Drivers side temperature actuator - how to

[Steves72]

First - the what. This is a 99 GTP.

Does anyone know of a how to replace write up on replacing this part? I tried to get at the part on Saturday and besides getting my arms all scrapped up I did not succeed in getting the item out. And, if I did manage to get the part out I know that I could not get it back in to the car.

The symptoms: Passenger side blows cold on A/C and the passenger side temperature control changes the temperature of the air. The Drivers side blows warm and you cannot change the temperature at all. It will not get hotter nor colder.

The biggest problem is all the stuff in the way. First there is a thick wiring harness up there and if that was not enough the firewall brace, for the brake pedal, is also in the way.

One possible solution would be to remove the top dash pad - which I do not know how to do and I am uncertain that it would help. The most promising path appears to be to rip the dash apart and remove the cluster. Again I am uncertain how this is done so any instructions or pictures would be appreciated.

If this was to go to the dealer what should be the labor total on such a job - how many hours?

Thanks
Steve

[BNaylor]

Welcome to AF.

Do you have the manual dual zone climate control or automatic dual zone - ACC?

[Steves72]

I believe it is the automatic version. This is my wife's car.

On the control panel it has a button for "Auto" which turns on the AC when the auto button is pressed. There are small lights on each button to indicate which button is "on". There are two flanking knobs - one for the driver and one for the passenger to control the air temperature. There is a dual button to indicate if the unit works as one unit or separately. The passenger knob does vary the air temperature. The driver knob does not change the temperature that comes out of the ducts.

I was able to drop the small carpeted panel immediately above the brake and gas pedal. I could see the temperature actuator mounted to the side of the air distribution box while laying on the floor. But getting it out would have been hell and getting it back in at that point would have been impossible.

Steve

[troy1]

First off you need to get into the diagnostics mode for the automatic controls. read this. keep in mind that you will have to use both of the temp control buttons not the fan to cycle through these. Also you need to press both temp control buttons at the same time to enter dianostics mode.

