some SOB totalled my Spec V...

[Steiner]

Some old man with his head up his ass plowed in to my 2002 Spec V w/less than 20,000 miles. Except for some minor cuts, scrapes, and bruises I'm OK (thanks primarily to the side airbags), but the car is totalled. It's 110% his fault, so it will be time to start looking for a new car again as soon as the crooks at his insurance get things finalized.

I'm posting here because I'm hoping some folks here might be able to give me some 1st hand experience because I've now narrowed my search down to 2 different cars...the SRT-4 and the WRX.

The Spec V was fast when I bought it (mainly because my prior ride was a '91 Buick w/200k miles on it ), but it came up a little short in the horsepower dep't over time. For those interested, it was a great little car, with an amazing Rockford Fosgate sound system, impressive handling, and comfortable seats. However I never really fell in love w/the shifter or the overall gearing. Like "Car and Driver" said, you never really forget that it's just a small car w/a big engine.

Whatever car I buy, I WON'T be modifying it. I will be leaving it as stock because I intend to lease. Please keep that in mind if you have recommendations.

Sorry for the long post, but I wanna make the right decision this time around. Thanks in advance.

EDIT...I added a picture of my car.

[BLU CIVIC]

i'm sure the srt-4 is a fast ride but i'd rather have the WRX....seems more of a fun drive...especially in the winter and dirt roads...but i'd get it for the 4wd

[Steiner]

OOPS...I forgot to mention that I live in the Bay Area, so fortunately overall driveability in exteme weather conditions will not be a factor in my decision. I also own an SUV so I won't be asking this car to get me and my snowboard up to the mountains.

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by Steiner

Some old man with his head up his ass plowed in to my 2002 Spec V w/less than 20,000 miles. Except for some minor cuts, scrapes, and bruises I'm OK (thanks primarily to the side airbags), but the car is totalled. It's 110% his fault, so it will be time to start looking for a new car again as soon as the crooks at his insurance get things finalized.

I'm posting here because I'm hoping some folks here might be able to give me some 1st hand experience because I've now narrowed my search down to 2 different cars...the SRT-4 and the WRX....

I'm gonna leave the mechanical and speed aspects to others and focus on safety. I know, everyone says, "You don't buy a car to crash it," but as I know, and you just found out, even the best drivers get run into by the worst from time to time. Happened to me twice already.
You also already found out the benefit of side airbags. The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety just released a report today, finding that head-protection airbags cut driver death by 45% in side collisions. Make SURE you buy another car with this feature.

Now, of the cars you mentioned, the Neon got Marginal in the IIHS's test. To put that in perspective, in the Small Cars class, only two cars did worse: A Hyundai, and a Kia. Here are the results: http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_rat...html/99007.htm

The WRX on the other hand..correct me if I'm wrong, but this is based on the Impreza. The Impreza is in the same class of vehicles and is rated a "Best Pick" for frontal-crash safety. None of the cars in this class have been tested for side-impacts yet. Any case, EVERY car that Subaru makes is a "Best Pick" - what does that tell you?

Which car would you rather be in when the next old man drives out in front of you:



or

[carrrnuttt]

Sorry to hear that, man. Glad you're okay.

As for recommendations, between the two you have presented as your choices, I would go with an SRT-4. Stock-for-stock, the SRT-4 is faster in a straight-line, and it's cornering prowess is not too bad for a front-driver either. It will be even better with the '04 ones available now, since Daimler-Chrysler finally woke-up and added a Quaife LSD into it's stock equipment list. This'll more than likely drop it's stock quarter-times from 14-flats average to high 13's average.

Lastly, the SRT will have dealer-installed Stage packages that step all the way to 300HP for a Stage-III...but warranty only lasts till Stage-II, maybe.

[YogsVR4]

Sorry to hear your car didn't come out of the crash as well as you did. At this point, I think the leasing of the SRT-4 is less expensive then the WRX for the 3 year term. Go here to check out the going rates http://www.leasecompare.com/index.ph...ce=G&Term=Ad6# you might find different numbers for your area then I did for mine.













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[Steiner]

Thanks for the link Boingo. I hope your 2 accidents haven't left you with any serious injuries. I'll have to consider how the 2 cars stack up against one another in terms of safety. No matter how good of a driver you are you can never prepare yourself for the unexpected. I like to think that I identify developing problem situations, give older drivers lots of room, and generally practice common sense on the road, but in this case, when somebody cuts in front of you're helpless - just hope your car has been built well enough to save your ass.

Coincidentally, my insurance guy actually mentioned the same report when I described my accident to him. Very informative stuff. I would have to be crazy, knowing what I know now and going through what I went through, not to make sure any car I buy in the future has side impact airbags. They are mandatory. They might have saved my life. I know that all of the police and fireman at the scene of the accident nodded approvingly when they saw the side airbag deployed. I think it's safe to say that in 5 years from now automakers will be making them as standard as ABS and front impact airbags are nowadays.

Carrrnuttt...do you remember the website or magazine where you read the info about the dealer installed Stage I, II, and III packages. I'd definately like to read more into it.

