"True Christian" denominations must teach True Christian doctrine.

[CL8]

In response to MagicRats post about Mormonism being "Christian",

But I cannot find any objective justification for the 'brother of Satan' issue. They seem to hold Jesus in very high regard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chu...ter-day_Saints

In order to be Christian, a denomination or doctrine must be biblically sound, the teachings that Christ taught.

This would rule out Mormonism as Christian, they add other writings than the bible to their doctrine. And they teach Jesus was a "Spirit Child" of God in heaven, as they say all humans, and the angles like Lucifer were.
http://www.dearelder.com/index/inc_n...ormon_Doctrine

Jesus Christ, the firstborn spirit of Heavenly Father, agreed to act as Savior in the Father’s plan, and give all glory to the Father. Lucifer was also one of the spirit children of God. He proposed an alternate plan at the same time. In his plan mortal men would not have moral agency. To have agency puts a person in jeopardy of choosing evil over good

This is NOT the doctrine of Christ is any sense according to the Bible.
According to the bible Christ is the Son of God AND God the Son.
Mormonism teaches Christ was only a creation of God as we are.

This is totally false and is why Mormonism is NOT considered Christian.

[DownToGround]

so let me guess.. one view is correct and one isnt

[CL8]

Thanks for the reply DownToGround!
Especially since MagicRat decided to ignore this thread!

For those who know and study the Bible for what it clearly states,
YES the Mormon claim of Christ just being a creation is totally false.

Of course then there is the issue do you choose to believe
what the bible says or not?
Apparently those who wrote Mormon doctrine weren't concerned
about adhering to what the bible teaches!

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by CL8

Especially since MagicRat decided to ignore this thread!

And I know that sentiment is expressed with the deepest of affection.

I have refrained from commenting here because I did not want to start ranting and burn this thread to the ground.

But I will agree that the accounts and events that are part of the Mormon theology are entirely false and contrived. Extensive (fake) mythology, contrived laws and rules of governance of member's private lives all help remove the burden of independent thought from the members. Extensive social and peer pressure is used in Mormon communities to ensure compliance to rigid social rules and expectations.

To this end the church promotes its own morality and control over its members, at the expense of their free will. One example is the collection of tithe, or almost-mandatory donations to support church programs. Thus in Mormon communities, the church grows ever-wealthier and controls vast amounts of spending and finance with no accountability to the members and the public.

Much of this spending goes to support Mormon missions overseas to prosthelysize and spread their own particular pack of lies about life, the universe etc. If they were truly concerned about the fate of mankind, they would perhaps feed the poor, instead of sending them useless books.

Mormon communities do seem to be more willing to look after their own poor and disadvantaged, within their community. But, imo, much of this is to extend their own rigid control over the community and all its members. Pull someone up by their bootstraps and you have more control over them.

Yes, other religions all do much the same thing. But the Mormons have shown themselves to be very good at it, which is a bit disturbing, imo.

[CL8]

Well, MagicRat,
What else is a thread like this for, if not to "burn to the ground", like all other threads on philosophy and religion???

And remember, the issue is "Does Mormon doctrine, adhere to bible doctrine?"
Thats regardless of whether you consider Mormonism false, Christianity false,
or both.
( you could make up a story about Goldilocks going into the three bears house to eat shrimp jambalaya,
it certainly doesn't align with the original story of Goldilocks eating porridge, even though both stories are fairy tales!)


Also, have you known any Mormons? they are usually very nice, upstanding people
even if they believe false doctrine!

[akboss]

A lot of people judge 'christians' as a whole because of some sects whose practices are not related or congruent with the life of Jesus Christ. Not saying that is Mormons, I don't know enough about them, but I am addressing this as a general statement. There are so many worldviews under one umbrella, it is easy to pass judgement without looking deeper into what individuals actually believe. I went to an Alliance church when I was at college, and the pastor there didn't even like to use the term 'Christians', as it was so often stereotyped and came with cultural baggage that people automatically had distaste for the word and the person associated with it.

