Honda haters?

uh.....no.....

don't know much about drifting do you.

I'm sorry, but you don't know what a sports car is. FWD has been kicking RWD's ass since it became popular for production automobiles. Most notably you might remember that Citroen's front drivers enjoyed a winning streak in the monte-carlo rally, followed by a winning streak of SAAB 96 sedans, followed by a winning streak of BMC Minis. These cars beat more powerful RWD cars - and outside of the Monte Carlo, FWD kicked ass in all sorts of events.

Read my post again plz, and note I said "anything can be made to do things well". FWD can be MADE to perform well just like anything else, what I said is that RWD & AWD are better platforms to work with. Please tell me what it is that FWD is superior in? Is it cornering? Acceleration? oh yea...drifting, ::funny:: Im kinda boggled here...from my experience FWD is a limited platform, but then again I do mostly drag racing personally. I have seen many FWD cars lose control because of weight transfer that doesnt benefit FWD as it does RWD. And we all know about that pesky thing we call understeer. FWD cars just cant put the power to the ground like AWD and RWD can in a high hp/tq application.

don't know much about drifting do you.


ok expert....go and post in the drifting forum that FWD and AWD cars are better at drifting than RWD cars.....


if you are such an expert i'm sure you can back up your claims in that forum

its under racing...see ya there

FWD cars just cant put the power to the ground like AWD and RWD can in a high hp/tq application.

Hmmm, I see this must be why RWD cars do so well in snow? :rofl:
And just for your information, understeer is a common trait of ALL front engined cars, reguardless of whether it's the rear or front wheels that are being powered.
In many respects, FWD is better than RWD (especially when you're using an engine mounted in the front, rear engined cars are a different story) FWD is more versatile than RWD in many ways and there is no reason, that a FWD platform would not be able to perform as well as a RWD platform in drag racing - maybe if drag racers would stop being so old fashioned and reluctant to try out something different, there'd be more FWD drag cars out there?

Hahah

I think you are just blinded with your Voltswagen Beatles that you autox with, or whatever those ugly things are in those pictures. Take a FWD and 500-600lb of TQ and put the power on the ground w/o slicks. Hell it would be a nightmare on slicks too. Not sure if you realize that weight transfer occurs when launching that takes traction off of your front tires and transfers to the rear. Have you ever owned a ~3100lb car w/ 550+ HP/TQ, I have, try launching that on FWD. That is what I meant by the platform is limited. If there was anything beneficial in using FWD for high horsepower launching/acceleration they would be getting used in proffesional drag racing.

Hmmm, I see this must be why RWD cars do so well in snow?
What does snow have to do with racing 99.99% of us will ever see?? How is that a measure of getting power to the ground?

And just for your information, understeer is a common trait of ALL front engined cars, reguardless of whether it's the rear or front wheels that are being powered.
No, its not. Ive owned 6 RWD cars in the last 3 years, never saw Understeer, RWD has oversteer, FWD has understeer typically.

In many respects, FWD is better than RWD (especially when you're using an engine mounted in the front, rear engined cars are a different story) FWD is more versatile than RWD in many ways and there is no reason, that a FWD platform would not be able to perform as well as a RWD platform in drag racing - maybe if drag racers would stop being so old fashioned and reluctant to try out something different, there'd be more FWD drag cars out there?
Thats funny, I want to see you go out to a dragstrip and say some nonsense like that, do some research first, stop fooling yourself.

ok expert....go and post in the drifting forum that FWD and AWD cars are better at drifting than RWD cars.....


if you are such an expert i'm sure you can back up your claims in that forum

its under racing...see ya there

didn't say i was an expert asshole. I was typing fast and screwed up, yeah rwd are better than fwd at drifting and its very hard to drift an awd. happy?

didn't say i was an expert asshole. I was typing fast and screwed up, yeah rwd are better than fwd at drifting and its very hard to drift an awd. happy?

btw here we have this thing called banning so keep it up......