YogsVR4...thanks for the link. Both the 36, 39, and 48 month leases look very doable. I think, judging by how fun both of these cars are, I would be better of getting the 15k/yr lease over the standard 12k/yr lease. 60 cents a mile can add up...

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by Steiner

Thanks for the link Boingo. I hope your 2 accidents haven't left you with any serious injuries. I'll have to consider how the 2 cars stack up against one another in terms of safety. No matter how good of a driver you are you can never prepare yourself for the unexpected. I like to think that I identify developing problem situations, give older drivers lots of room, and generally practice common sense on the road, but in this case, when somebody cuts in front of you're helpless - just hope your car has been built well enough to save your ass.

Coincidentally, my insurance guy actually mentioned the same report when I described my accident to him. Very informative stuff. I would have to be crazy, knowing what I know now and going through what I went through, not to make sure any car I buy in the future has side impact airbags. They are mandatory. They might have saved my life. I know that all of the police and fireman at the scene of the accident nodded approvingly when they saw the side airbag deployed. I think it's safe to say that in 5 years from now automakers will be making them as standard as ABS and front impact airbags are nowadays.
..)

I hope you do not have any recurring pain or problems. My first accident, I was stopped at a stop sign (as people do) and saw a car approaching in the rearview. I turned my head to get a better look (NEVER NEVER DO THIS!!!!) and promptly got rear-ended. I realize now I should have planted my head on the headrest and looked squarely ahead. I only got hit at 15-20 mph, but because of the position of my neck at impact I have some soreness/stiffness and my neck pops constantly. The accident was 3 years ago and the car only sustained $500 damage.

The second time sounds a lot like yours. I was going 2 under the limit (43), down a slight hill, when an 85yr old man in a big Chrysler made an illegal left turn, stopping abruptly in my lane. I was only about 40 feet away when he did so, and I couldn't change lanes due to traffic. I hit the horn, and the brakes, and then, as I skidded closer, went 'Oh my God, I'm not going to make it this time...' and then hit. I live in a retirement/college town so there are LOTS of close calls. That one totaled the car for $2300, I was still going about 20-25 at impact, but there was soreness etc. for a few weeks that the muscle relaxer and Lortab took care of. No recurring problems from that, it was a year and a half ago.

It sounds like your accident was more serious than mine, and I sincerely hope you saw a doctor and they gave you some good drugs for the next few weeks. And, as I said, I hope there are no lasting effects.

If you are curious to see videos of the crash tests the IIHS conducts, go to www.progressive.com and search for videos. The videos are very interesting. You'll never get in an F-150 again.

www.crashtest.com has ratings for some cars that didn't sell enough for the IIHS to bother testing. They have deathrate and injury ratings also. Not surprisingly, sporty cars usually have really bad deathrates but that is frequently due to the irresponsibility of the drivers. Your more responsible take on driving is commendable.

One last thing I'll mention: I used to have TONS of close calls caused by people cutting in front of me, trying to change lanes into me, etc., but I have lessened that number recently by driving with my headlights on 24/7. My husband has tried this too and we both have found other drivers to be much more aware of us. Worst case scenario, there's no improvement and you just have to buy new bulbs more often, which is what, $10? So I think this is a good one to try.

Best of luck.
Emily

[2strokebloke]

The best safety measures are all preventative.
Personally, I think that basing a car's "safety" solely on it's crash worthiness does not provide a clear image of what exactly a safe car is.
If they were to figure in such other important factors, such as braking distance, how loud the horn is, and manueverability, size of blind spots etc. - we'd get a much better picture of what a safe vehicle is (hint: SUVs aint safe)

So check the road test data as well - and don't be afraid to test the horn either!
Also, I'd discourage buying a car (especially a compact) painted a dark color, especially black or dark blue. Bright colors are more noticable, not only by the police - but also by soccer moms chatting on their cell phones while trying to merge their Excursions into your lane (and into the side of your car!). If they still don't see you - lay on your horn, and give them the finger.

[Frozenblue**WS6]

firsthand, i know for a fact that the WRX is one fucking safe car.... I had a WRX... July 4 I had ONE beer, and didn't want to risk driving and running into a DUI checkpoint (i'm 19), so i let my friend drive.. we had only about a 4 mile trip... it was me and 3 others in the car.. some big ass animal ran out in front of us on the interstate... my friend cut the wheel WAY to hard for 70mph, and then OVERcorrected..we went into a big fuckin slide, he turned the wheel, and we slide the other way... almost like what would happen if you blew the tire.... anyway, we went sliding down the median into the fucking trees.. slammed head first into them (all had our seatbelts on, or at least one of us wouldn't have made it) after the hood hit them, the back end swung around and the passenger side smacked into them.. we were all stunned.. it happened so quick.... we all climbed out(me and one other had to climb out the other side cause the doors were blocked by the trees IN them... the car was totalled, but there wasn't any broken glass or anything... when the 2 tow truck guy arrived(cause the first couldn't get the car from down in the woods, steep incline/wet grass) i saw the passenger side... didn't even seem dinted(but it was pitch black out).. the WRX has steel reinforces doors, side-impact airbags, dual front airbags, ABS, etc....

i don't know much about the neon, except i don't like them...

i was so pissed at my friend, but he felt terrible so i didn't beat his ass or anything... he couldn't really have done anything.... if i were driving it would have been a different story, but oh well...

