Zap-A-Gap for resin kits

[TurboGuru]

Hi guys

I've tried searching google and this forum for this but haven't really found anything concrete.

I'm expecting to receive my first 'resin' kit in a few weeks and I am buying the additional tools that I will need.

I've read up on some good articles about resin preparation, such making sure I clean the mold releasing agent etc... and how you can't use certain glues and it needs to be CA based (superglue).

A lot of people seem to recommend "Zap-A-Gap"



Here are some questions I have:

1. Zap-A-Gap is a CA glue right? but it can also be used to cover gaps such as deep scratches/small pits? - does this mean once its cured I just simply sand down the excess? On my tamiya kits I've always used Tamiya putty for this kind of thing... can I still use Tamiya Putty on a resin model....or should I just use CA?

2. Super glue / CA has a really really fast curing time and this worries me. I normally like to pour a drop of poly cement glue on some scrap card and then with a toothpick apply the glue lightly on my model parts. This has worked very well for me, I rarely ever get glue on unwanted places by using this method.

Aren't super glues / CA more like liquid compared to poly cemement in a tube, I can't see myself using the same method of a toothpick for CA. Not only would the glue soak straight through the card but it would probably cure by the time I got it on the toothpick? From the images of the bottle I really don't see a brush attached to the cap. Whats the best method to apply it 'cleanly'.

3. Finally, Zap-A-Gap also comes in 'extra thin' versions, again these seem appealing but the curing team is even faster, I think I would definetley need a brush for this... is the 'extra thin' version worth a shot too?


I'm normally practice on spare body parts to find out what works and what doesn't, but since this is a resin kit (a lot of $$$) I really don't want to mess it up and so I would appreciate any advice from those who have experienced CA glues with Resin kits.

Thanks!

[ZoomZoomMX-5]

It's perfect for resin & plastic. Yes, it's liquid, but thickness is in between liquid cement and the old tube glues, kind of like syrup. I generally have a mixing card with the Zap a Gap (yes, it's CA), and use toothpicks/craft sticks to apply the glue. I apply the glue to the surface that another part is going to mate, then apply that part. It dries reasonably quick, but I always use an accelerator...once it's in place & I hit w/a drip of accelerator, the part is set. I hate waiting. I quit using old tube glues years ago. Waaaaay too slow for me. I test fit a part to make sure it fits before applying CA glue.

You can use a drop of this stuff to fill small areas...if it's bodywork that needs to be sanded flush, you really do need to hit it w/an accelerator & sand it immediately, after an hour it crystallizes and is harder than the plastic around it. When it's first cured it's about the same hardness as the plastic, easy to sand down. When gluing the front/back half of seats, I apply a generous bead of the CA all around the joint, zap it with accelerator, and then sand away the excess with sanding sticks. No waiting for putty to dry. A seat can be done in minutes...not overnight.

Sometimes I'll use a medium CA, the thin ones are a bit dangerous IMHO, I haven't needed super thin CA in all the years I've been building, the Zap a Gap is my CA of choice for building 90% of any model. I use liquid styrene cement to glue sub assemblies prior to painting, and canopy glue for clear items, and epoxy when I need a really permanent bond.

[TurboGuru]

Thanks for the reply Zoom.

Yeah I will definitely get this then, I might also buy the Zap De-Bonder, probably worth it incase I ever need to unglue something.

I didn't think you would have to use an accelerator since most superglues cure really quickly don't they?

Anyhow, I did a quick search and found this:

ZIP Kicker - Accelerator



I'll probably grab one of these along with the debonder and 'zap-a-gap' of course!

[Khier]

I use 2 component epoxy. It is not comfortable to deal with but I do not have to sorry about curing times.

[Didymus]

Zap-a-Gap is one of many brands of medium-thickness CA. I prefer Gorilla's Superglue (also CA). It's about the same thickness as ZaG and it's used exactly the same way.

The advantage is that it contains rubber so it's less brittle and more resistant to shock. And it doesn't have that strong CA smell. And, IMO, it has a better cap.