and if you would be anything close to maturity you would've admited earlier that it was your fault due to the mistype instead of saying that do not know anything about the subject and supporting your mistake....but instead you decide to call me names....good move :thumbsdow

btw here we have this thing called banning so keep it up......


and if you would be anything close to maturity you would've admited earlier that it was your fault due to the mistype instead of saying that do not know anything about the subject and supporting your mistake....but instead you decide to call me names....good move :thumbsdow

i called you an asshole because i make a mistake when typing and you get all sarcastic. oh, i'm going to get banned for calling you a name? there's more name calling on these forums than any other i've seen. by the way i'm not a newbie, my old account had over 300 posts.

i called you an asshole because i make a mistake when typing and you get all sarcastic. oh, i'm going to get banned for calling you a name? there's more name calling on these forums than any other i've seen. by the way i'm not a newbie, my old account had over 300 posts.


i don't care if you are a noobie or not...i never brought that up....fact is that no matter how many people use profanity it is still not apropiate for you


and i was not sarcarstic....i said: "oh....no" basically disagreeing with your statement....i had no way to know you mistyped.....your reply was to tell me that i don't know anything about drifting......so grow up and just admit you made a mistake and you continued it :rolleyes:

so it comes down to this: you made a mistake i corected you then you came back and said that i don't know what i am talking about i replied again that you are wrong and then you came back again and started swearing

I don't knock Honda's or people who drive them....It's just that when one tries to do me dirty and pass me, I mean it's like where are you going....I mean I hear your exhaust tryin, but you aren't goin anywhere. So before you throw all those stickers on your car and body kits, then try to race me...First make sure your engine is up to par! But for those of you that keep it cool then more power to you....I mean some people just like Hondas?

honda's are fine as long as the serve their purpose. "Civic" means city = city driving/lower speeds. They weren't meant to have stupid coffee cans and neon blue wipers. People who own these cars think everyone is envious - only poor people. most normal people aspire to have something a bit better than a $ 12,000 ECONOMY car.

hey it's not just hondas that are horrid 98 % of asian cars are the same ..no

the reason ppl hate honda is becasue you ppl put on a coffee can muffler and all of a sudden you can pull off a porsche or so you think! i drive a almost completely stock 74 camaro i bought myself and i smoke you little ricers all the time! i will give props to the guys who are willing to spend the money and the time to make their honda truly fast but thats only about 2% of the "racers" with a honda! but in order to make a honda fast you pretty much gotta put a whole new engine in it! unless its a older prelude or the s2000 becasue you can get huge hp gains out of those two engines. but overall you ppl drive like shit in and outta traffic thinkin you a fuckin hardass and your cars super fast! where it sounds and moves more along the lines more like a lawn mower. stop thinking your fast and make the car fast! and "fast" begins at being able to run a mid 13 quater mile. or you can spend half the money and buy a older muscle car and be able to make it fast alot cheaper and quicker then your asain pieces! ppl hate ricers becasue they are gay!

the reason ppl hate honda is becasue you ppl put on a coffee can muffler and all of a sudden you can pull off a porsche or so you think! i drive a almost completely stock 74 camaro i bought myself and i smoke you little ricers all the time! i will give props to the guys who are willing to spend the money and the time to make their honda truly fast but thats only about 2% of the "racers" with a honda! but in order to make a honda fast you pretty much gotta put a whole new engine in it! unless its a older prelude or the s2000 becasue you can get huge hp gains out of those two engines. but overall you ppl drive like shit in and outta traffic thinkin you a fuckin hardass and your cars super fast! where it sounds and moves more along the lines more like a lawn mower. stop thinking your fast and make the car fast! and "fast" begins at being able to run a mid 13 quater mile. or you can spend half the money and buy a older muscle car and be able to make it fast alot cheaper and quicker then your asain pieces! ppl hate ricers becasue they are gay!