[Steiner]

Originally Posted by boingo82

It sounds like your accident was more serious than mine, and I sincerely hope you saw a doctor and they gave you some good drugs for the next few weeks. And, as I said, I hope there are no lasting effects.

Thanks Emily. It was actually very similair to your 2nd wreck except that I was going about 52mph in a 45mph zone - which unfortunately is an annoyingly conservative speed in the Bay Area for most tailgaters you see in the rearview mirror. He pulled out in front of me at about 50 feet. I hit the brake and pulled the car as far right as I could in hopes of avoiding the head on collision and perhaps missing him when he slammed on the brakes. Good or bad...it was instinctual for some reason. He never hit the brakes. In fact, he had his head down and never even looked up. He musta been looking at driving directions or something. He had an '84 Ford full size pickup. It hit me on the driver side door and spun me around twice. Except for the bruise on my left arm and shoulder from the side airbag I'm 100%. Apparently that's not unusual for moving side impact collisions because the momentum of the collision is typically transferred to the spin out. Fortunately for me my spinning car stayed on the pavement. The force of the collision totalled my car. It didn't even rupture his radiator. In fact he drove away shortly after we exchanged insurance info without even so much as asking if I was OK. The police, fireman, and a few witnesses even mentioned that, based on the other guy's demeanor and body language, it all had the appearance that things were my fault. Must be nice to live life relatively guilt free. Maybe his higher insurance premiums will leave a bigger impression than the accident scene. I dunno.

Originally Posted by Frozenblue**WS6

i was so pissed at my friend, but he felt terrible so i didn't beat his ass or anything... he couldn't really have done anything.... if i were driving it would have been a different story, but oh well...

Thanks for the info Frozenblue. Glad to hear that you and your buddies didn't become an after school special. I don't know if I'd let that guy even ride my skateboard after that. This might be more of question for my insurance agent...but all things being equal, do have any idea if insurance is more for an AWD turbo or a FWD turbo?

[Frozenblue**WS6]

Originally Posted by Steiner

Thanks for the info Frozenblue. Glad to hear that you and your buddies didn't become an after school special. I don't know if I'd let that guy even ride my skateboard after that. This might be more of question for my insurance agent...but all things being equal, do have any idea if insurance is more for an AWD turbo or a FWD turbo?

i don't know for sure, but i think AWD is a safety feature to insurance companies.. so i'm going to guess AWD turbo..

i've heard srt-4's are faster stock... if you care about that at all... street racing forum, so you probably do....

[Steiner]

Originally Posted by Frozenblue**WS6

i don't know for sure, but i think AWD is a safety feature to insurance companies.. so i'm going to guess AWD turbo..

i've heard srt-4's are faster stock... if you care about that at all... street racing forum, so you probably do....

Thanks Frozenblue. Ya, speed is definately a factor...but so are price and safety. As far as 0-60mph and quarter mile times are concerned: I hear so much damn arguing between WRX folks and SRT-4 folks that I have to think they are almost identical...give or take a tenth of a second or a couple mph.

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by Steiner

... He had an '84 Ford full size pickup. It hit me on the passenger side door and spun me around twice. Except for the bruise on my left arm and shoulder from the side airbag I'm 100%. Apparently that's not unusual for moving side impact collisions because the momentum of the collision is typically transferred to the spin out. Fortunately for me my spinning car stayed on the pavement. The force of the collision totalled my car. It didn't even rupture his radiator. In fact he drove away shortly after we exchanged insurance info without even so much as asking if I was OK....

I am not terribly surprised that his truck wasn't very damaged. When you think about it, the most durable part of his vehicle (front bumper) hit your car in the most vulnerable part (mid-way up the drivers door). Had you been hit by a lower vehicle some of the impact would have been transfered to the frame at the bottom of the car but as it happened, it was practically a study in crash incompatibility. High vehicle hits low vehicle, high vehicle always wins.

And what you said about the spin-out, that's true. I watched a show on TLC or the Discovery Channel about car accidents, and they mentioned how Nascar and Indy cars are designed specifically to spin in an accident, because that throws off the momentum much more safely than any other method.

[ScoobySnacks]

HI

Sorry to hear about your crash...it's a downer, but the main thing is that your ok...a car ca be replaced and thats what you intend to do!

As for your choice of car...personally I thik the Srt-4 is quick, but there is no way EVER that it will compare to a WRX. When it comes to handling, saftey, accelartion, tracktion the WRX is by far an overall better car. I've owned a WRX for the last 2 years without any problems...Dodge is a crappy made car..there is a big reason why the WRX cost more than the Srt-4....and that is the quality of maufacturing. With a few good mods and driving skill a WRX can walk all over an Srt-4 and back agian...both on ond off the track!




ScoobyDoo