SELF-DIAGNOSTICS
NOTE: Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) symptoms should be diagnosed
and repaired before proceeding with any other tests. DTCs
can be retrieved with the A/C-heater control unit.
1) If a fault has occurred in a monitored circuit, the F or
C symbol on the A/C-heater control unit display will flash during the
first 2 minutes of operation. To enter diagnostic mode, turn ignition
on, then press AUTO and OFF buttons at the same time.
2) There are 2 display modes within diagnostics: diagnostic
pointer and diagnostic value. By rotating the fan knob, one detent in
either direction, display is toggled between pointer and value.
Rotating TEMP knob will switch the diagnostic pointers.
3) DTCs reside under diagnostic pointer 00. Rotate FAN one
detent in either direction and DTC data will be entered. If more than
one DTC is present, they will be displayed at one second intervals per
fault. See DTC IDENTIFICATION table. Other data used by computer
resides under other diagnostic pointers and is not useful diagnosing
A/C-heater system. To exit diagnostics, press any mode button.
4) After a repair is completed, DTCs must be cleared from
memory to ensure proper system operation. To clear memory, press A/C
mode button.
NOTE: A 2-digit DTC indicates fault is current. A 3-digit DTC
indicates fault is intermittent.
DTC IDENTIFICATION TABLE
�������������������������������������������������� �������������������������������������������������� ����������������������������������������
DTC Fault
00 ................................................ No System Faults
01 Or 101 .................. In-Vehicle Air Temperature Sensor Short
02 Or 102 ................... In-Vehicle Air Temperature Sensor Open
03 Or 103 ..................... Outside Air Temperature Sensor Short
04 Or 104 ...................... Outside Air Temperature Sensor Open
05 Or 105 ....... Left-Side Temperature Valve Actuator Open Or Short
06 Or 106 ...... Right-Side Temperature Valve Actuator Open Or Short
07 Or 107 ................................... Serial Data Line Fault
08 Or 108 ......................... Sun Load Temperature Sensor Open
�������������������������������������������������� �������������������������������������������������� ����������������������������������������
DTC 01 OR 101 - IN-VEHICLE AIR TEMP. SENSOR SHORTED TO GROUND
DTC 02 OR 102 - IN-VEHICLE AIR TEMP. SENSOR CIRCUIT OPEN
1) Disconnect in-vehicle air temperature sensor harness
connector located behind right side of instrument panel. Turn ignition
on. Set A/C-heater control to AUTO mode. Using a voltmeter, measure
voltage between ground and terminal "B" (Dark Green wire) at invehicle
air temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5
volts, go to next step. If reading is not as specified, go to step 3).
2) Using a voltmeter, measure voltage between terminal "B"
(Dark Green wire) and terminal "A" (Yellow wire) at in-vehicle air
temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5 volts, go to
step 4). If reading is not as specified, go to step 5).
3) If DTC 01 or 101 is set, check Dark Green wire for short
to ground. If DTC 02 or 102 is set, check Dark Green wire for a short
to battery voltage. Check Dark Green wire for an open or poor
connection. Repair as necessary. If no problem is found, replace A/Cheater
control unit. Retest system.
4) Check for poor connections. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, replace in-vehicle air temperature sensor. Retest
system.
5) Check for a poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, repair open in Yellow wire between in-vehicle air
temperature sensor and A/C-heater control unit. Retest system.
DTC 03 OR 103 - OUTSIDE AIR TEMP. SENSOR SHORTED TO GROUND
DTC 04 OR 104 - OUTSIDE AIR TEMP. SENSOR CIRCUIT OPEN
1) Disconnect outside air temperature sensor harness
connector located on center radiator support. Turn ignition on. Set
A/C-heater control to AUTO mode. Using a voltmeter, measure voltage
between ground and terminal "A" (Light Green/Black wire) at outside
air temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5 volts, go
to next step. If reading is not as specified, go to step 3).
2) Using a voltmeter, measure voltage between terminal "B"
(Yellow wire) and terminal "A" (Light Green/Black wire) at outside air
temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5 volts, go to
step 4). If reading is not as specified, go to step 5).
3) If DTC 03 or 103 is set, check Light/Green Black wire for
short to ground. If DTC 04 or 104 is set, check Light/Green Black wire
for a short to battery voltage. Check Light/Green Black wire for an
open or poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no problem is found,
replace A/C-heater control unit. Retest system.
4) Check for poor connections. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, replace outside air temperature sensor. Retest
system.
5) Check for a poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, repair open in Yellow wire between outside air
temperature sensor and A/C-heater control unit. Retest system.
DTC 05 OR 105 - LEFT-SIDE TEMP. VALVE ACTUATOR SHORTED/OPEN
DTC 06 OR 106 - RIGHT-SIDE TEMP. VALVE ACTUATOR SHORTED/OPEN
1) If DTC 05 or 105 is set, disconnect left-side temperature
valve actuator harness connector. If DTC 06 or 106 is set, disconnect
right-side temperature valve actuator harness actuator. Start engine
and allow it to reach normal operating temperature. Set A/C-heater
control to AUTO mode. Set temperature to 60 F (15 C). Using a
voltmeter, measure voltage between ground and terminal No. 10 (Gray
wire) at disconnected temperature valve actuator harness connector. If
reading is 4-5 volts, go to next step. If reading is not as specified,
go to step 3).
2) Using a voltmeter, measure voltage between ground and
disconnected temperature valve actuator harness connector terminal No.
9 (Dark Blue wire on right-side actuator; Light Blue wire on left-side
actuator). If reading is 4-5 volts, go to step 4). If reading is not
as specified, go to step 5).
3) Check for a poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, repair open in Gray wire between A/C-heater control
unit and inoperative temperature valve actuator. Retest system.
4) Check Yellow wire for an open or poor connection between
terminal No. 7 of inoperative temperature valve actuator and splice
S258 located near Data Link Connector (DLC) harness breakout. See
WIRING DIAGRAMS. Repair as necessary. If no problem is found, replace
inoperative temperature valve actuator. Retest system.
5) Check for short to battery voltage or ground in circuit
between A/C-heater control unit and inoperative temperature valve
actuator terminal No. 9 (Dark Blue wire on right-side actuator; Light
Blue wire on left-side actuator). Repair as necessary. If no problem
is found, replace A/C-heater control unit. Retest system.
DTC 07 OR 107 - SERIAL DATA (CLASS II) LINE OPEN
1) Connect scan tool to Data Link Connector (DLC). Turn
ignition on. If communications cannot be established with PCM, see the
G - TESTS W/CODES article in the ENGINE PERFORMANCE section. If
communications can be established with PCM, go to next step.
2) Check Tan wire between DLC and splice pack S237 for an
open, short or poor connection. See WIRING DIAGRAMS. Repair as
necessary. If no problem is found, replace A/C-heater control unit.
Retest system.
DTC 08 OR 108 - SUN LOAD TEMPERATURE SENSOR CIRCUIT OPEN
1) Disconnect sun load temperature sensor harness connector
located at top left of instrument panel. Turn ignition on. Set A/Cheater
control to AUTO mode. Using a voltmeter, measure voltage
between ground and terminal "A" (Light Blue/Black wire) at sun load
temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5 volts, go to
next step. If reading is not as specified, go to step 3).
2) Using a voltmeter, measure voltage between terminal "A"
(Light Blue/Black wire) and terminal "B" (Yellow wire) at sun load
temperature sensor harness connector. If reading is 4-5 volts, go to
step 4). If reading is not as specified, go to step 5).
3) Check for poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, repair open in Light Blue/Black wire between A/Cheater
control unit and sun load temperature sensor. Retest system.
4) Check for poor connections. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, replace sun load temperature sensor. Retest system.
5) Check for a poor connection. Repair as necessary. If no
problem is found, repair open in Yellow wire between sun load
temperature sensor and A/C-heater control unit. Retest system

[Steves72]

DTC displayed 00. No faults.