That is half-correct and half naive- Honda have 4 good engines for racing and/or tuning- the H22A series (Accord SiR & Prelude VTi-R) B16a (Civic SiR and Type R), F20C (S2000) and B18C (Integra VTi-R & Type R) there is also the engine from the NSX- but for a Honda engine I'd perfer the I4 series seeing as they are lighter. While tuning JApanese cars is more expensive it's more rewarding- how rewarding woul it be to get 1500bhp our of a 2.6 litre RB26DETT- which in a correctly prepared Skyline shell with the ATESSA AWD system will run 1/4's with pretty much any muscle car imagineable- and while it'd be crappy around corners- it'd probably run better around them than the Muscle car of similar bhp.


Yet you are very right- people should stop driving like assholes and overcompensating for small wee-wee's- it's idiots like them that give true import enthusiasts like myself a bad name- and I have to bear the brunt of their stupidity. I'd probably put 14 sec 1/4 for a respectable time- and a good lap at Nurburgring is also important

like i said bro, if you take the time and spend the money to do the work to make the car fast ill give you all the props in the world i love any car as long as it commands respect through PERFORMANCE. I'm a muscle car lover myself and only 16 so i probably only know half of what you guys do, so if i left a couple of the honda engines out it was just oversight i wasn't trying to be naive. lol. thanks for fillin me in though!

like i said bro, if you take the time and spend the money to do the work to make the car fast ill give you all the props in the world i love any car as long as it commands respect through PERFORMANCE. I'm a muscle car lover myself and only 16 so i probably only know half of what you guys do, so if i left a couple of the honda engines out it was just oversight i wasn't trying to be naive. lol. thanks for fillin me in though!


No problem- we all gotta start somewhere :smile:

Funny I like Hondas I just don't like that many honda owners.

If you've never owned more than 4 cars in you're life.....dont talk to me.

I agree with racingbreed, the problem with hondas started with "The fast and the Furious" it made the drivers little pricks. They have this obsession with Folgers can exhausts and carbon fiber steering wheels. In turn they sit there and knock you down for not doing up your car the way the movie said to and race around thinking they're professional drivers. Now, I like the old honda Preludes I think they are quick for what they were originally made for but I like "muscle cars" more. Everyone who says that ricers are better and faster etc.... don't take into account that they also weigh 1/4 of what a "muscle car" weighs. Today fiber glass and plastic make up about 65% of the car, import or domestic. back in the day only a few cars were made of these materials, i.e. Corvette and the Shelby cobra. Honda's are good long lasting commuter cars that have potential to be brought up to racing class. Same goes for all the old Chevy's, Pontiacs, Mopars etc... it's all the same but a whole lot smaller now.

I have respect for any can that can talk the shit and walk it but it is the hondas who r dx coupes that have intake and rims and think that they r the sh*t that pisses me off. It is those guys who give honda owners a bad rep.

i have the same problem in my town. there is a tricked out eclipse with the rims carbon fiber hood and great decal job along with paint and body kit. About 5 grand worth of stuff on the body, But it was taken on the strip by a stock SVT Ford Contour. i have nothing against somebody who can walk as well as talk, but for those retards who trick out the body but yet can barely pump their own gas let alone install a turbo kit system GIVE IT UP!!!!!!! just because you guys look stupid dont mean u gotta act like it

in my city its kinda diff, most people around here know what there doing with there honda's, i've been in a few hard races with some integra's and one civic hatch. these guys look pretty and they back there looks along with it, maybe not running 12's but low 14's and high 13's is respectable from a honda civic, let alone there are some 12's around.
and as for the dumb guys with a can and rims, i like em, they give me something to laugh at.

FWD is better than RWD (especially when you're using an engine mounted in the front, rear engined cars are a different story) FWD is more versatile than RWD in many ways and there is no reason, that a FWD platform would not be able to perform as well as a RWD platform in drag racing - maybe if drag racers would stop being so old fashioned and reluctant to try out something different, there'd be more FWD drag cars out there?


