94 PA red exhaust manifold, no OD, only 10-50 mph and more.

[LilStash]

Hey there,

First time here, so want to say "Hi" and thanks for any help.

I'm not extremely car savvy, so please be gentle, lol.

Ok:

94 Buick PA 3.8 138k

Symptoms in order of which they occurred:


Engine died while going any speed when very low but not out of fuel. Would start right back up when put in neutral, take off just fine, then repeat. At first would generally straighten itself out on its own. After putting more gas in it would be fine. Sometimes just opening the gas cap would work.

Entirely the same thing as above but got worse and wouldn't go over 15-20 without feathering the pedal, and sometimes not at all and died when coming to a stop. Let it sit for a time and would run fine. Nearly always would be okay after a few miles when more fuel was put in... Boyfriend was notorious for putting $5 in gas at a time (insert *stupid* here).

I thought it might be sediment clogging the fuel filter or air/water getting in the line, if that is even possible but stupid wouldn't put out the money for a new fuel filter or change his habit of purchasing as little fuel as needed, and did run it dry a few times.

All of this eventually led to being parked on the side of the road with him killing the battery trying to get it started. Battery gave up and had to be replaced. Oddly, the above problem nearly went away. Perhaps he started to put in more gas and not run it so close to empty as well.

Next issue:

He started it one morning and heard what sounded like metal hitting cement, and then a loud rattle. The sound is not a constant rhythm like a clock ticking, which speeds up with acceleration or decreases with deceleration but is constant. The only change is that it gets a bit quieter when accelerating, but goes right back to the same volume once it kicks into second. Kinda sounds like a rock just knocking around. Tension pulley was wobbling badly; replaced it but no change.

Yesterday it started doing the dying while driving thing again, tank half full, and this hadn't happened in quite awhile. Started smelling a light burning smell of rubber. Things then went from bad to OMG

Had a loud bang/pop and it felt like something hit under the back passenger side of the car. No loud noise like a back fire out the tail pipe. It was definitely internal. Happened a few more times while he was driving to work. AC went out.

Tranny seemed to start to slip (though I highly doubt the tranny has anything to do with it) and couldn't get it over 50 mph, then 10 mph. After it sat for awhile it got up to 50 but still no overdrive etc. When looking under the hood, the Exhaust manifold, drivers side was glowing red.

No problem starting and engine runs smooth. All fluids fine and have been changed. No codes come up, but I'm sure they would if they could. Key worn? All gauges work, temp showed a wee bit higher then normal, but nothing at all alarming.

Please understand this is not ME driving it, but the boyfriend while commuting to work... I work and or have to be available for work 24/7 on my computer at home.

Oh, LOL, ditching him but keeping my car. It's 60 miles away in the middle of no where, and so is he...he doesn't know how lucky he is He wont have it towed, but there is a small shop in the area. I'm afraid they will ream me and still not properly diagnose or fix the problem since it could be more then one thing. This is my only car.

Any ideas I could have the mechanic check before he starts in?

Sorry for the venting and the novel...I think I've just had enough of someone who is so cheap and inconsiderate.


Thanks sooooo much!

[HotZ28]

He started it one morning and heard what sounded like metal hitting cement, and then a loud rattle. The sound is not a constant rhythm like a clock ticking, which speeds up with acceleration or decreases with deceleration but is constant. The only change is that it gets a bit quieter when accelerating, but goes right back to the same volume once it kicks into second. Kinda sounds like a rock just knocking around. Tension pulley was wobbling badly; replaced it but no change.

Check the Harmonic Balancer!

Yesterday it started doing the dying while driving thing again, tank half full, and this hadn't happened in quite awhile. Started smelling a light burning smell of rubber. Things then went from bad to OMG

Sounds like your friend has damaged the fuel pump. Running on empty will kill them! Check fuel pressure.

Had a loud bang/pop and it felt like something hit under the back passenger side of the car. No loud noise like a back fire out the tail pipe. It was definitely internal. Happened a few more times while he was driving to work. AC went out.

Must be A/C related

Tranny seemed to start to slip (though I highly doubt the tranny has anything to do with it) and couldn't get it over 50 mph, then 10 mph. After it sat for awhile it got up to 50 but still no overdrive etc. When looking under the hood, the Exhaust manifold, drivers side was glowing red.