[akboss]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

To this end the church promotes its own morality and control over its members, at the expense of their free will...

I have been interested in this issue for a long time, and continue my studies on it, as I do not believe we were designed to follow God with a lack of free will. This is one of the common misconceptions about what 'religious' people are like, that they are 'bound by their beliefs'. From what I have come to understand (and will surely continue to learn about more) is how untrue this is. In fact, a denial of a creator is the true acceptance of a lack of free will, because everything is randomly happening around us and we are merely responding to stimuli, there is no greater reason or outcome.

God created us in his image with the capacity to choose. While it is understood in Christian doctrine that God knows what our choices will be, that does not mean we don't have the ability to choose. If I have a choice to go out on a Friday night - I can go to a strip club or to Bible Study. If I were to choose to go to the strip club, I would not hit an invisible wall on my way to the club, I would walk in as does any other person with any other faith or worldview. I believe God would be disappointed in my actions and I would have sinned, but this choice is built into us by God's design. For those that are Christians I am not advocating that we all go out to strip clubs, it is simply an example. Hopefully we would have the sense and discipline to avoid it in the first place, but nobody is perfect, also by God's design. Jesus spent a lot of time with people society deemed to be 'dirty', 'forgotten' or 'inadequate' - it was when people felt they had lost everything that they gained everything. They now had a choice.

I don't claim to know all there is to know about this issue but it's a doozie, I enjoy seeing Hitchens and McGrath debate on this issue among others. For atheist and believers alike, watching debates between Alister McGrath (atheist turned Christian, scholar and multiple Ph.D holder) and Michael Hitchens (atheist, ph.D, writer) and Dawkins (everyone knows...) are some great debates to watch.

[drunken monkey]

I feel it appropriate to re-post this here from this post from that thread.

Originally Posted by CL8

Not BIBLICAL Christianity. I'm sure you are referring to Catholic run nations. Catholicism is not pure biblical Christianity. They corrupt it with man made rules and doctrine not found in the bible.

To make it easier to see what part I'm interested in questioning, I've high-lighted it in red.

And because you I never got a reply to my question in that thread, I'll re-post that too.

Originally Posted by me

So are you saying that Cathlocism isn't Christianity then?

[DownToGround]

really not much difference on the grand scale of things, just another advocate for faith.....(which ever faith you have)..religion

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by CL8

Well, MagicRat,
What else is a thread like this for, if not to "burn to the ground", like all other threads on philosophy and religion???

And remember, the issue is "Does Mormon doctrine, adhere to bible doctrine?"
Thats regardless of whether you consider Mormonism false, Christianity false,
or both.
( you could make up a story about Goldilocks going into the three bears house to eat shrimp jambalaya,
it certainly doesn't align with the original story of Goldilocks eating porridge, even though both stories are fairy tales!)


Also, have you known any Mormons? they are usually very nice, upstanding people
even if they believe false doctrine!

I like your Goldilocks reference. That's an excellent metaphor for the way millions of people use religion for self-assurance.
As people search for a church they like, they might say.....

"Hmmm...... this first church that I attended has too many rules......."

"This second church makes me feel guilty. I don't want that."

"Ah, this third church makes me feel good about myself, so it is just right......."

You see, that's the thing about biblical doctrine, not all of it can be right at the same time. Imo theological discussions about Mormonism are undermined by the elephant in the room.... the fact that such doctrines are often contradictory, yet neither one has any kind of evidentiary support to elevate it over the others.

However, for the sake of staying on topic, yes, Mormon doctrine does seem to adhere to biblical doctrine because the various Mormon texts were written to supplement the Bible, not replace it.
Yes, they do diminish the Bible's stature, but no more so than the New Testament undermines the Old. Yes, Jesus was credited with stating warnings of 'false prophets' undermining his teachings. But imo Jesus had some knowledge of this, because his teachings and actions undermined the Old Testament in some ways, so Jesus could be expected to warn of future prophets.
So, Christians who do not become Mormons are, in a way, like Jews who do not become Christians.

