the truth about snell ratings..

[es_class]

Please read the whole thing b4 u make uninformed opinions...I posted b4 but think this is a very interesting subject. Basically showing a study that breaks down how the snell ratings are to excessive and actually cause head injuries even in minor accidents.

http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/ge...iew/index.html

[richtazz]

The biggest issue I have with DOT/Snell helmets is their bulk. It has been proven that heavy/bulky helmets can cause neck injuries in low speed crashes when the head is thrown forward due to a sudden stop. Your neck muscles aren't strong enough to compensate for the extra weight and therefore causes injury that wouldn't have occurred without the big lid. There are as many types of accidents where a helmet will cause injury as it will prevent/limit one. I wear a thin "skid lid" to protect myself from flying debris like rocks and such, but I do not believe that a 1/4" of foam is going to help anything if I t-bone some octagenarian's Buick because they turned in front of me. I love watching other cyclists with a $1000 helmet riding in jersey shorts, flip-flops and a tank top roll their eyes at me in my "skid lid". I NEVER ride in shorts, or without gloves, as these are the most likely to be used safety equipment. With a pretty helmet and the above lack of gear, I guess they'll look good in their coffin, as the mortician can cover their road rashed bodies with a nice suit (that has the sleeves and long pants they should have been wearing while riding).

[aussieidiot]

dude!

i wear a Shoei XR1000 and will always wear a top quality helmet. the extras $600 may mean the difference between permanent brain damage and just a short stay in hospital.

I would never ever consider an open face helmet after seeing a photo on rotten.com with a guy (presumably a Harley rider given the nature of the guy) missing his lower jaw after an accident.


we have had this discussion before with articles about helmets and ratings.
Just because its in an article doesn't mean its not biased.

When I ride on the track, my crashes will tend to be a slide more than impact so a helmet won"t have much to do other than the first whack on the tar. Leathers are much more important for abrasion resistance.

On the street you never know what might hit you. If i'm in shorts and a t-shirt then chances are i won't be going over 40k's an hour.

[richtazz]

The more aggressive you ride, the better gear you need. I'm not knicking quality full face helmets, they are definitely proper gear for many riders, especially on the track. For me, they block my peripheral vision which is the #1 tool I use to avoid accidents and feel a little clostrophobic.. My point is that the rider should be able to decide, as it has been proven that helmets can cause injury. I also hate seat belts (for adults, kids must be buckled up properly). I think they restrict movement, are very uncomfortable, and virtually useless except in a roll-over accident. Would you feel comfortable in your car wearing a Hans-type safety device as well as your seat belt because the government decided you needed it, or do you feel such a device would impede your comfort and vision? It's also been proven that the safer you think you are, the more aggressive and less attentive most people will be while driving/riding causing more accidents. See my point? I don't want this to turn into a helmet use/helmet-law/seat belt debate, but the ratings and safety factors are always skewed to make the authors point, whether it be pro or con.

[es_class]

After reading that article...and the sources ...plus googling..I agree with the article. I'd rather have a softer more cushioned foam that absorbs the blow rather than a hard foam that's going to give me an injury when I would have avoided one with a better helmet. Being in business for the past 10 yrs...I would be very upset to overpay for a product just bcuz a motorcycle shop claims its better. Especially if its a 60 cent sticker that boosts the price up by over 100-200 bucks. I think I'd trust the studies of a few scientists and european standards over the word of a shop salesperson trying to make money. I do agree this though...the helmet biz has bcome like the fashion industry. Meaning the harder the foam...the thinner the foam..the sleeker looking the helmet..which is what a lot of us look for and like. While a safer helmet is thicker and softer to absorb more of the g force..it also looks bigger and doofier. The fact that the tests are beyond any forseable real occurence in an accident...scares me cuz it makes sense that it would make the helmet way too hard on ur head. I understand that u can have a helmet on and get injured else where but a head injury could make us a veggie for life. Also..I wear shorts often...bcuz its a fact that 2 seconds, if that...is all it takes to eat through denim. Aussie hit the nail on the head...leather is the only real protection here. Haven't read much on those nylon strechie safety undershorts so I can't say. I am trying to get into the habit of my jeans and mesh jackets..at least...but sometimes its hard. I ride everyday..all day..everywhere. Even the grocery store. Oh and a bigger helmet doesn't mean heavier...its softer..spongier to absorb while the other is more dense ..compressed..harder. Its like a thousand pounds of bricks or feathers. Which is heavier. Lol. Anyway people...that's just what I gather from my own personal research.

[speediva]

Most helmets sold in the US are both DOT and SNELL rated, anyway. Other than penis helmets (chrome domes), very few full-face helmets come with any "less" than both DOT and SNELL ratings. Personally, I don't really care, as long as my helmet is comfortable and fits well. Regardless of what I choose, it's better than expecting my hair to protect my scalp!

The BS about peripheral vision always makes me giggle, sorry Taz. I love ya, but it's a load of shyte if I've ever smelled one. If you can see more than straight out to either side with your eyes (not turning your head, mind you) then you are Super-freaking-man. The eyeport on all but 1 of the full face helmets I've owned has been behind my line of vision, and did not in ANY way impede my ability to see to my sides. Besides, if someone has gotten close enough to me on either side without me seeing them coming in from some other direction (either further back, or turning on the road) then shame shame SHAME on me.