Could be the tranny or TC, either one is a major repair.

Oh, LOL, ditching him but keeping my car.

I would ditch them both! BTW, you can expect more repair expense than the car is worth!

[LilStash]

LOL, on the ditching, I agree, but my car! Yikes...I figured it was bad, duh.

My reasoning for not thinking it was the tranny was that I had it gone through just a few months ago (before the boyfriend)...haven't had any symptoms of anything wrong. No actual slipping. No clanking when changing gears....park to drive etc... No grit in the fluid, no burning smell, and the fluid barely changes color if at all when taken for service. All is the same with the tranny fluids and no burning smell now either.

So the slowing down is deff the tranny or transfer case? Not possible that the o2 censor is bad...catalytic convertor? Or the manifold clogged? Just for giggles, couldn't a AC line/gasket have melted due to the manifold being close to it?

Believe me, I trust what you're saying, just trying to hold out some hope, and probably being a air head. If you don't think it's worth bothering with, then junk it I will.

[HotZ28]

Without being on site to troubleshoot, we can only speculate based on the info provided. You need some professional diagnostics & repair estimates from a reputable shop. I wish I could offer some glimmer of hope to keep it on the road, but the car is not worth more than $1500.00, even if it is in excellent shape! Make your decision based on the repair estimate! You obviously have some major repair expense ahead if you decide to keep it. Good Luck.

[MagicRat]

Based on a quick read of the 'novel', possibly the timing chain is very loose and has skipped a tooth.

The timing chain drives the camshaft. If it skips a tooth, the intake and exhaust valves will open and close much later (relative to the crankshaft, fuel and ignition systems) than they should. This will dramatically reduce power and cause the exhaust manifolds to glow.

The overheated exhaust will often smell bad and might overheat the catalytic converter. The converter's internal component may melt, thus blocking the exhaust and rendering the converter ineffective.

The rattle/knock noises would be, at least, the timing chain flapping around and striking the inside of the housing. I fear that when the noise got worse, the timing chain had skipped another tooth, which may allow a valve (or 6) to strike a piston. This may produce worse noises and some backfiring through the exhaust (the thumps you heard towards the back of the car, possibly)

If all this has actually occured, it's bad (aka expensive) news. In retrospect, it was a very bad idea to continue to drive the car when you first noticed a problem. If you had sought a repair at the first sign of trouble, you would just be looking at a new timing chain, which is not a big repair. However, I fear that, by continuing to drive it, you may have bent some valves, which will require 2 new or rebuilt cylinder heads to be installed as well - a much more expensive repair.

[LilStash]

Thanks so much guys!

You are very right about not driving it when any of this happened, and I couldn't be more angry with the ex bf if I tried right now, but the damage is done. Also about the cost of the car...was practically mint and paid 1,400.

I'll have the mechanic do a once over, and see what he says, but will keep all you have said very much in mind. You have been very helpful, and I thank you very much for your time

[LilStash]

Update and question:

Got the car home and I replaced the catalytic converter myself, and getting great air flow now. It was severely clogged. Too little to late, I know, but I've decided to get it back on the road.

Sometimes it wont stay running at all when I start it now, though fires up like its new.

If it stays running, I'll shift it into gear and it will creep forward on its own. Most of the time it will die if I put my foot on the gas.

RPM's wont get over 2 in park or drive.

Exhaust manifold still glowing red after only 2 minutes or so of running.

Loud rattle...smooths out some after a few minutes.

Though I don't have an entire motor at my disposal, there is a parts car down the road.

Any suggestions?

Thanks again guys!

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by LilStash

Update and question:

Got the car home and I replaced the catalytic converter myself, and getting great air flow now. It was severely clogged. Too little to late, I know, but I've decided to get it back on the road.

Sometimes it wont stay running at all when I start it now, though fires up like its new.

If it stays running, I'll shift it into gear and it will creep forward on its own. Most of the time it will die if I put my foot on the gas.

RPM's wont get over 2 in park or drive.

Exhaust manifold still glowing red after only 2 minutes or so of running.

Loud rattle...smooths out some after a few minutes.

Though I don't have an entire motor at my disposal, there is a parts car down the road.

Any suggestions?

Thanks again guys!