And the theological objections that Christians have to the Mormons simply reinforces the logical conclusion that all these theologies have not a word of truth to them.

That being said, some of the functions and principles of the Mormon church are, imo, legitimate grounds for calling them a 'cult'. Many people have made this accusation. However, it is no more a cult than other denominations, such as the Catholic Church, which, with the papal hierarchy has elevated cultism to vast heights.

Finally, are Mormons nice people? Definitely.
But they would be nice people regardless of their religion. They are nice due to their nature and not their religion, just the same as all the nice Christians, Muslims and Jews that I know.

[CL8]

Originally Posted by drunken monkey

I feel it appropriate to re-post this here from this post from that thread.



To make it easier to see what part I'm interested in questioning, I've high-lighted it in red.

And because you I never got a reply to my question in that thread, I'll re-post that too.

So are you saying that Cathlocism isn't Christianity then?
__________________

I would compare Catholicism to a batch of brownies baked with a tablespoon of sand and a teaspoon of urine in the batter. They are still brownies, but contaminated brownies.

Catholicism could still be call "Christian" but contaminated with false doctrine. (Like Mormonism)

[CL8]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

I like your Goldilocks reference. That's an excellent metaphor for the way millions of people use religion for self-assurance.
As people search for a church they like, they might say.....

"Hmmm...... this first church that I attended has too many rules......."

"This second church makes me feel guilty. I don't want that."

"Ah, this third church makes me feel good about myself, so it is just right......."

You see, that's the thing about biblical doctrine, not all of it can be right at the same time. Imo theological discussions about Mormonism are undermined by the elephant in the room.... the fact that such doctrines are often contradictory, yet neither one has any kind of evidentiary support to elevate it over the others.

Christ himself is evidence of the truth of the bible

However, for the sake of staying on topic, yes, Mormon doctrine does seem to adhere to biblical doctrine because the various Mormon texts were written to supplement the Bible, not replace it.

I guess you aren't aware of the warnings in Revelation 21: 18, to not ADD anything to the words of "this book" the bible.

Yes, they do diminish the Bible's stature, but no more so than the New Testament undermines the Old. Yes, Jesus was credited with stating warnings of 'false prophets' undermining his teachings. But imo Jesus had some knowledge of this, because his teachings and actions undermined the Old Testament in some ways,

wrong, Jesus fulfilled the laws of the O.T., he didn't undermine the O.T.

Finally, are Mormons nice people? Definitely.
But they would be nice people regardless of their religion. They are nice due to their nature and not their religion, just the same as all the nice Christians, Muslims and Jews that I know.

A persons beliefs are a large part of their nature!

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by CL8

Jesus fulfilled the laws of the O.T., he didn't undermine the O.T.

I entirely stand corrected. Thank you for enlightening me. Jesus was a supporter of the OT, and of all the cruelties, atrocities and god-instructed mass murder found therein.

All the more reason not to give Jesus the credibility some bestow upon him.

I hear so many Christians now a days claim that the Old Testament is defunct for Jesus was the “lamb” to clear away its rules and regulations. This is just another bullshit scapegoat that Christians use to ignore the atrocities and bizarre laws commanded by their god. Their preachers spoon feed them that the Old Testament is no longer binding so that they can excuse the majority of evil that the bible promotes. I am so tired of Christians manipulating the scriptures so that they can assign a kinder nature to their God, that I have assembled a BRIEF list of verses which clearly show that the Old Testament is not to be ignored. Its laws should indeed be adhered to, for the New Testament demands it! After this section I shall list where the Bible contradicts itself concerning other laws.

1) “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:18-19 RSV) Clearly the Old Testament is to be abided by until the end of human existence itself. None other then Jesus said so.

