94 Lesabre.. Tried Many Things..nothing is working

OK... this is so irritating ive changed my ignition module my fuel pressure relay.. changed my O2 sensor and the car still jumps and shuts off..

when i was accerelatiing the car... the rpm wont go past 4 it goes down.. will not go past 4.. can that be a problem..

last thing i might assume it is.. FUEL PUMP??..

someone please help me.. i need my 94 running

i changed the PCM and same thing happened..

and my car only has 51k original miles:banghead:

OK... this is so irritating ive changed my ignition module my fuel pressure relay.. changed my O2 sensor and the car still jumps and shuts off..

when i was accerelatiing the car... the rpm wont go past 4 it goes down.. will not go past 4.. can that be a problem..

last thing i might assume it is.. FUEL PUMP??..

someone please help me.. i need my 94 running

i changed the PCM and same thing happened..

and my car only has 51k original miles:banghead:

For the money you spent replacing good parts, you could have taken it to a good mechanic and got a proper diagnosis, which is exactly what I suggest you do now.

What do you mean by the car jumps and shuts off?
Does it jump and shut off when you put it in gear?

As for it not revving past 4? do you mean 4,000 RPMS, it might not rev that high if that is where the governor is set to, which won't cause any driveability probelms.

haha.. i aint wasted no money on parts.. i get them for free from my brother at auto zone..

the car shuts off no matter if its in Park or in Reverse Or In Drive.. it shuts off.. the rpm jumps up and down when its on park and it wanna shut off.. but then the service engine soon light comes on and the car stays on with the SES light.. pretty weird...

haha.. i aint wasted no money on parts.. i get them for free from my brother at auto zone..

the car shuts off no matter if its in Park or in Reverse Or In Drive.. it shuts off.. the rpm jumps up and down when its on park and it wanna shut off.. but then the service engine soon light comes on and the car stays on with the SES light.. pretty weird...

Does your brother own an Auto Zone? How did he get them?

5 parts...5 fingers. lol

haha.. i aint wasted no money on parts.. i get them for free from my brother at auto zone..

the car shuts off no matter if its in Park or in Reverse Or In Drive.. it shuts off.. the rpm jumps up and down when its on park and it wanna shut off.. but then the service engine soon light comes on and the car stays on with the SES light.. pretty weird...
The problem could be, FREE AUTO ZONE PARTS! :ylsuper:

haha.. i aint wasted no money on parts.. i get them for free from my brother at auto zone..

the car shuts off no matter if its in Park or in Reverse Or In Drive.. it shuts off.. the rpm jumps up and down when its on park and it wanna shut off.. but then the service engine soon light comes on and the car stays on with the SES light.. pretty weird...

I can't imagine you are driving in reverse at 4000 RPM's!So when you say it jumps and shuts off in Park,Reverse or Drive do you mean just your tach or is the engine RPM actually jumping around? It sounds like an electrical igmition problem to me, if it's missing at high RPM's.
BTW, I'm with you regarding not taking it in to a shop, especially if you can get parts easily. The reason we are on this forum in the first place is to try and fix cars ourselves.

I can't imagine you are driving in reverse at 4000 RPM's!So when you say it jumps and shuts off in Park,Reverse or Drive do you mean just your tach or is the engine RPM actually jumping around? It sounds like an electrical igmition problem to me, if it's missing at high RPM's.
BTW, I'm with you regarding not taking it in to a shop, especially if you can get parts easily. The reason we are on this forum in the first place is to try and fix cars ourselves.

Yes, but he has started FIVE posts about this car and its problem, none of which has helped him fix it because his problem needs professional diagnosis. He could go get a crank position sensor, ignition module, fuel pump, fuel filter, throttle position sensor, new injectors, new plugs and wires, a new cam magnet, etc. etc. but until he knows what is wrong, he is just throwing parts at it instead of finding out what is wrong. It is great to try not to take a car in, but once all the free advice does not fix your car, asking over and over again about it is not going to fix it.

Yes, but he has started FIVE posts about this car and its problem, none of which has helped him fix it because his problem needs professional diagnosis. He could go get a crank position sensor, ignition module, fuel pump, fuel filter, throttle position sensor, new injectors, new plugs and wires, a new cam magnet, etc. etc. but until he knows what is wrong, he is just throwing parts at it instead of finding out what is wrong. It is great to try not to take a car in, but once all the free advice does not fix your car, asking over and over again about it is not going to fix it.
Thanks spinne1, I couldn't of said it better myself! :lol:

BTW, T_MAK_510, Please Read: Af Community Guidlines (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/guidelines.html) especially this part; :nono:

BE COURTEOUS: AVOID DUPLICATE POSTS
Do not post the same discussion more than once on a discussion forum or on many forums. Duplicate discussions can be frustrating for other members, especially for those whose time and energy is limited. Weeding through the same discussion in multiple locations can be not only frustrating, but down right annoying. Duplicate discussions will be deleted. Reposting the same message repeatedly can be interpreted as SPAM and could result in the loss of your membership. Also be conscious of your fellow members and avoid making meaningless posts for the sole purpose of increasing your post count.

I agree with jerryls, the whole idea of the forum is to find help because you cannot afford to have it diagnosed and fixed by a mechanic.

and without a MIL it makes it even harder to locate the problem unless it is very obvious, I know I am a mechanic by trade, you could spend alot of money on diagnostics time.