[richtazz]

Originally Posted by speediva

The BS about peripheral vision always makes me giggle, sorry Taz. I love ya, but it's a load of shyte if I've ever smelled one. If you can see more than straight out to either side with your eyes (not turning your head, mind you) then you are Super-freaking-man. The eyeport on all but 1 of the full face helmets I've owned has been behind my line of vision, and did not in ANY way impede my ability to see to my sides. Besides, if someone has gotten close enough to me on either side without me seeing them coming in from some other direction (either further back, or turning on the road) then shame shame SHAME on me.

Really? Try this test then post the results, I bet you'll be suprised just how much your side/rearward vision is blocked. Stand in your living room with no helmet on, and look to the right as far as you can without turning your head. Have someone stand directly behind you and slowly move to your right and mark the floor where their feet are when you see them in your peripheral vision. Now do the same test with your full face helmet on and see how much that thing blocks your side/rearward vision. The spot your helmet blocks is where a car may be when you need to make an emergency maneuver. You don't always have time to completely turn your head to check your blind spots, being able to see at a glance has saved my ass more than once. Full face helmets also muffle your hearing, and that is another negative to sensing a car sneaking up in your blind spot. I'm not saying full face helmets don't possibly protect better in smoe types of crashes, but they have negatives as well.

[es_class]

I couldn't do it with anything less than a full. I passed the point of hating the smooshed feeling of my face and and feeling restricted. U get used to it. Never really noticed too much of a hearing impairment or detrimental difference do to the helmet. Besides I met someone who didn't even have a really serious spill...but knocked out a few teeth and scraped his whole jaw and cheek. God forbid u hit ur face like that or even on a car or ur own bike. Aside from that..I tried without a full and I hated the bugs..dust..got hit wit a lil pebble and that was the end of it. I love leather but don't want a leather face. Lol. Its a great free feeling..don't get me wrong but shit happens. Hey richrazz...weren't u interested in a rubbatone helmet once b4? I sent u a link for a zox one for like $150 that happened to be snell as well and looked really good. Came in black and the red u liked.

[speediva]

I wear glasses when I ride... I can't see anything in my peripheral clearly anyway.

And I come back to the "if I let a car get THAT close to me without having seen it come up from further behind or turning from a side road, shame on me!" If a car is close enough that it gets in my blind spot, I haven't been doing my job as a "pilot". Full face or brain bucket, there's a spot you can't see regardless. As for muffling sound... um... not so much. Hell, I need to get ear plugs because I hear too much!

[es_class]

I agree! I want earplugs too.I was thinking that just the other day. I took a 2 1/2 hr ride down from albany to nyc...and it was getting on my nerves hearing so much freaking noise. I was ready to stop off and put some tissue in my ears.

[richtazz]

Like i said before, I'm not knocking full face helmets, I just don't like them. I don't ride expecting to stack, so a 1/2 helmet is much more comfortable for me. I always wore a full-face when I first started riding as I felt they were better/safer for a beginner, but switched due to the lighter weight and more open air feeling in an open-faced helmet as my experience increased.

[MagicRat]

That article made some interesting points. There are other examples of safety equipment that was made to withstand the most severe accident, but turned out to be too harsh for the vast majority of accidents, and thus fail to protect adequatly.
First gen. auto airbags and Mercedes' early auto safety efforts come to mind.

I liked the observations about the Snell sticker as a marketing tool. I have come across many people who buy helmets (incl bicycle helmets) who simply look for the Snell sticker and hand over the big money without a real understanding of accident dynamics or the actual features and protection of the helmet they buy.

As for shorty helmets.......... personal choice and preference reigns, but I do not understand why anyone would not wish to protect themselves to the best of their ability. IMO protection takes precedence over the wind in the face.

I see shorty helmets as a means for people to show their dislike for manditory helmet laws while still meeting the letter of the law.
In the past I was astounded to see riders in states where there were no helmet laws actually riding with no lid and telling me it was their own freedom of choice.
Great, maybe the state troopers have a freedom shovel to scrape your brain (now free of the skull) off the pavement.

[es_class]

Speed, I like that terminology...brain bucket..lol. Richtazz, not a personal attack my man....just a matter of caring for a fellow rider. We all know u or neither one of us plans to go down....and believe u me...I am extremely confident myself when I'm out there..especially when I'm hittin a buck on the highway....and half the time I don't even notice till I look down at my speedometer and have to force myself to slow down. Magic rat...nice piece. I was one of those idiots a few times when I lived in florida.....I rode without a lid. 1st it was just to the store...then one day to work via the turnpike...but then reality set in when I had to swurve to avoid a car that pulled right into my lane from the right, forcing me to go into the shoulder. She was on a cellphone ...in her left hand...and even after movin in on me didn't realize what she did. God forbid there was a lane on my left with another car there...even though I probably would have swurved on to the white lines but u never know.

[es_class]

There r plenty of hot days and hot females on the sidelines... when I wish I could rip that helmet off...so I decided to get a flip up/modular one. On local runs I can keep it up with some glasses on..at stop lights I can breath and I can flip back down at my discretion. Best decision I've made.

[richtazz]

Hey Es, no problem, I never took any of this as a personal attack. You're a good guy and a lot of fun on here. Everyone here has expressed their opinions and it's good to have discussions like this. I sit on one side of the debate, you guys the other. You have a right to express why you disagree with my choice, and I your's. We're all friends here and it's fun to mix it up every once in a while. Well, I gotta go polish my brain bucket,

BTW, those modular helmets in open face mode make a guy look like a Trekkie/Darth Vader sidekick, so.........