2) All of the vicious Old Testament laws will be binding forever. "It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." (Luke 16:17 NAB)

3) Jesus strongly approves of the law and the prophets. He hasn’t the slightest objection to the cruelties of the Old Testament. "Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place." (Matthew 5:17 NAB)

3b) "All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..." (2 Timothy 3:16 NAB)

3c) "Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God." (2 Peter 20-21 NAB)

4) Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark.7:9-13 "Whoever curses father or mother shall die" (Mark 7:10 NAB)

5) Jesus is criticized by the Pharisees for not washing his hands before eating. He defends himself by attacking them for not killing disobedient children according to the commandment: “He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.” (Matthew 15:4-7)

6) Jesus has a punishment even worse than his father concerning adultery: God said the act of adultery was punishable by death. Jesus says looking with lust is the same thing and you should gouge your eye out, better a part, than the whole. The punishment under Jesus is an eternity in Hell. (Matthew 5:27)

7) Peter says that all slaves should “be subject to [their] masters with all fear,” to the bad and cruel as well as the “good and gentle.” This is merely an echo of the same slavery commands in the Old Testament. 1 Peter 2:18

8) “Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" (John7:19) and “For the law was given by Moses,..." (John 1:17).

9) “...the scripture cannot be broken.” --Jesus Christ, John 10:35

But wait, the NT and the OT have many contradictions in laws and instructions. Whatever shall we do?

10) Shall we obey the law? Romans 13:1-7 says quite clearly that Christians are to submit to the law and regard it as the institution of God. 1 Peter 2:13-14 “Submit your self to every ordinance of man ... to the king, as supreme; Or unto governors.” Matthew 22:21 “Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s.” Also see Titus 3:1. Matthew 23:2-3 & Ecclesiastes 8:2 This leads one to assume that Christians must and should obey the law, yet look at these verses which contradicts what I just sited. Acts 5:29 “We ought to obey God rather then men.” Exodus 1:17-20 shows God punishing the midwives for following their rulers instead of God. Also see Daniel 3:16-18, 6:7-10, Acts 4:26 & 27, Mark 12:38-40, Luke 23:11, 24 & 33-35 which all say the law should be ignored. Now we know why Christians get away with their selective morality so often.

11) Should we steal? (Exodus 20:15 & Leviticus 19:13) Stealing is absolutely forbidden. Yet, Exodus 3:21-22, 12:35-36 & Luke 19:29-34 all promote stealing.

12) Should we judge? Jesus is quoted in Matthew 7:1-2: “Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged.” Also see Luke 6:37 & 1 Corinthians 5:12. Now take a look at “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment” (John 7:24). Also note 1 Corinthians 5:12 & 6:2-4.

1 3) Should we covet? Exodus 20:17 says, “Thou shalt not covet . . . anything that is thy neighbor’s,” while 1 Corinthians 12:31 says, “Covet earnestly the best gifts.” So, are we or are we not to covet?

14) Is lying okay? Exodus 20:16. Proverbs 12:22 & Revelations 21:8 all say lying is forbidden. Joshua 2:4-6, Exodus 1:18-20 & 1 Kings 22:21-22 all support lying.

15) Can we kill? Exodus 20:13 says “thou shalt not kill”. Exodus 32:27, Numbers 31, and THOUSANDS of other verses show God commanding us to kill.

16) Can we own slaves? Leviticus 25:45 “Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy … and they shall be your possession… they shall be your bondmen forever.” Genesis 9:25 “And he [Noah] said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.” Exodus 21:2 & 7 “If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing… And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do.” Joel 3:8 “And I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hand of the children of Judah, and they shall sell them to the Sabeans, to a people far off: for the Lord hath spoken it.” Luke 12:47-48 [Jesus speaking] “And that servant, which knew his lord’s will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes.” Colossians 3:22

“Servants, obey in all things your masters.” So obviously the Biblical God thinks slavery is right, right? Just look at these: Isaiah 58:6 “Undo the heavy burdens... let the oppressed go free, ... break every yoke.” Matthew 23:10 “Neither be ye called Masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.” (Also see Exodus 22:21 & 21:16) Let it be known here that pro-slavery Bible verses were cited by many churches in the South during the Civil War, and were used by some theologians in the Dutch Reformed Church to justify apartheid in South Africa. There are more pro-slavery verses than cited here. I simply do not have the room to post all of them.

