Engine stalls

[tkswan]

2000 Explorer XLS 4.0 SOHC.
156k miles

The engine is stalls with no warning. It shuts down and illuminates all the instrument panel lights -- key on mode. It's happening during idle-up (driving), idle down (stop sign), and curb idle (in the garage). It happens whether the engine is hot or cold/warm. When you let it sit/rest for a few minutes it will start again...the longer the wait the better. If you don't wait long enough and try to start it -- it tries to turnover. If it does [turnover] it will idle very rough and shut down out again. This has happened on dry and rainy days.

There is no check engine light. The starter, battery, and the alternator are good. The battery is less than 4 months new and I replaced the alternator this morning because there has been an issue with it for a few weeks. (another post).

I inspected all the vacum lines I could find and found no open lines.

When it starts (after sitting overnight) it will run strong for about 5 or more minutes and then die off again. This morning I put a timing light on all the plug wires to check for strobe. Good strobe on all wires. Actually the plugs, plug wires, and coil have all been replaced within the last year.

All I can think of is the fuel delivery system. The relay looks good from visual inspection. Maybe its the fuel pump but how can I test that? If I pull the fuel filter is there a test I can do to see if its clogged? I'd hate go out and start replacing good parts.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I don't feel comfortable driving it anywhere because of the spontaneous shut downs that are happening. I don't want to be stranded.

Thanks in advance.

[Franco2112]

Check your other post.

[tkswan]

The throttle body is clean. I clean it frequently. This vehicle is very well maintained. I keep it very clean inside and out, as well as keeping up with the maintenance...i am very anal about my cars which is why it has high mileage and still looks and runs like new. ...well not lately.

...so is there any way to test the fuel delivery components? i.e. fuel pump and filter, fuel pressure? When trying to start it it continually turns over very strong. It sounds like its not getting any fuel and I do not smell raw fuel the way the old carberator systems would smell when you flood them. ...I guess i wouldn't smell fuel on a closed pressurized fuel injection system unless there is a leak.

However, I do remember that before this started, my wife mentioned that it was doing some sputtering. I drove it around for a day and it was idling rough when at a stop and in gear (Drive)..stop sign. Not a misfire but a rough idle. Driving it around was normal, good acceleration. We back it in the garage. When I get it started the the exhaust smells of a rich fuel mixture and when you place your hand under the pipe the exhaust air puffs against your hand. An ignition misfire shouldn't cause the engine to stall.

Normally, when the key is turned to the on position (non start) there is usually a quiet hissing sound for about 3 to 5 seconds. I have always assumed that sound is the fuel system charging. I still hear that sound and it sounds normal.

Thanks

[Franco2112]

Here is my take. With your stated issues and proper maintenance it could be one or multiple items going bad but not serious ones.
1. Check your catalytic converter. (Clogged or damaged can cause misfire and you will smell rich fuel).
2. EGR Valve- stuck open/closed (Will cause misfire, shut downs, rich fuel smell)
3. Go back over plugs( Check for cracked plug/plugs wires).
4. Take to dealer to have it scanned.

[tkswan]

Thanks Franco.

Lewisville? Dude I'm in Denton.

Where do you suggest i take it since you are 10 miles down the highway? I hope like heck it aint the converter.

[tkswan]

Converter is not damaged. would clogged cause engine shut downs? Its not misfiring, its just running like krap.

Plugs and plug wires are good. They all make the timing light strobe. Plug wires are less than 60 days old.

EGR Valve? I'll check and get back to you.

[Franco2112]

I was wondering when you where going to see that we were close! I had a partially clogged converter on my now sold 1996 Explorer and it would not let the egr's flow completely and caused a misfire and sometimes shut down when hot. I think Bill Utter Ford/ Sam Pack Ford is fine to take to. Just make sure that they won't just throw parts at the Explorer and not fix the problem. When it comes to Explorers/Expeditions they have many multiple problems to solve one. Just make sure what they make you pay for fixes it. I use Sam Pack Ford Lewisville for my Expedition when i can't fix it. If you go there ask for John Goddard and tell him Frank, Checa's dad sent you. He is honest.

[shorod]

When it stalls, try giving it a bit of throttle and see if it starts easier. Idle Air Control servos have been known to fail on these. Of course IAC is only at idle, so if you have stalling issues when driving, and since you say you have spark, you should check you fuel pressure.

-Rod

[tkswan]

wish i could get it to bankston in frisco. thats the only place i let touch my Lincoln LS and my wifes exploder. they take good care of me over there and thats the only place i trust.

[Franco2112]

I know what you mean! If you trust them, go with them. I trust Sam Pack Lewisville. I replaced the IAC before when i had start up issues and idling. It cured that. But if your having stalling while driving i doubt that's the problem but, i have been wrong before. It's a cheap enough part to try if all else fails. Again, you can throw a lot of parts at the Explorer and still not fix the problem, so don't get frustrated if problem is not solve immediately. If you're throwing parts at it it's ok but not the dealership!

[tkswan]

Today it started and killed off almost instantly. now it turns over strong but it will not start at all. I will pull the fuel filter and replace it, its just a $9 part, them I am going to pull the fuel line tomorrow morning and turn the key on. it should spit fuel as the system charges right? If it does spit fuel can I assume the pump is working? does the fuel pump send fuel electrically or mechanically? Is this a good way to test the pump? I have to know since its a $124 part but I also still have the OEM pump on the car. whats the service life of a fuel pump anyway? Mine has 159k miles on it.

I am going here becasuse i am I am pretty sure that the engine is not getting any fuel. i cleaned the IAC and the EGR. No change. I need a fuel filter and pump replacement procedure.

if that doesnt fix the problem I will call a tow truck because I am all out of ideas. darnit!

[shorod]

The electric fuel pump is located in the fuel tank. Many have failed with far fewer miles on them than yours. Since a working pump produces between probably 30 & 60 psi, you don't really want to just let it spray all over. You should use a fuel pressure tester that connects to the fuel rail. You should check both Key On Engine Off (KOEO) and KOERunning pressures, assuming you can get it running.

-Rod

[tkswan]

i just replaced the filter, it was pretty filthy. No change, still wont start. Do I have to drop the tank to change the pump or is there a port in the back of the truck somewhere that allows access to it. When I released the fuel pressure via the valve stem on the injector rail I was expecting more fuel to spit out. It was just a few drops of fuel so there was very little pressure. The inertia switch was not tripped. Is there way to test the relay? I have a meter.

I will get a gauge and test the pressure at key on. It will not start so i cant check pressure at engine running -- unless i can expect a readout while the engine is turning over.

[Franco2112]

I had 185k miles when my 1996 Explorer fuel pump went out. Had to drop the tank and it was full. The more empty the better. Went back with Motorcraft. I didn't want to take the chance with aftermarket. One other low cost item you could check is your crank position sensor. This causes shut downs and no start issues. As i said in past post you can through a lot of parts at Explorers and still not fix the problem. The only sure way to find the problem is to scan the computer. I think i experienced it all with my 1996.

[tkswan]

Originally Posted by shorod

The electric fuel pump is located in the fuel tank. Many have failed with far fewer miles on them than yours. Since a working pump produces between probably 30 & 60 psi, you don't really want to just let it spray all over. You should use a fuel pressure tester that connects to the fuel rail. You should check both Key On Engine Off (KOEO) and KOERunning pressures, assuming you can get it running.

-Rod

if low pressure, what tells me if its the fuel pump.