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

I just revisited this thread, and I couldnt help but laugh my ass off at this post again....what a troll... :screwy:

with FWD the power to the car goes to the front wheels, therefore inhibiting the steering on the road. it ok for straight shots, and it or 4WD is always a must in places where winter happens. RWD is ideal for better steering response because your front tires are not under so much stress when turning and accellerating at once. i think both can be good, it just depends on your reasons for having one or the other. however FWD cars are more known for less power at the wheels, and are typically smaller than RWD

You could say I'm more of a domestic guy, but I don't hate Hondas. The only Honda car I would build would be a hybrid hatch, though. What I do hate is cocky and disrepectful drivers. I can't stand the sore loser that does a flyby, and puts the hazards on after you beat him. I also hate it when you get beat and the other guy goes on and on about how slow your ride is. Sh*t, if you really are a car enthusiast, you would be helping other people out instead of bashing their ride. I think tuning an LS1 to run low 11 is cool, but I think tuning an integra to run a 13 can be equally cool.

i have never really liked hondas. cuz most of the hondas i see here (kansas city metro) are jus eye candy and have no speed. i have beaten a couple hondas with body kits on and i have an oldsmobile. i am getting a 300zx soon and cant wait to beat all the hondas. there are a couple hondas i admire (prelude and S2000), but i dont like the majority of them.

I hate kids that go "all show, no go" and then think they are fast. I don't care if its a import or domestic. Luckily we don't have that problem out here in corn country. Very hard for a kid to make money and most kids just put a system in their car, very little performance modding goes on and just as little "ricing".....Except this damn avenger with fake plastic hood scoops, wheels, a window banner, and nothing else and this kid acts like hes got a ferrari.

Except this damn avenger with fake plastic hood scoops, wheels, a window banner, and nothing else and this kid acts like hes got a ferrari.

Time to put his punk ass in his place. :D

Time to put his punk ass in his place. :D

Some kids were talking about taking his plastic hood scoops and putting them on the principals van.

well thanks to me there's a lot of car doors laying around in the streets that belong to ricers, i put them in there place while most people with fast cars don't even bother to race them i do it to show them just how slow there cars are. my girlfriend tells me all the time "pic on somebody your own horsepower" but i let them know that they are slow as hell.

In fact I dont even think that avenger has custom wheels just the scoops and banner.

Chris,

If you're wondering what the big deal is, i'll tell you: there are too many people with the same cars (like hondas for instance) that all have the same looking mods and stuff. People try to be independent but end out looking the same. Not only do these people argue over who's faster, they boast that they can beat anyone. "Anyone" are the people who hate hondas and other rice burners. When people make their hondas look fast, the think they're bad.... These people make others that own REAL cars hate hondas. SO, hondas are trashed to keep honda owners from thinking thier 16.5 sec cars are fast.

well thanks to me there's a lot of car doors laying around in the streets that belong to ricers, i put them in there place while most people with fast cars don't even bother to race them i do it to show them just how slow there cars are. my girlfriend tells me all the time "pic on somebody your own horsepower" but i let them know that they are slow as hell.

I hear you man. That's exactly what i'm doin in my town. Lots of rice burners think they're cool, but i put them in their place. So far, me:6 rice burners:0.

SO, hondas are trashed to keep honda owners from thinking thier 16.5 sec cars are fast.

Lol, my pickup was a whole second quicker stock. Stupid rice.

Around my city ,honda owners are praised , so i dont know what the deal is .

Civic owners are the cream of the crop around here .

:lol: You're hanging around the wrong crowd. That may be the case among the 16 year old street racer crowd, but nowhere is a Civic considered "cream of the crop" among the real "fast" guys. Can they be fast - yes. But there are many, many other cars that can be just as fast if not faster.

Originally Posted by Idelaysionl
But there are many, many other cars that can be just as fast if not faster.
hmmm, i would have said something more along the lines of, "almost every other car in existence is faster than a honda" but thats just me.

hmmm, i would have said something more along the lines of, "almost every other car in existence is faster than a honda" but thats just me.
Believe it or not, there ARE Hondas that are very fast.

hmmm, i'll go with my theory on aliens with this one, i'll believe it when i see it.

