Recap of the Japanese F1 fleet - Take 2

Going to throw a curve ball in here, why opt for a very low milage example unless you do NOT intend to use it, my preference would be to go for something that I would be happy to use and not worry that I was depreciating it by adding milage.

Depreciate? The rate the price of these cars is going, I think you'll recoup the short term value lost with some mileage in just 5 years or so...

At this rate, I will never even remotely come close to owning an F1, LOL! Not even a GTR, which historically have been cheaper (28R will get rid of that notion).

With every year that goes by, more and more people will realize how important and special this car is compared to whatever new thing that comes out (and doesn't go on to win races). I don't see a bubble forming under these cars let alone any substantial "depreciation" (more like slower appreciation).

Cheers - 1 vote = $1, so only a few more to go :p

I would take the blue protective tape off the door sills ...

I gather that (along with the yellow tag on the key) is there because it was recently serviced in Woking? There is no blue protective tape in the pictures on the first page of this thread... No matter, such a beautiful car!!

That set of photos was taken in May 2008.

>8^)
ER

My term depreciation was intended to portray making it less valuable than an ultra low milage example. We all know these beasts are not going to depreciate unless owning cars becomes illegal?

New shot of #25R posted on Hitotsuyama Racing's FB page. :thumbsup:

http://i47.tinypic.com/15cycxu.jpg (http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/620697_349956921759469_744433828_o.jpg)

Click for a bigger smile. :)

>8^)
ER

Where is it? I've never seen this one before.

Are you sure about that Mike? We saw it quite recently:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=6972121&postcount=342

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=6972412&postcount=346

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=6972884&postcount=348

Plus we have seen it in that storage building before back in 2006, still wearing the Tajimax livery at the time.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/219647ac_M.jpg

>8^)
ER

OK, I guess I have seen it.

Lewis Hamilton shared this photo on Instagram:

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/69152_369730299774971_1343061715_n.jpg

"On way to Tokyo, this is some guys garage we stopped at.....not bad huh!"

Seems this is where the ZAZ Museum collection cars have ended up.

>8^)
ER

Look - over there, in the corner... ;)
>8^)
ER

^^ what he said.....

Hopefully Lewis was there to make an offer on LM2 since he won't be getting his hands on XP1 LM anymore.

>8^)
ER

that would be something.

Then it MIGHT get back to the UK:)

Hopefully Lewis was there to make an offer on LM2 since he won't be getting his hands on XP1 LM anymore.

>8^)
ER

That's the first thing that came to mind when I saw that pic...

It took me a while to notice, but I do notice a grey car that appears to be #058
GT to the right of the LM :)

Correct sir. :)

>8^)
ER

Old (and small :eek7:) pics of #006 prior to the sale in late 2008.

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/atmclf1lm/X051053A.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/atmclf1lm/X051053E.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/atmclf1lm/X051053B.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/atmclf1lm/X051053C.jpg

http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad83/atmclf1lm/X051053D.jpg

Thanks to Erik for the description. He said to keep it short.

Best regards.

The F1 GT is being displayed at the Japan International Machine Tool Fair for Mazak, builder of high tech manufacturing systems used by McLaren - Link (http://minkara.carview.co.jp/en/userid/238073/blog/28207970/)

http://i47.tinypic.com/2lb10co.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/A6q_efTCMAA2D-8jpglarge.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_1993f309f4.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/1993f309f4.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_A6lnPbZCcAA0ltMjpglarge.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/A6lnPbZCcAA0ltMjpglarge.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_c7a3c518f0.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/c7a3c518f0.jpg) <-- Click

You might recall the owner's F1 LM and pearl white Enzo were also on display in Mazak's factory at one point several years back.