Yes, you will need an accelerator. Thick CA dries much more slowly than the thin stuff.

(Gorilla's Superglue should NOT be confused with Gorilla Glue. It's completely different stuff.)

[CrateCruncher]

A book could be written on the subject of adhesives in modeling thanks to all the great products available now. I use 2-part epoxy for strength on 75% of my avg model. It also allows time to position accurately. It seems like supeglues tend to bond the instant they contact if you need to position something accurately but remain liquid for an eternity when location is goof-proof. Go figure.

When using ca I transfer it to the parts using a straight pin from a drop placed on a piece of printed paperboard like a cut up square from a cereal box. Using the pin and sealed paperboard minimizes absorption and gives about 15 minutes before the glue drop dries out. A pin can be cleaned with a #11 quickly.

I use the thin stuff for filling shallow depressions and gaps because of its self-leveling qualities. I use accelerator on big RC models when tacking but not on fine-scale stuff. The accelerator causes such a fast reaction that gas is trapped in the bond making it a bit weaker and causing a rough surface in my experience. I guess it's a preference thing. I'm not in that big a hurry anyway. Then there's that oily residue.

Most ca bonds are weak and brittle between non-porous surfaces. The more porous each surface is, the stronger the bond. Example1: fabric to soft balsa = extremely strong. Example2: brass to aluminum = snap!

[Didymus]

Originally Posted by CrateCruncher

... The accelerator causes such a fast reaction that gas is trapped in the bond making it a bit weaker and causing a rough surface in my experience. I guess it's a preference thing. I'm not in that big a hurry anyway. Then there's that oily residue.

Right on all three counts! If the joint needs a lot of strength, I don't use accelerator. But then I have to plan how to hold everything in place until the CA dries. I've used poster tack, masking tape, rubber bands, all kinds of clamps, gravity, weights, tweezers, Liqui-tape from Microscale, my fat fingers, and other methods that I can't remember.

Keep in mind that you don't want get glue on anything but the joint. Or to glue your fingers or other holding devices to your model!

I sure haven't found the perfect solution. For me, positioning and neatly gluing small parts is still the hardest thing about modeling.

[klutz_100]

Originally Posted by CrateCruncher

A book could be written on the subject of adhesives in modeling thanks to all the great products available now. I use 2-part epoxy for strength on 75% of my avg model. It also allows time to position accurately. It seems like supeglues tend to bond the instant they contact if you need to position something accurately but remain liquid for an eternity when location is goof-proof. Go figure.

When using ca I transfer it to the parts using a straight pin from a drop placed on a piece of printed paperboard like a cut up square from a cereal box. Using the pin and sealed paperboard minimizes absorption and gives about 15 minutes before the glue drop dries out. A pin can be cleaned with a #11 quickly.

I use the thin stuff for filling shallow depressions and gaps because of its self-leveling qualities. I use accelerator on big RC models when tacking but not on fine-scale stuff. The accelerator causes such a fast reaction that gas is trapped in the bond making it a bit weaker and causing a rough surface in my experience. I guess it's a preference thing. I'm not in that big a hurry anyway. Then there's that oily residue.

Most ca bonds are weak and brittle between non-porous surfaces. The more porous each surface is, the stronger the bond. Example1: fabric to soft balsa = extremely strong. Example2: brass to aluminum = snap!

212,34%
Adhesives are like paintbrushes - sure you can paint everything and anything with just the one brush, but in reality there are individual brushes best suited for certain painting jobs so you get the best results if you have a selection of brushes.

Same story with glues. Better to have a selection of types of adhesives at at hand (especially that they are about the cheapest supply material you will buy )

All in all my favourites and constant companions are Tamiya thin (applies with on old paint brush), no-name 5 minute epoxy and BSI thin non-fogging CA.

To apply CA I have a ton of old sewing needles from which I remove half of the eye to leave a "Y". The points are pushed and glued into old bits of sprue. With this tool it is super easy and clean to pick up one drop of glue, move it to the part and watch it run into the joint by capillary action.

I use freebie CDs and DVDs as adhesive pallettes.