Believe it or not, there ARE Hondas that are very fast.

True, but not very many.

Why Do i Hate Hondas.. I dont :)

I Hate Honda Drivers who slap a big fancy wing on the trunk and put a bodykit and some flames on and pull up to my 64 Polara and think they have a chance.

Oh well, Whatever trips your trigger.

Hondas can bemade to be very fast. 9 and 10 second Civics/CRX's are not uncommon, there is a 7.something arather Civic in the States and PLENTY more running 13's and below.

It's not even that hard, with all the high quality tuning parts available.

Hondas can bemade to be very fast. 9 and 10 second Civics/CRX's are not uncommon, there is a 7.something arather Civic in the States and PLENTY more running 13's and below.

It's not even that hard, with all the high quality tuning parts available.


"9 and 10 second Civics/CRX's are not uncommon"

:rofl:

"It's not even that hard, with all the high quality tuning parts available."

You gotta be kidding right? Oh its not hard, :rolleyes: you just need about $25,000 + car and you get a un-streetable, unreliable car. For less money I would have a v8 and have something that is streetable/reliable and runs on pump-gas. Hell for THAT much $$ I would sure the hell expect better than a 10sec slip.

A moment in Highschool revisited...

Upon the first day, he drove his brand new civic to school. And was as cool as the rest of them. The second day behold, sporty seat covers and blue foamy steering wheel cover, his car was stylish as them. Dawn upon the third morning shinned brightly upon the engine mods, composing of an VTech logo and super glue, his car was faster then them. Upon then forth day he tinkered, and into the fifth, and finally the sixth day, the master mechanic finally completed his oil change. Soon to follow the coffee can tip (Screw on, non the less), two rear spoilers, since it was truly a face car, and fog lights (Guess somewhere it says somewhere in the owner manuals that fog lights make you see better at high speeds), and the most important of all, the offical "NOS" sticks on the windows, the most powerful of all upgrades. His car was complete and untouchable. For upon the thirteen day, he laid his car to park, and let the world star in awe as its highly powerful engine and superb exhuast system hummed like a honey bee. Heads turns and eyes glanced slowly, for he was now a god street racing. Up until his world was shattered with the murky red fluid oozed from his window as the cheese burger laid splattered upon his windows (With extra Ketchup). Laughter soon erupted and was drowned out in the sounds of an old Chevy small block 5.0 V8 on open exhuast :owned: . And soon was smoked by dozens of cars (Most stock), even a '87 Ford astro van, and most unrespectible of all, my moms minivan as he tryed to pass her in the turning lane at a red light.

And people wonder why people hate honda's since they where at one point the wet dream of all ricers.

Hondas can bemade to be very fast. 9 and 10 second Civics/CRX's are not uncommon, there is a 7.something arather Civic in the States and PLENTY more running 13's and below.

It's not even that hard, with all the high quality tuning parts available.

a 7 second civic, yippee. and what do you get with that? a completely unpractical car with giant Hoosier tires that cant do shit other than drive in a straight line while looking like a fag. and if its not all that hard, why is there only one? :smile:

Yes, you can drive a 10 second V8 car, in the rain, without compeletely chewing through the tyres. Very simple innit? Fucking hell, people who build drag cars have to be prepared for breakges, but fuck it, I don't drag, that's for idiots with ill-sorted suspension- probably why V8 owners love it so much.

With about US$10,000 work I bet I could turn my EG into a repectable track car that will wipe the floor with most V8 crap. Not bad for a $2000 car, has a good set-up to become an FWD track-monster. Honda are after all, the makers of some of the greatest-ever chassis'.

But I don't have US$10,000, nor do I even have enough to re-buy my car, so I won't do it, I'll jst save money and buy a JDM Intergra Type R, same effect, better engine

I just got a 1986 Porsche 944 turbo, holy crap is that thing fast, only cost me about 9 thousand and its a great car.............a lot of work was done has well over 300 horsepower, and I am hopefully going to purchase a stage 4 turbo system from a local tuner other people who have them get over 510 bhp,


RICER ALERT!!!!

don't know much about drifting do you.