Thanks to bluespaceoddity for the tip! :cool:

>8^)
ER

Have they sold their F1LM to Lewis yet? :uhoh:

Its the only way, that he will get his hands on one now :p

It's wonderful when you can find a picture that was taken 30 minutes ago.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/A6v4TP5CQAAdzFu.jpg

The show runs through Tuesday in Japan if anyone cares to jump on a plane. :naughty:

Here's another pair that are clickable:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_nx1zk.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/nx1zk.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_681112410.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/681112410.jpg)

I can't believe the number of people that will get to see this thing who won't necessarily understand what an amazingly rare opportunity it is to see a GT. The caption on this photo did get it right though:

世界に3台しかないマクラーレンF1 GTモデル --> McLaren F1 GT model there are only three in the world

http://i50.tinypic.com/1zl3j2v.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/juvdzr.jpg

Hopefully there will be some better images surfacing over the next few days.

>8^)
ER

Here's two I like! :sunglasse

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_z09ycr.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/z09ycr.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_w8iqx.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/w8iqx.jpg)

>8^)
ER

Japan is a busy place these days - look what BingoSports are advertising (http://www.bingosports.co.jp/BbsDetail/pattern_c/shop_632-2/bbs_01/article_0000235/css_1016/type_2.html) now!!!! :yikes: :ylsuper:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_632-2_01_0000235_1L.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/632-2_01_0000235_1L.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_632-2_01_0000235_2L.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/632-2_01_0000235_2L.jpg) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_632-2_01_0000235_3L.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/632-2_01_0000235_3L.jpg)

Here it is in the showroom two days ago...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/th_A6nc-0yCQAALXUcjpglarge.jpg (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20L/A6nc-0yCQAALXUcjpglarge.jpg)

With both of these cars available to see I have never wanted to be in Tokyo so bad in my whole life then right this instant. :shakehead

>8^)
ER

Someones added a bigger pic of the GT over on flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/the2belo/8153507969/sizes/k/in/photostream/)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v245/hurstg01/8153507969_46fbef860c_k.jpg

It needs its headlight covers re-done, they look a little tired. I'll be [selflessly] willing to go over and change them in exchange for free flights, accommodation and passes to the show ;)

Is there some kind of link between Bingo and Art Sports?

Not that I am aware of. :dunno:

>8^)
ER

amazing stuff

Hi friends. One question, the GT grey is the chasis number 58, or is other.

Thanks a lot.

Yes - this is '58F1GT', the same one on the cover of your new magazine.

I've always wondered what it says on the GT chassis plates though - 058 or what's written on the DA poster. Was hoping to get our answer with the car being shown in Tokyo, but it is looking rather unlikely again.

>8^)
ER

Not going to rehost them (should be sleeping...), but 6 great shots of the GT found here:

http://microdepot.cocolog-nifty.com/blog/2012/11/post-84b1.html

>8^)
ER

Image from Nov 6th of #029 on Bingo Sport's showroom floor:

http://i46.tinypic.com/2u9nz47_th.jpg (http://i46.tinypic.com/2u9nz47.jpg)

I have also now seen documented proof that #029 was indeed the F1 painted "Creighton Brown". Most here will recall a long discussion over this, and the fact that the Chassis History poster included with "Driving Ambition" had this info backwards with #039. I can't share the proof, but no longer have any reason to question it.

>8^)
ER

I am not sure if this has been posted, but here are some shots of #012 :wink::wink:


http://www.d2.dion.ne.jp/~kashimay/990505_2.htm

BingoSports have finally listed #029 in their Tokyo showroom stocklist including some new photos:

http://i48.tinypic.com/288xjlk.jpg (http://www.bingosports.co.jp/StockDetail1/shop_632-2/car_216/cate_0/design_2206/css_1021/shop_disp_1/window_NEW.html)

^^^ Click :)

>8^)
ER

Still never going to sell at that price; as soon as other F1 prices come close to that one it seems the seller wants a little more....

I'd give it a good home though :)

Still never going to sell at that price; as soon as other F1 prices come close to that one it seems the seller wants a little more....

I'd give it a good home though :)

My two cent here is that these cars are just getting to their market price. The winning cars are close to the 20 year mark. I'll bet you a pint and a steak, place of your choice, that within the next 2 years until the 20th Le Mans anniversary, we see the road cars at $6-8MM USD and the winning race cars $2-5 above that if their sold again.