I agree with jerryls, the whole idea of the forum is to find help because you cannot afford to have it diagnosed and fixed by a mechanic.

and without a MIL it makes it even harder to locate the problem unless it is very obvious, I know I am a mechanic by trade, you could spend alot of money on diagnostics time. I think the point spinne1 was trying to make here is; the OP has posted seven (7) threads this month, all similar, or related to the same problem. All of these threads/post should be confined to one thread! I addition, I feel confident that a good “mechanic by trade” would use proper diagnostic techniques to find the solution and not suggest throwing parts at the symptoms. Feel free to participate in any one, or all seven, listed below.

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=761425

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=761094

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759995

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=756700

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759948

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759950

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=756499

Well all those thread were a bit excessive, I agree.

but I never suggested throwing parts at it, I was just agreeing with jerry about the whole idea of this forum.

Well we know he cannot get it scanned for codes because the OBDII scanner or any diagnostic machine will not connect, this is probably due to a power short at the connector. Does anyone have the pin outs for the OBDII (16pin) or data link (GM-1 12 pin) connector on his vehicle, so he can trace the the power problem and get the codes checked?

'94 LeSabre is probably a 16-pin DLC. I'd wager a small beverage on that one.

Regardless, a proper scanner will access it, either a Tech (Vetronix) or MT2500 (SnapOn), and with the appropriate adapters should communicate BOTH WAYS. If there is no 12VDC power at the 16-pin DLC (Pin 16), check fuses. The 12-pin DLC uses external power, so it is a non-issue.

After having spent so much time on parts replacing, a diagnosis is going to be the best and fastest solution. Your brother at Ought-Tow-Zone is not likely going to be able to help, since I have seen none of them with the appropriate scanner to communicate with your vehicle. They don't even offer one for sale, so they likely don't have one to use.

The 94 lesabre do use the OBDII (16 pin) DLC, but either way if the scanner does not get power it cannot retrieve anything.

and autozone does have the scan tool (actron) to retrieve trouble codes for OBDII, but will not help in this situation if the scantool will not connect.

Sounds to me like you would be stuck going to a GM dealer to get the codes read.

That's not the case at all. As I mentioned previously, an MT2500 will access and control the PCM (bi-directional), and they are a lot more prevalent in the service world than Vetronix (Tech or Tech-II) scanners, at about ten times more places than dealerships. I have two (one working), plus cartridges, adapters, keys, and cables, and don't even work professionally (full time) on autos. It's a little like buying a good torque wrench or oscilloscope. If you're serious about working on your vehicles, you need some tools.

I understand (and acknowledged) that a lack of power at Pin 16 might be a problem, and might even require a new fuse to enable the scan (Wow - That might cost an extra 35¢ or more!). With an MT2500, you can depress the internal power (battery) button and at least scan the ALDL for communication.

Further, the Actron tools will not communicate with the 1994-95 GM PCMs that are hybrid OBD (OBD1.5" as they are somethimes called) PCMs and ECMs.

I think the point spinne1 was trying to make here is; the OP has posted seven (7) threads this month, all similar, or related to the same problem. All of these threads/post should be confined to one thread!

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=761425

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=761094

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759995

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=756700

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759948

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=759950

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=756499

:yikes:........:shakehead

Thread merge. :grinyes:

That's not the case at all. As I mentioned previously, an MT2500 will access and control the PCM (bi-directional), and they are a lot more prevalent in the service world than Vetronix (Tech or Tech-II) scanners, at about ten times more places than dealerships. I have two (one working), plus cartridges, adapters, keys, and cables, and don't even work professionally (full time) on autos. It's a little like buying a good torque wrench or oscilloscope. If you're serious about working on your vehicles, you need some tools.

I understand (and acknowledged) that a lack of power at Pin 16 might be a problem, and might even require a new fuse to enable the scan (Wow - That might cost an extra 35¢ or more!). With an MT2500, you can depress the internal power (battery) button and at least scan the ALDL for communication.

Further, the Actron tools will not communicate with the 1994-95 GM PCMs that are hybrid OBD (OBD1.5" as they are somethimes called) PCMs and ECMs.

Well I did not know GM 94 and 95 models were not OBDII, I just know they have the OBDII connector and my SOLUS PRO (SNAPON) uses the OBDII adapter and key 13 to connect to the 94 LeSabre computer, this is why I suspected it to be OBDII.

As he mentioned before he tried to have it scanned but there machine would not connect, I don't know if it was a power problem at the connector or comunication problem with the computer or if it was just a cheap code reading scanner like actron or if it was a diagnostic scanner, like MT2500, techII, Solus, solus pro, modis, mentor, etc.

Just a thought, I would upgrade to the new Solus or Pro, or even the modis. The MT2500 is obsolete, in 2008 Snap-On will no longer be making updates (cartridges) for the MT2500. Although may not affect you since you don't use yours for business.

Well I did not know GM 94 and 95 models were not OBDII, I just know they have the OBDII connector and my SOLUS PRO (SNAPON) uses the OBDII adapter and key 13 to connect to the 94 LeSabre computer, this is why I suspected it to be OBDII.

You have to be a little careful with the '94-95 GMs, since some are ALMOST ODB-II. I've encountered them both ways - With a 12-pin and a 16-pin. My '94 Impala has a 12-pin but is not the old ALDL style, so no jumpering will reveal codes. It takes a bi-directional scanner, the right adapter, and the 16-pin types can use either a K-9 or K-13. On the other side, I've worked on some '94-95 trucks that are the old ECM and, and jumpering still flashes the MIL. Of course, the red brick works better for those, too.

For newer (fully OBD-II compliant) systems, I have Auto-Tap for everything through CAN bus systems, but the brick is still faster and easier for all but serious data logging.