PLEASE TELL ME YOUR FUCKING WITH US! YOU JUST SAID A FWD IS BETTER FOR DRIFTING OMG!

Yes, you can drive a 10 second V8 car, in the rain, without compeletely chewing through the tyres. Very simple innit? Fucking hell, people who build drag cars have to be prepared for breakges, but fuck it, I don't drag, that's for idiots with ill-sorted suspension- probably why V8 owners love it so much.



Yep, invest 10,000 in modifications into a $2000 heap, just to be upto par. Thats a GREAT idea! $12,000 spent on something thats worth less than $2,000 now. I knew I was doing something wrong this whole time! ;) Ill sorted suspension? I can tell you have no knowledge of what you speak, if you dont think suspension is key in drag racing, you sir are an idiot. :banghead:

Have you ever drove a 10sec V8? Most use a centrifugal SC or a turbo to get to those numbers. Power would kick in around 2800~ rpm. In every day driving I shift around 2100-2500. It would be a bitch to drive in the rain ofcoarse, but it would be ALOT easier than a 10sec Honda because FWD is meant for grocery getters, not performance cars, sorry.

grr too many post to read through but either way i'ma post on the subject if u guys detoured or already metioned this sry ...
I think the honda hatred stared witht he CIVIC it was made to be an economy car not a "race" car people got these cars and started saying how light it is and i can smoke anything on the street just b.c its lite ... yea its true alot of peeps have been able to get some nice tuning to there cars but the majority is wat kills it. then you got them follower with the nissan sentras omg lol thats all i gotta say... if u got an accord civic or other economy cars .... don't wasit ur money get a sport car and soup that up ;)

http://www.warehousemotors.com/store/item.asp?id=253 :X!! LOL LMAO! that says it all!

or if u really wanna c all the pics without clicking on all those links and see a funny trac vid then click here
http://cis8.lb.devry.edu/pcus6239/ricerocket

so that means you must live in imaginaryland...or wisconsin

hey now......

I agree, Hondas suck, they're the worst form of rice especially with the fucn fart cans....they piss me off too when they put the weird taillights on it, and they're hey man, this is cool, and i'm like hey man, no its not, shut up

plus, dude, wtf???

wisconsin?

im from wisconsin........well.......okay............they'r e a fucn load of ricers here, haha :banghead: :eek7:

Asians.........

Honda chassis aren't built for racing whoever it was that said that they build great chassis. S2000 yeah, NSX yeah, Civic NO!!! Accord NO!!!
And a chassis doesn't make a car great.

FWD Track monster? That's an oxy-moron when you are refering to civics and whatnot isn't it?

Honda chassis aren't built for racing whoever it was that said that they build great chassis. S2000 yeah, NSX yeah, Civic NO!!! Accord NO!!!
And a chassis doesn't make a car great.

FWD Track monster? That's an oxy-moron when you are refering to civics and whatnot isn't it?
Um OK...............Glad to see you are fully in the know about Hondas and FWD cars in General.............



Do these names mean anything to you?

Honda Integra Type R, Honda Prelude Type SH, Peugeot 205 GTi, Alfa Romeo 156, Peugeot 106 GTi, Alfa Romeo 147, Ford Mondeo ST220, Ford Focus ST170, VW Golf GTi Mk 1, 1969 Mini Cooper S, Citroen Xsara VTS, EK9 Honda Civic Type R, EF9 Honda Civic SiR.

These are a few of the examples of FWD cars that have been known to provide better handling than many RWD chassis' So yes I do believe FWD cars can make great track cars. Oh and all of these cars had economy car roots.

A chassis doesn't make a car great???? WTF??? It's about 60% of what makes a car great. The engine/Gearbox/Brakes are 15% (As it is easily swapped), Technology 10% and any other minor little stuff make up the rest.