Remember, those of us who were young men when these cars were winning and we fell in love with them, are just now coming into the money to buy them from the older, wiser, richer gents who could afford them new, (all due respect and no offense to those owners of course!) and those guys are going to make us pay for them. :banghead:

ps. I heard but can't verify that LM3 went for more than this asking price, but don't quote me.

My two cent here is that these cars are just getting to their market price. The winning cars are close to the 20 year mark. I'll bet you a pint and a steak, place of your choice, that within the next 2 years until the 20th Le Mans anniversary, we see the road cars at $6-8MM USD and the winning race cars $2-5 above that if their sold again.

Remember, those of us who were young men when these cars were winning and we fell in love with them, are just now coming into the money to buy them from the older, wiser, richer gents who could afford them new, (all due respect and no offense to those owners of course!) and those guys are going to make us pay for them. :banghead:

ps. I heard but can't verify that LM3 went for more than this asking price, but don't quote me.

What "winning race cars"? 01R? The GTRs sell for less than the road cars so I'm not sure why they would go for more than those in 2 years let alone $2-5 million over them.

What "winning race cars"? 01R? The GTRs sell for less than the road cars so I'm not sure why they would go for more than those in 2 years let alone $2-5 million over them.

In my business I've made a very comfortable living picking winners, identifying trends and making the right moves while others went down the drain in their positions and became realtors, IT guys and stay at home dads. Its what I do. (no offense to those but Trading isn't for everyone) I even mentioned the future prices of these cars I believe in a thread 2005 or so when I suggested that the guys here who really wanted to own one of these cars, before they got out of range, they should do it as a group. Even Frank S. joined me on that one.

Read my post here again, I said winning cars. The cars ran for 3-5 years (and more), they won races, placed first second third and so forth. The Le Mans cars, yup even old 13th place have excellence provenance. They are extremely rare and very serviceable (tks Ron & Co.) and drive-able. Unlike your Tyrell P34 would be or most "race cars" to middle aged rich guys who drive businesses. I also said that us younger guys are up and coming, making money, getting into the real car game...no 911's, not M3's and Gallardos or Budget Mac's (although those are very nice) but Real Cars. 250GTO's, F1's, P3's...real cars. Simon K. Andy B. Dhani H. and others are guys my age and now or becoming of net worth...and to own what we've always coveted...yup...


In case you missed it:
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1070168&page=8
Look for Erik's post about the price of #15R...My bet is it was $4.5-6MM USD.
Top end Road car pricing...


Cheers~
Wayne

15R's sale price wasn't the only one to eclipse the going rate for road cars at the time. There were two others as I mentioned in my comments there.

I've often suspected there would be a time when the tables turned on road car and GTR values. Safe to say we have reached that point with the right GTRs for the right customers but we may not have achieved parity on all of them just yet.

>8^)
ER

Not really news, but ArtSports have a 'SOLD' page for #029 on their website now with some photos I've not seen before:

http://www.wintel.co.jp/wintel/owa/pspe_stock_detail1?&in_shopno=470-1&in_carno=205

>8^)
ER

. . . I'll bet you a pint and a steak, place of your choice, that within the next 2 years until the 20th Le Mans anniversary, we see the road cars at $6-8MM USD. . . .

Hypothetically speaking, if 029 was sold within the $6-8 range (I wouldn't bat an eyelid if it were closer to 8), will this increase the insured values of all the other road cars? Even though conditions/miles vary widely, I'm amazed at the way the F1 defies depreciation.

A friend brought it to my attention that BingoSports website now shows the McLaren as 'Sold'.

Will be interesting to see if that proves to be true and wherever it might end up next.

>8^)
ER

On the heels of #029 being marked sold on ArtSports' website, they now appear to have a very different F1 in their inventory! :yikes:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v482/Peloton25/McLaren%20F1%20M/470-1_01_0000291_1.jpg

Our best guess on this one has always been chassis #060. The signature of Gordon Murray is present on the rear bumper, which is just how we saw it before.

http://www.wintel.co.jp/wintel/owa/pspe_bbs_c_detail?in_shop_no=470-1&in_bbsno=01&in_articleno=0000291&in_cssno=1004&in_ref_page=

Their description is a bit choppy when translated:

1996 McLaren F1 Brand new
Sport has become a solid art ordered from zero at the McLaren car. Store air conditioning remains unregistered car collector about 17 years until now, remains that have been delivered from notes and McLaren McLaren has put the glass on the outside when delivered new car, the car also curing sheet. It will be extremely valuable McLalen F1 car of the world. To Show Car will become, I feel proud to sport performance art that was imported also, that there are in Japan McLaren miracle.

