87 S-10 won't start

[1jfitz]

87 s-10 pickup 2.5 with 190,000 miles and manual trans.

I was driving down the road pushed in on the clutch to stop at the light and it died. Didn't seem to have good spark so had the coil checked and said it was bad replaced it and still not starting.

has fire, has compression, has fuel, injector operating properly, ecm code 12 ready and 34 for the map sensor because I took breather off to check fuel. Cap and rotor were replaced 3 weeks ago with plugs.

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by 1jfitz

87 s-10 pickup 2.5 with 190,000 miles and manual trans.

I was driving down the road pushed in on the clutch to stop at the light and it died. Didn't seem to have good spark so had the coil checked and said it was bad replaced it and still not starting.

has fire, has compression, has fuel, injector operating properly, ecm code 12 ready and 34 for the map sensor because I took breather off to check fuel. Cap and rotor were replaced 3 weeks ago with plugs.

What is fuel pressure?
Breather off should not set map sensor code.
Where are you checking for spark?
Are injectors squirting fuel?
Does it have good hot blue spark to all plugs?
Dist rotor turning?

[1jfitz]

Checking pump pressure tomorrow evening was not able to any sooner.
good blue spark at each plug
Injector is squirting
Rotor is turning

[1jfitz]

checked fuel pressure today 11psi.
Shot a little starting fluid in it. didn't hit a lick.

[manicmechanix]

Are you sure compression is good? what do the plugs look like?

[1jfitz]

100 psi all 4 cyliders
plugs are were new a few weeks ago. no real changes I can describe.

[manicmechanix]

Originally Posted by 1jfitz

100 psi all 4 cyliders
plugs are were new a few weeks ago. no real changes I can describe.

That seems like low compression to me. Could be the timing chain has allowed valve timing to be off. Can you check the ignition timing?

[1jfitz]

Last option I could see was to pull the timing cover. This engine has 2 helical gears the larger a composite material. Both look remarkably well for 192,000 miles. Distributor is not loose and hasn't moved in 22 years.

[manicmechanix]

Are you saying you pulled the timing cover and saw the timing gears were in good time? My understanding is that the 2.5 went to a chain in '85 and balancer shafts and the oil filter in the pan. Maybe this happened in '88 or maybe you have the older style. When I say check the distributor timing, I meant that your cam timing could be late.

If you have good spark and good plugs, the fact it wouldn't run on starting fluid indicates your compression is too low and maybe your valve/ignition timing are too late. I still think 100 psi is too low. Most engines develop over 140.

[1jfitz]

yes I pulled the timing cover. The only thing I could think was something was worn and slipped there.

What I don't understand is the all of the sudden nothing. Driving then nota.

Thanks for all the input.

[Cam1959]

Originally Posted by 1jfitz

yes I pulled the timing cover. The only thing I could think was something was worn and slipped there.

What I don't understand is the all of the sudden nothing. Driving then nota.

Thanks for all the input.

The fact it was running okay until you pushed in clutch, everything seems okay, makes me wonder if there is an electrical switch connected to clutch arms somewhere, to prevent turning engine over unless depressed. If there is sucjh a safety on it, it could have buggered up when you pushed in clutch ?

[rhandwor]

Look at where the clutch pedal would push a switch they either have a neutral safety switch or a clutch safety switch.

[1jfitz]

Switch is open push clutch to close switch. So I unhooked the switch jumped across the connector and nota. What sensor or Ecm pin recognizes this switch is closed to allow it to start?

Nix that thought if clutch is not pushed in it won't turn over at all. It completes the ignition Switch to the Starter.

[1jfitz]

Pulled the ignition module to have it tested. Why you ask if i'm getting fire. I was getting fire but seems off time so I was checking the electronic spark timing ckt It was good but now I have lost spark. I think that it is the module grounding. any way while doing this I cleared the codes checked and had nothing turned over the engine checked the codes and had a 34 my book says map sensor. Which shouldn't have activated so quickly if at all since it is unhooked.

[rhandwor]

Normally either the pickup in the distributor or the module is a cause of a no spark.
If it doesn't turn over check the ignition switch or fuse able links by the starter.
Hold your finger over No.1 spark plug hole when you feel air stop move by hand until the piston is on top. Look at the rotor tip it should be close to No.1 plug wire. I've had the chain stretch and jump a tooth.
Roll the the engine over by hand to appx. 60 degrees past TDC roll back to TDC. Mark rotor button have some body else watch as you roll the engine as soon as it moves stop. If over appx. 20 degrees the chain is stretched.