If you have a crap chassis, you can't make a great car, simple as that. OK that's not true, Lotus turned a Lada into quite a stunning car on Top Gear once and that cost 100,000 pounds.


i love this mentality eh, "Oh it's a economy car aw! It is shit den eh b0e?" Notice how most people will criticise a Civic Type R or SiR and then not criticise a Neon SRT4???? Hypocrisy and bigotry IMHO.

That's not what i meant... Just because a car has a good chassis doesn't mean it is a good car...that's what i meant. And no, as much as you would like to believe, Honda chassis were meant to last, not race. You are talking to me like i know nothing about cars, that is aggravating. I'll be honest though, i know enough about Hondas to know that it's nothing i would buy. I'm driving a 1994 Honda Accord EX right now(for free while my other car is getting fixed), and i could tell you...I wont ever own one. Road course car, yeah it could be good, but for the strip i would rather have RWD. My car that i'm getting repaired is a FWD car(89 LeSabre T-Type),so yes i understand FWD quite a bit. After owning this car, i wont ever own another kind of car(Buick).

No one was talking about all those cars, they were talking about Civics, which is what i was refering to. You're talking to me about mechanical stuff? Have you ever even worked on an engine, or tranny? Of course chassis are 60% of the car, without it it wouldn't be a car now would it. Personally no, those names dont mean a darn thing to me, never will. How about this: 1987 Regal= Regal T-Type=Grand National=GNX. We soupe our cars up here to, start base and go from there.

You can "mention" all the cars you want. Those are all GARBAGE in any application when it comes to SERIOUS speed, be it at the track, and lets not even go into straught line... And PEUGEOT?!? OH MY GOODNESS!

i love this mentality eh, "Oh it's a economy car aw! It is shit den eh b0e?" Notice how most people will criticise a Civic Type R or SiR and then not criticise a Neon SRT4???? Hypocrisy and bigotry IMHO.

Well, now you're the one being ignorant. The SRT-4 only shares a few interior bits and some sheet metal with the Neon SXT. The chassis on the SRT-4 is different from any regular Neon. Z28 Josh is right. I have driven an Accord and I will say that it isn't a car I would like to take Auto-Xing. I don't know about the Civic but I doubt it is much better. These are economy cars that were never built with speed in mind.

Well, now you're the one being ignorant. The SRT-4 only shares a few interior bits and some sheet metal with the Neon SXT. The chassis on the SRT-4 is different from any regular Neon. Z28 Josh is right. I have driven an Accord and I will say that it isn't a car I would like to take Auto-Xing. I don't know about the Civic but I doubt it is much better. These are economy cars that were never built with speed in mind.
That's my point, the Civic SiR, especially in EF9 form has about as much in common with a dual-carb 1.5 Civic as the Neon and SRt4 do- maybe not as much as that, but still little in common.

You're starting to sound like a Skyline GTS/GTSt/GTS4 owner, they always accuse SiR's and Type Rs of being economy Civics and then get all defensive when someone points out that the performance Civics have as much in common with the humble Civic as thier errr....things have with the mighty GTR. Usually this is after they get beaten by an SiR or Type R.

As for the Accord, bah! the bigger US Market ones usually are awful, the Accord Type R served up in Europe and the Japanese market Euro R are the sporting Accords.

brodie50 STFU, you don't even get PEugeots in the USA, so what the hell do you know about them? The 206 GTi 180 is faster than every new car under NZ$40,000 (About US$25k) the only one that might stand a chance is the Neon SRT4, but I don't have any acceleration times handy, nor do I reckon it'd retail under $40k if they sold it here, so the relevance to me is nowt.

Like I said, bigotry.

How can you say that Peugeots are faster, when:

1: you dont have the stats to back up your claim.
2: you know nothing about american cars
3: you're biased toward that car, so it's not like anyone here will believe you anyway, unless you can prove it.
4: as for a 25K car, why dont we compare it to one of our sedans for good measure, lets say the 2004 Grand Prix GTP. You get some stats and ill give you mine.