Rather amazed to see this car surface now. Unfortunately they've only shared one photo so far, but hopefully it will be the first of many.

>8^)
ER

Interesting!
Still remember watching the ELG video at the time. 7 1/2 years ago.

In this game, it's all about waiting :D
Hope it's in a good state.

This is gonna be an expensive one. Its still on delivery mileage, right?

Delivery and service mileage - as part of the McLaren service process does require the car be road tested. It does appear this one is being cared for too, at least in one respect, because it has a set of the Bridgestone tires fitted, though perhaps they were on the car since new?

>8^)
ER

Would love that one :)

Christ, I love yellow F1's but #029 is almost perfect.

Which would I choose if I had the money?

Hopefully it gets out and gets used by whoever buys it.

Some small chance this car has simply been purchased by ArtSports to be held onto and not necessarily for sale. I believe they did the same with #029 for several years. Certainly with the direction prices are moving this isn't a bad idea but the point is that it may not go anywhere quick.

The reason I mention this is I have translated the headline announcing this car on the main page of their site and the result is "ArtSport Collection" and it does not yet appear in their stock list.

>8^)
ER

It´s cool to see current pics because for many years we had no pics at all.
Maybe Henry can say us if the car was cared after by the factory.

I wonder if 029 and 060 could be connected.

ArtSports have updated their site with more photos of what should almost certainly be #060. No shot of the interior, but it is quite clear that all the plastic still remains giving the next owner the chance to unwrap their very own 'new' F1.

http://www.wintel.co.jp/wintel/owa/pspe_stock_detail1?in_categorize=0&in_group_id=&in_shopno=470-1&in_carno=208

One odd thing I just noticed - they appear to have photoshopped out Gordon Murray's signature from the rear bumper in the photo on their website... :screwy: :shakehead

>8^)
ER

#013, and now [potentially] this one losing GM's signature :(

amazing 060!

Any chance it goes to Europe?:):P

Yes Patrick - they are only considering potential owners from the Netherlands just to make it easy for you. ;) :p

>8^)
ER

yep: me:)

Do you think the car was serviced regularly by the factory ?

Dud adverts - check out the Kawahra Website and they have Andys GTR for sale, #27R, #19R, 2 F1 road cars etc etc

It just drives traffic to their website and aren't selling them

Ok Greg, what a mess ! we delete our posts ?

edit i deleted

This write-up recently appeared on Yahoo! Autos in regards to 060's availability. The last paragraph seems to be the only one approaching 90% accuracy...

http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/rare-mclaren-f1-sale-zero-miles-odometer-185433395.html

I thought briefly about posting the correct link to Wintel, but decided against it.

Yes - a blog called Daily Auto Fix dreamed up the story of zero miles, and wrote an article about that which has since gone viral. It's literally been repeated in a dozen places so far, with the big exceptions being AutoBlog and Jalopnik so far as I can tell. It was my efforts on another forum that got Yahoo's version of the article updated - those are my comments they used, not necessarily how I would have composed them, but at least it makes the article more accurate than it was.

>8^)
ER

Yes - a blog called Daily Auto Fix dreamed up the story of zero miles, and wrote an article about that which has since gone viral. It's literally been repeated in a dozen places so far, with the big exceptions being AutoBlog and Jalopnik so far as I can tell. It was my efforts on another forum that got Yahoo's version of the article updated - those are my comments they used, not necessarily how I would have composed them, but at least it makes the article more accurate than it was.

>8^)
ER

OK, just read through the Vortex thread; many thanks. Very interesting to read about the regular care 060 has received over the years, though I'm amazed no pictures of it being flatbedded for servicing have ever surfaced.

58F1GT, why did they ever change the lovely burgundry!?

The car was 'refreshed' and the colour change was part of that :)