17) What about Improvidence? Improvidence is enjoined in Luke 12:3 “Sell that ye have and give alms.” also in Luke 6:30 & 35 “Give to every man that asketh of thee, and of him that taketh away thy goods, ask them not again ... And lend, hoping for nothing again, and your reward shall be great.” Also note Matthew 6:28, 31 & 34. Improvidence is condemned in I Timothy 5:8 “But if any provide not for his own, and especially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel. “ Also see Proverbs 13:22.

18) What does the law say about anger? Ephesians 4:26 says “Be ye angry and sin not not.” Anger is disapproved in Ecciesiastes 7:9 “Be not hasty in thy spirit to be angry; for anger resteth in the bosom of fools.” Proverbs 22:24 “Make no friendship with an angry man.” Also see James 1:20.

19) Are we to let our good works be seen? Matthew 5:16 “Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works.” This contradicts verse Matthew 6:1 , “Take heed that you do not your alms before men, to be seen of them.”

20) Should we pray in public? 1 Kings 2:22, 54 & 9:3 shows the Lord is joyed by public prayer and listens intently. Matthew 6:5-6 condemn public prayer and command people keep it a secret.

21) Can we wear long hair? Judges 13:5 & Numbers 6:5 encourages people to grow their hair and insists it is a source of strength. 1 Corinthians 11:14 calls long hair a “shame”.

22) Should we circumcise males? Genesis 17:10 “This is my covenant which ye shall keep between me and you and thy seed after thee: Every man and child among you shall be circumcised. Clearly this demands circumcision, yet Galatians 5:2 says “Behold, I Paul, say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.”

23) Are there certain kinds of foods we should not eat? Deuteronomy 14:2-8 lists several animals that we are NOT to eat because they are “unclean”, “chew the cud” and “divide the hoof”. Yet Genesis 9:3 & 1 Corinthians 10:25 insists there is nothing we can’t eat. Romans 14:14 says: “There is nothing unclean of itself.”

24) Can we take oaths? Numbers 30:2, Genesis 21:23-24, 31, 31:53 & Hebrews 6:13 says that we can take oaths and encourages it. Matthew 5:34 says “swear (make an oath) not at all.”

25) Can we get married? Genesis 2:18, 1:28, Matthew 19:5 & Hebrews 13:4 all insist marriage is honorable. Marriage is disapproved and scorned in 1 Corinthians 7:1 & 7:7-8.

26) Can we commit adultery? Exodus 20: 14 “thou shalt not commit adultery.” Also see Hebrews 13:4. Now look at Numbers 31:18, Hosea 1:2 & 2:1-3 where adultery is advocated by God.

27) Can we drink alcohol? Proverbs 31:6-7, 1 Timothy 5:23 & Psalms 104:15 all encourage drinking and intoxication. Proverbs 20:1 & 23:31-32 discourage drinking and intoxication.

28) Do women have rights? Genesis 3:16 “And thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.” 1 Timothy 2:12 says a woman must not teach, remain silent and must be subjugated to her man. 1 Corinthians 14:34 & 1 Peter 3:6 both say that women have limited rights and are under control of their men. Judges 4:4, 14-15, 5:7, Acts 2:18 & 21:9 all tell of powerful women who were not subjugated by men and were not punished for their authority of men.

29) Should we obey our masters with usurped authority? Colossians 3:22-23 & 1 Peter 2:18 says we should. 1 Corinthians 7:23 “Be not ye the servants of men.” Also see Matthew 4:10 & 23:10 which say we should not submit usurped to our masters.

