, put the shifter in low gear and try to crank the car. It shouldn't crank. See if the fuse blew. If it did not blow the purple wire to the starter is shorted or the starter is.

I tried the test. it still blew tried it in both drive and first gear about 1-2 seconds till blow I left it in the on position for about 5 mins with no overload. Stripped down the purple and red to the started back a bit and both look to be in excellent shape still. So at this point the only position it blows in is the crank position and it blows before the engine has a chance to try to turn

[procaddytech]

As you see in these 2 schematics the only wires that get hot in the crank/start position are the green and the yellow. Both from IGN SW BATT 1 fuse (B in the top schematic). If it blows only in crank/start even with the shifter out of park and neutral, the only suspect left is the yellow wire from the switch out to the Park Neutral Position Switch. Green would blow in accy, on, and start.

[aaron0986]

Originally Posted by procaddytech

As you see in these 2 schematics the only wires that get hot in the crank/start position are the green and the yellow. Both from IGN SW BATT 1 fuse (B in the top schematic). If it blows only in crank/start even with the shifter out of park and neutral, the only suspect left is the yellow wire from the switch out to the Park Neutral Position Switch. Green would blow in accy, on, and start.

And where would I find and check this wire?

[procaddytech]

Look down on the top of the transmission, in the area under the master cylinder. The Park Neutral switch will be there at the end of the shift cable with 2 connectors. The yellow wire in the connector with 6 wires is the one to look for. It runs from that connector, to the underhood fuse block, then through the firewall to the ignition switch. There are 2 yellow wires in that connector. The wire in question is in terminal G, next to a light green wire. If you have a meter, with the P/N switch unplugged, check for continuity to ground. If you have continuity, you have a short. I don't know how many fuses you have on hand, but you can turn the key to crank and see if it blows. Look for any harnesses that look pinched or tight up against metal under the left side of the hood and under the dash.

[aaron0986]

I thought i would post and let you know that the problem is fixed was either pinched or the connector was dirty and shorting out i disconnected it and cleaned it out and plugged it back in and its good now!! Only problem is now that when I put the dash and console back together i seem to have caused my parking break light to stay on all the time now! Do you think this could be caused by the same switch? either way nothing serious as not being able to drive the damn thing Thank you a lot of your time and much need help.

[procaddytech]

Great news! As for the red brake light, check to make sure the parking brake is pulled back up against the stopper (if it is a foot pedal). Sometimes they won't release all the way as things wear. Also, check the brake fluid level and any connectors out by the master cylinder that may have been disturbed.