Now what?

Steve

[troy1]

Physically check and see if the door actuator is moving. If it is you are more than likely low on refrigerant.

[Steves72]

How do you check to see if anything is moving? The device is mounted to the side of the air box. The door that would be moved is inside that box. Can I shine a light down a duct a see the interior door move?

Steve

[troy1]

We are assuming everything inside is OK just watch the electric door actuator motor on the outside. Move the corresponding dial and see if it moves.

[Steves72]

I am really confused now. Laying on the floor on the drivers side of the car and looking up at the air box I can see this part. There is nothing to observe about this part. What am I supposed to be looking at?

Steve

This link is so long that you may have to cut and paste it into your browser session.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/97-98...Q5fAccessories

[Steves72]

Well since that I have reached a dead end on the diagnostics, I will ask again my original question - How do I get to and replace this part:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/97-98...sories?afsrc=1

Steve

[rkvons]

The actuator motor has a hole in it that slides over the actual actuator that controls the damper. You should be able to reach up and feel it with your hand and turn the control dial to see if it moves. I don't recall if you can actually see it while it's installed. I have removed mine. It is not easy, but definitely possible. It's kinda like trying to undo a bra strap while reaching through a prison fence. I switched my passenger/driver ones and then was easily able to view its operation by looking at it when it was behind the glovebox on the passenger side. It turns out I had to open it up and perform a repair on it. One of the gears inside was cracked. Dealer wanted $275 for a new one. The one on the passenger side is way easier to get out. To get the driver's side one out, I think I used a ratchet (mini) with a phillips screw driver on the end of it. By touch (because I don't think you can see it and work on it at the same time) you should be able to feel the three screws that hold it in and get the phillips screwdriver bit on them and work the ratchet. Even though you remove all three screws, it still will remain in place because of how it slides into the actuator lever. This makes it easy to put back in. You should be able to do it without tearing your dash apart. Once you get it out, move the actuator with your fingers and see if you can hear a thump as it reaches it's ends of travel. Yeah, I know, I'm long winded. Here's what you should do. Swing the glovebox down and look inside to locate the one on the passenger side. Take it out. This will acquaint you with how far you have to unscrew the screws and whatnot. Them move to the driver's side. Keep the passenger one handy while you use the mini ratchet (from a 1/4 inch ratchet set), a little socket and a philips bit used for drill bits. Now reach up and feel the actuator motor. Try to locate the screws. Look at the one you've removed while feeling the one you are attempting to remove. You should be able to get it out this way. After removing it, make sure the damper lever moves freely and then take the one from the passenger side and just put it in the driver's side. Same procedure, just reverse. Make sure the electrical connection is applied correctly. Now take a beer break. Rest your arms. Now move back to the passenger side. Move the damper with your hand while watching it and note how much it travels. Now take the one you've removed from the driver's side and put it in the passenger side. Remove the HVAC fuse. Wait a few seconds, put it back in. Now turn it on the system and try adjusting the passenger side temp. See if it moves. More specifically, see if it moves an amount close to what it did when you moved it with your bare hand. If it does not move enough, like mine did, remove it and disassemble it. See if any of the gears are cracked. I found that one of mine was cracked (the one that actually turns the actuator). I noted how it was positioned on its shaft (it's splined on) and carefully removed it and rotated it 180 degrees and put it back on. This effectively placed the crack outside of the range of gear that was used, if you know what I mean. I reassembled it and whalah! fixed. Hopefully that will be your problem too.

[Steves72]

rkvons

Thanks for the information. I will check around and see if I have a magnetized phillips head bit. That may help. As to checking the motion of the motor by feel, I am assuming that you mean to feel the circular white are for motion? And, how much rotation should occur if it is working normally.

Steve

[rkvons]

Originally Posted by Steves72

rkvons

Thanks for the information. I will check around and see if I have a magnetized phillips head bit. That may help. As to checking the motion of the motor by feel, I am assuming that you mean to feel the circular white are for motion? And, how much rotation should occur if it is working normally.

Steve

The lever that sticks out of the air mixture box will stick through the hole on the actuator motor enough for you to tell if it is moving.

Also, one other thing you might want to try is removing the HVAC fuse for a minute or so and putting it back in. It seems like the motors give feedback to the computer as to where their position is and it could get out of whack. I've observed the behavior of the passenger side motor when I put the fuse in after having it removed and I see the motors go through what appears to be an initialization sequence, where they are driven all the way to one end of travel and back to the other end and then posiitoned where the computer wants them to be. I do remember you saying that there were no diagnostic codes, but you never know.