30) Was the law of the Old Testament destroyed by Christ’s crucification? Luke16:16, Ephesians 2:15 & Romans 7:6 says that the old law is no longer binding. Yet Matthew 5:17-19 and MANY other verses say that the old law is forever binding. If you want to see the many verses that command we follow the old law please consult the upper portion of this page.

31) Should we swear an oath? Numbers 30:2 “If a man vow a vow unto the Lord, or swear an oath…he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.” Genesis 21:22-24 & 31 “…swear unto me here by God that thou wilt not deal falsely with me…And Abraham said, I will swear…Wherefore he called that place Beersheba [“Well of the oath”]; because there they sware both of them.” Hebrews 6:13-17 “For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself…for men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife. Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability ofhis counsel, confirmed it by an oath.” See also Genesis 22:15- 19, Genesis 31 :53, & Judges I 1 :30-39. So apparently it is okay to swear an oath, we even do this on the Bible in American courts. Just try and forget these verses: Matthew 5:34-37 “But I say unto you, swear not at all; neither by heaven…nor by the earth…Neither shalt thou swear by thy head…But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.”

James 5:12 “…swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.”

32) Do we keep the Sabbath? Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy.” Exodus 31:15 “Whosoever doeth any work in the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.” Numbers 15:32-36 “And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the Sabbath day…And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses.” Each of these contradict Isaiah 1:13 “The new moons and Sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity.“ John 5:16 “And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the Sabbath day. “Colossians 2:16 “Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holy-day, or of the new moon, or of the Sabbath days.”

33) Should we make graven images? Exodus 20:4 “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven…earth ... water.” Leviticus 26:1 “Ye shall make ye no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone.” Deuteronomy 27:15 “Cursed be the man that maketh any graven or molten image.” Okay, I got it I shouldn’t produce a thing in fear of making a graven image, but wait: Exodus 25:18 “And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them.” I Kings 7:15-16 & 23-25 “For he [Solomon] cast two pillars of brass…and two chapiters of molten brass…And he made a molten sea…it stood upon twelve oxen ... [and so on]”

How about we stick to Secular law, which can be refined and adjusted, instead of taking this stuff seriously?

Source: http://www.evilbible.com/do_not_ignore_ot.htm

[drunken monkey]

Originally Posted by CL8

In order to be Christian, a denomination or doctrine must be biblically sound, the teachings that Christ taught.

This would rule out Mormonism as Christian, they add other writings than the bible to their doctrine....

This is totally false and is why Mormonism is NOT considered Christian.

Originally Posted by CL8

I would compare Catholicism to a batch of brownies baked with a tablespoon of sand and a teaspoon of urine in the batter. They are still brownies, but contaminated brownies.

Catholicism could still be call "Christian" but contaminated with false doctrine. (Like Mormonism)

Which is it then?
How can Catholicism be Christian despite, as you say, it is contanimated with false doctrine and at the same time, Mormonism, that is also contanimated with false doctrine not be Christian.

[akboss]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

How about we stick to Secular law, which can be refined and adjusted, instead of taking this stuff seriously?

Source: http://www.evilbible.com/do_not_ignore_ot.htm

Ha ha, the one source for all of that is www.evilbible.com? Gee, that's not one-sided at all! There are plenty of people that will take scripture out of context or in loose translation and say its evil, this is the only way they can attempt to attack the truth that the Bible contains. Fortunately, there are many Bible scholars that offer a scriptural perspective on the verses.

Many people looking from the outside have criticisms already in mind, and just scan the Bible to find an assumed proof of their already determined beliefs without any need for knowledge of what the verse is actually talking about. But if you read it with an open mind and without preconceived judgement, and in my personal experience, it always passes the test. I have personally witnessed some of the toughest verses broken into a sensible, God-honouring conclusion.

Oh, and a significant part of our law and politics (at least in the United States, less so Canada unfortunately) is based on Judeo-Christian doctrine. You know, "In God We Trust".