01 Grand Am 2.4 still starting issues

[david-b]

Hey all. If you guys might remember I got a 01 Grand Am 2.4 for cheap and had to replace the head gasket. It didn't start before that and afterward still have had no luck. I thought it was the ICM so ordered a new one along with the coils and today I got around to jumping it (battery was dead)

When attached to a battery jump starter, the engine cranks very slowly round and round but doesn't fire. And it kills the battery jumper right away.

When I connected it to my brothers truck to jump start, the start just clicks repeatedly. I take it off, put the battery jumper back in, and it cranks very slowly. Weird. Tried this for awhile with no luck.

Does anyone have any ideas on what's going on here? Thanks

[GTP Dad]

There are several possible causes to your problem. Start simply and make sure you have fuel and spark. Either will cause it not to start. If both are OK then you need to tackle the voltage issue. It sounds like you may have either a bad starter or a high resistance hot wire that is causing the voltage to drop too low and therefore not turn the starter properly. Finally make sure the timing is correct. If it is wrong then the engine is not going to start. A quick compression test can see if the valves are open or closed during the compression stroke.

[david-b]

Ok I charged my battery since it was dead. Battery is in good condition. It's cranking the motor perfectly fine. Here's what I found out this evening.

-When turning the power to on, you can hear the fuel pump supply pressure in the engine bay.

-When cranking, it's rotating the motor, and then makes a little click sound when it gets to a certain point on the rotation. When I took out the ICM fuse, it didn't make that noise then. This is my 2nd ICM, coil, and that whole top spark connection.

-When I disconnect the fuel pump fuse and start, it does the same thing as above, rotate with the little click.

-You can smell the fuel through the throttle body after cranking.

-Security light is constant on when power is on. No flashing though. CEL stays on while cranking.

-Lastly timing is right on. We redid it numerous times during the build to get perfect. 100% confident in that.

[david-b]

Anyone?
Well tonight I'm going to do the yellow wire mod and see if that works. Everyone elsewhere seems to be thinking that the security system is causing the problem. Will be one more thing eliminated. We shall see.

[GTP Dad]

With the security light on you will need to reset the system as you already know. To reset without a lot of hassle simply set the e brake, turn the key on for 10 minutes and shut off for 30 sec. Repeat X 3 and after the third 10 minutes turn the key to start.

[david-b]

Resetting has done nothing. The ebrake wasnt on (didn't see this til later) and never read anything about that before.

Last night I was working on this thing. I've read that you can cut a yellow secrutiy wire coming off the ignition. It keep the dash light on at all times then, but it bypasses the system. I dug in, found the wire, did what they said, and car still does the SAME exact thing.

I disconnected the Crank Position sensor to see if that would make any changes, and the car didn't even crank then. Had to reset the ECU then.

Still need ideas!

[3100]

you have to cut yellow wire while engine is running

[david-b]

Originally Posted by 3100

you have to cut yellow wire while engine is running

Everywhere I read said to do while cranking.



Does anyone have a spare ECU laying around for the 2.4? I'm starting to think it's not the security since it's not flashing.

[3100]

David go to U pull it on North and Grand avenue 25$ on Wednesdays.

try to find the grand am with the same accessories same number of doors etc.

did you test your ECT sensor?

[david-b]

I always go to Summit U-Pick-A-Part in Summit. $3 admission.

No I didn't check that. Looked in good shape when I pulled the thermostat housing. Could that cause a no-start? Do you have the way to test it (ie proper readings?)

Thanks

[3100]

the pcm is 25$ and admission $2.

there is a table resistance vs temperature just look it up in maintenance section.

in every official GM manual that I have if you have spark and fuel the first thing you have to check is ect.

[david-b]

Originally Posted by 3100

the pcm is 25$ and admission $2.

there is a table resistance vs temperature just look it up in maintenance section.

in every official GM manual that I have if you have spark and fuel the first thing you have to check is ect.

$25 is not bad at all for the PCM. The manual is at my garage now and car is at my place. I'll pick it up when i work on the Talon this weekend and try it out.

Funny thing, the G.A. was supposed to be my DD while I pulled and built the motor for the Talon. So far, looks, like the Talon may be running before the G.A.

[david-b]

Originally Posted by 3100

the pcm is 25$ and admission $2.

there is a table resistance vs temperature just look it up in maintenance section.

in every official GM manual that I have if you have spark and fuel the first thing you have to check is ect.

Ended up just replacing the ECT. Was only $10.99 from Autozone... can't go wrong with replacing it. Battery was back to being dead but still wouldn't start up. Will charge battery again and see if that does anything again.

Also checked for fuel and spark. I pulled the rail to check for fuel and was kind of stupid. Long story short, cranking, loose fuel and one spark... loud BOOM and small fire. Good times. So I have both though.

[david-b]

Thinking outloud... if the CEL is on due to something and is saved in teh ECU and doesn't clear with a battery reset, if I cleared it with a ODB scan tool, do you think that would cause it not to start?