You're probably the type of person who thinks the only good cars in the U.S. are the Viper and ZO6.

OK, the particular car I am reffering to.

Peugeot 206 GTi 180
Price: NZ$39,990
0-100 km/h: 6.89 seconds on Autocars VBox (Claimed: 7.4)
80-120 km/h: 4.49 seconds
100-0 km/h: 34.86 meters

Wieght: 1115 Kg (With full tank of gas)
Length: 3835 mm
Wheelbase: 2447mm
Width: 1900mm
Height: 1430mm

Weight distribution: 64:36 (F:R)

Engine: Transverse 4, displacing 2.0 litres through a 5 speed manual, obviously to the front wheels.

Power: 130Kw@7000rpm (180bhp)
Torque: 202nm@4750rpm


That is basically what you need tyo know, but those really say nothing about the amazing engineering done to make this baby handle, a drive of that can only justify it.


if you want proof of these (Think they are falsified), I'll happily photograph the portion of NZ Autocar that I got them them from, as my scanner is screw-loose.

I doubt a GTP woul be faster, especially if they use the Supercharged 3.8 still. The Commodores that use these engines aree something of a joke, especially to Ford (Falcon/XR/Fairmont) fans. The Commodore is lighter and also RWD, so I reckon the GTP'd be slower than the Commie-whore, hence I can't imagine it being faster.

Even still we've got to remember that cars, especially when new are cheaper in the US than over here and the currency of New Zealand is strong at the moment, while the US one is weak, so really, when you think about it, the 206 is damned good bag for buck, as it'd probably be about $15-17k if sold in the US.

That's my point, the Civic SiR, especially in EF9 form has about as much in common with a dual-carb 1.5 Civic as the Neon and SRt4 do- maybe not as much as that, but still little in common.

You're starting to sound like a Skyline GTS/GTSt/GTS4 owner, they always accuse SiR's and Type Rs of being economy Civics and then get all defensive when someone points out that the performance Civics have as much in common with the humble Civic as thier errr....things have with the mighty GTR. Usually this is after they get beaten by an SiR or Type R.

As for the Accord, bah! the bigger US Market ones usually are awful, the Accord Type R served up in Europe and the Japanese market Euro R are the sporting Accords.

brodie50 STFU, you don't even get PEugeots in the USA, so what the hell do you know about them? The 206 GTi 180 is faster than every new car under NZ$40,000 (About US$25k) the only one that might stand a chance is the Neon SRT4, but I don't have any acceleration times handy, nor do I reckon it'd retail under $40k if they sold it here, so the relevance to me is nowt.

Like I said, bigotry.

See, now that is a different story. Unfortunately we aren't lucky enough to get the SiR or the Type R Civic or Accord. You're right the chassis for the Type R and SiR are different from a normal Civic or Accord and is much stiffer.

I will also stand up for Peugeot. They dominated WRC last year, so they know how to build a chassis and suspension right. Also, don't knock it if you haven't driven it.

2004 Grand Prix GTP: Testing By: Pro Formance and sanctioned by the scca-

Comp G- $36,000
Road Course lap time: 43.328 Seconds
Quarter Mile: 15.015 Seconds
Braking 60-0: 112.3 Ft.
Lateral G's 100 ft.: .0827 G's
600 ft. Slalom: 62.47 seconds

Curb Weight: 3583 lbs.
Length: 198.3"
Width front: 61.6"
Width Rear: 61.3"
Height: 55.9"
Electronic Throttle Control
Horsepower:260 fwd
Torque: 280 lb-ft
Axle ratio: 3.29:1
Engine: S/C 3.8 ltre, SeriesIII 3800
Fuel cap.: 17.0 gallons
4 Speed tap shift/ Overdrive- 4T60E

Also, the 3.8 that GM uses is very different than what Ford uses.

Yep a Chevy 3.8 3800 is totally different from a Ford 3.8. The Chevy 3.8 series 2 is highly regarded.