Thanks for the update. Please re-read my post I make last week. Your latest description confirms my suspicions.

The solution:

Replace the timing chain!

A new timing chain and gear set costs about $25 (you would also need some gaskets, too), and can be replaced by a mechanic in about 3 hours or less.
If you want to do it yourself, it's not a difficult job but would probably take you all day if you have never done this before. You would also need a harmonic balancer puller, but sometimes you can rent or borrow one from an auto parts store.
There is a bit of a risk that there may be additional damage, as described in my post above. So, you may replace the chain and everything is fine. Or you may replace it and find there is still additional damage. We can't be sure without being there in person to listen to the engine running.

[danielsatur]

It sounds like a plugged catalytic converter!
After it died, because of no air, than it would start back up, it got a breather.

Any local muffler shop can run a back pressure test.

[LilStash]

Originally Posted by MagicRat

Thanks for the update. Please re-read my post I make last week. Your latest description confirms my suspicions.

The solution:

Replace the timing chain!

A new timing chain and gear set costs about $25 (you would also need some gaskets, too), and can be replaced by a mechanic in about 3 hours or less.
If you want to do it yourself, it's not a difficult job but would probably take you all day if you have never done this before. You would also need a harmonic balancer puller, but sometimes you can rent or borrow one from an auto parts store.
There is a bit of a risk that there may be additional damage, as described in my post above. So, you may replace the chain and everything is fine. Or you may replace it and find there is still additional damage. We can't be sure without being there in person to listen to the engine running.

Awesome!!!

I wanted to make sure we were still in the same ballpark. I'm gonna stay positive and hope that there isn't a lot of other damage.

I'll be working on this Sat and will update you again

Have a great Thanksgiving!

[danielsatur]

Heat damage causing Air leaks!
Exhaust manifold leaks, head, and Intake!
I would do a smoke test + compression test.

[MagicRat]

Originally Posted by danielsatur

It sounds like a plugged catalytic converter!
After it died, because of no air, than it would start back up, it got a breather.

Any local muffler shop can run a back pressure test.

If you actually read the thread, you would see the OP has already replaced the cat.

Originally Posted by danielsatur

Heat damage causing Air leaks!
Exhaust manifold leaks, head, and Intake!
I would do a smoke test + compression test.

Total gibberish. I do not know what the heck you are talking about. Please be more specific or refrain from posting. You are not helping the OP here.

[HotZ28]

Originally Posted by LilStash

Update and question:

Got the car home and I replaced the catalytic converter myself, and getting great air flow now. It was severely clogged. Too little to late, I know, but I've decided to get it back on the road.

Sometimes it wont stay running at all when I start it now, though fires up like its new.

If it stays running, I'll shift it into gear and it will creep forward on its own. Most of the time it will die if I put my foot on the gas.

RPM's wont get over 2 in park or drive.

Exhaust manifold still glowing red after only 2 minutes or so of running.

Loud rattle...smooths out some after a few minutes.

Though I don't have an entire motor at my disposal, there is a parts car down the road.

Any suggestions?

Thanks again guys!

Have you checked the fuel pressure yet?

[LilStash]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

Have you checked the fuel pressure yet?

No, I haven't...can't keep it running. It just starts and dies. There isn't any charge on the battery, though it wasn't cranked to death. Had to have a jump to get it home, and never seemed to hold a good charge after that.

I was checking a few things today before digging in. I have two entirely different opinions from two guys, and one says this is my alternator, and the other says it's the air or a/c compressor... It caught my attention when I jumped my car to let them hear the noise. The pulley wasn't moving freely. The car died very shortly after it was started so I checked that part by trying to turn the pulley, and it stopped about a 1/4 of a turn to the left, back to the right, and made a fairly loud clank.

I know what an alternator looks like on other cars, with all the vent holes, and feel like a complete idiot here Are the black fins a cooling fan? If so then this probably is the alternator, and I should start there...

[Jrs3800]

What you have in the Pic is thew alternator.. The unit you have is a 140 Amp..

Remove the Belt and make sure all of the pullies move freely..

Lastly I agree with HotZ28.... Have you checked that fuel pressure? Very important that you do so.... Your fuel pressure should be between 41-47 Psi

With the Exhaust Manifolds glowing red you are running very lean....