[Didymus]

Originally Posted by klutz_100

All in all my favourites and constant companions are Tamiya thin (applies with on old paint brush), no-name 5 minute epoxy and BSI thin non-fogging CA.

Is that the Tamiya "Extra Thin"? Is it a solvent like the Testors Plastic Cement that comes in a bottle?

Is the BSI the Supergold?

Ddms

[ZoomZoomMX-5]

Originally Posted by Didymus

Is that the Tamiya "Extra Thin"? Is it a solvent like the Testors Plastic Cement that comes in a bottle?

Ddms

Yes, the Tamiya extra thin (with green cap) is probably the world's best liquid glue. Like Tamiya sprays/primers & Tamiya compounds, the thin cement beats others at their own game because it's both a great liquid styrene cement & also has an incredibly useful little brush that's not quite a normal brush that makes application so easy.

This stuff is very highly regarded by most all my modeling friends...and myself. Once you get some, you quit even thinking about Testors...

[TurboGuru]

yeah my Tamiya extra thin arrived the other day, its a great product and the fine tip brush (part of the cap) really makes it even easier to work with.

Thats something I was hoping a CA glue would have (brush-cap) but I'm used to using fine sticks, needles etc, so that will be fine anyway.

Zap is available widely where I live so I think it will be the best option for me... I've already spent enough money importing paints etc from Hong Kong.... damn the E.U for label regulations.... damn impossible to get popular Tamiya paints in the UK now!

[chato de shamrock]

I'm feeling a little tired from lack of sleep and work so please correct me if im wrong, but did I correctly read some of you guys use accelerator on Zap a Gap? That bottle pictured on Turbo's O.P. dries in about 10 to 15 seconds. How much faster do you guys want things to cure? You have to test fit things before you apply that otherwise you'll go through some problems and a mess. Zap a Gap will fog things up so be careful to use around chrome or clear parts. I only use this to glue photo etch or some plastic to plastic parts that I dont trust regular modelers glue to get the job done (such as chopping up the chassis/parts to lower the ride height). I used Tamiya putty to cover up areas on my resin kits and it worked great. Unless you're on top of your game I'd say just practice patience and avoid glue messes.

[TurboGuru]

chato,

So its fine to use Tamiya putty on resin...it will stick ok? .... thats great! I'm used to working with it and wasn't sure if I could use it on resin kits!

Zap-A-Gap appears on most hobbyshop/moddlers web sites so I'm presuming its a decent product for modelmaking but your right, caution is required...

There was another thread here recently about someone who was trying to get glue off clear parts, so if the worst happens then I'm sure it will be salvageable.... I try to use as little glue as possible... most of the time this works great....sometimes I don't apply enough but this is usually rare.

[ZoomZoomMX-5]

Originally Posted by chato de shamrock

I'm feeling a little tired from lack of sleep and work so please correct me if im wrong, but did I correctly read some of you guys use accelerator on Zap a Gap? That bottle pictured on Turbo's O.P. dries in about 10 to 15 seconds. How much faster do you guys want things to cure? You have to test fit things before you apply that otherwise you'll go through some problems and a mess. Zap a Gap will fog things up so be careful to use around chrome or clear parts. I only use this to glue photo etch or some plastic to plastic parts that I dont trust regular modelers glue to get the job done (such as chopping up the chassis/parts to lower the ride height). I used Tamiya putty to cover up areas on my resin kits and it worked great. Unless you're on top of your game I'd say just practice patience and avoid glue messes.

It doesn't cure that fast on it's own (though it is faster than ancient styrene tube glue), and if you use the accelerator the fogging will not happen (I've been using it for nearly 2 decades this way, fogging has not been an issue whatsoever). For small filling jobs it's much better than waiting for putty to dry, doesn't matter if it's plastic or resin you're filling. You don't have to have glue on parts to test fit them. Dry fit first to see how it fits...then use glue...

[TurboGuru]

Good point zoom, I do tend to leave putty for a good 24 hours.... zap-a-gap could save a lot time!