99 3.5L Intrigue MAJOR ISSUE

[sl9536]

My wife currently drives a 99 Olds Intrigue 3.5L that still has under 60,000 miles on it believe it or not. A month or so ago she started complaining about the car dying immediately after it starts while it was warm (Taking 2-3 tries before it would start). I knew from previous experience reading these forums to check the FPR, and sure enough it had fuel in the vacum line. I replaced it myself, and it seemed to run fine for a couple weeks, but now is doing the same thing every once in a while whether cold or warm. The MAJOR issue I am having now, is the car dying while driving at steady speeds with absolutely no warning whatsoever. When the car does die, it can be restarted with no issues. This is extremely dangerous, as I was almost hit from behind when it died earlier today. I have checked the car for codes, and it does not show any recorded every time I scan. I have never seen the service engine soon indicator light come on while driving except for when it dies along with the security indicator. Once the car is restarted, both lights go out. I am suspecting 3 things. Faulty ignition, Crank Sensor, or fuel filter/pump going out. Has anyone had any similar problem with their 3.5? I don't want to start throwing money at this with no evidence.... HElP!!!!

[harmankardon35]

defiantly ignition switch...read some of the threads over the past few weeks, many many different issues are attributed to the faulty ignition switch, yours is almost a guarantee if your "security" light comes on when it dies

[canatto]

my 2000 GLS used to do the simillar to me for more than 1/2 year. It would randomly hard to start for no reason, it would turn over strongly but no start then finally fire up like nothing had happened and run fine. It would also occasionally stumble during driving feeling like the engine had shut itself down for a short moment then started up again. No check engine light, no codes. I had suspected the ignition switch too, but nope, just before it turned warm last spring and I was about to take the ignition out I got a check engine light and a code pointing at the crank position sensor. I changed that sensor and all have been well since.

[sl9536]

Thanks gents for the quick responses...I have a strong feeling it is the crank position sensor, but wish the darn thing would throw me a code or something, or trip the Service engine soon light. The car runs perfectly once started, and pulls strongly as it always has, but occasionally stumbles and dies or is hard to start in the morning. I was told that there are actually 2 Crank Sensors in the 3.5L V6 on these engines. Is there and validity to this or is it just the 1 sensor directly above the starter? Does anyone know how much the dealership charged to change it out approx?

[LittleHoov]

There is only one crankshaft position sensor. There is also a camshaft position sensor and perhaps thats what whoever told you was thinking of.


I dont know what the dealership would charge, but its a pretty straightforward procedure. You changed the FPR out, so you obviously have some confidence, why not give it a try.


You could also try cleaning the ignition switch as others have done, but usually ignition switch troubles would manifest with a lack of cranking whatsoever, not a hard start.

I believe the Security light comes on even on a perfectly functional ignition switch when the car is off with the ignition in the ON position, so thats not really a good clue. If it was coming on while the car was still running though, thats another story.

[sl9536]

Thanks Littlehoov...I figured it wasn't the ignition switch, but thought it might be possible. I think I am just going to replace the crank sensor myself, and see what happens. I remember seeing a step by step crank sensor replacement forum a while back, but can't find it. Can you point me in the right direction?

[panzer dragoon]

I would put my money on the CKP sensor (search for "ckp sensor" on this forum). You have 2 sensors (circuits) on the same sensor -What a bargain!

You seem to have the 1/4 temp stall also. Keep her at higher rpms right at 1/4 temp and the blip shouldn't cause a stall. The stall is caused by the switchover to the second sensor (which is bad) right at 1/4 temp -after that you shouldn't be stalling.

[sl9536]

Thanks Panzer. I will give that a try until I can replace the CKP sensor. Just an FYI it was extremely difficult to start this morning. I think it took at least 7 cranks before it would turnover at all, but once started it runs like a top, except for the occasional stumble/Die issue I described earlier. Does this still sound like the CKP sensor going bad, even though I have no SES indicator otherwise. The FPR is brand new, and should not be the issue. Fuel Pressure checks out good, and the Fuel Pump has been checked good as well. With the car having under 60,000 miles, I am at my wits end here...

[panzer dragoon]

-a camshaft position sensor (cps) will sometimes give you the 5-10sec start delay.

since you have no codes I would search this forum and read up on the ckp and cps sensor. The cps sensor is much easier to replace and about 1/2 the price of the ckp. -both are prone to fail (along with the fpr).

I would order both from gmpartsdirect.com -get the real deal gm parts also and not a cheap imitation. I believe both have been updated.

I would also look into a faulty (or dirty) ignition switch. Since the stalls (ckp usually) and no starts (cps/fpr usually) don't make sense. Info on this forum. I would still say a really bad ckp.

Your car can start in neutral also --> good for stalls while moving.

[dtownfb]

Originally Posted by sl9536

My wife currently drives a 99 Olds Intrigue 3.5L that still has under 60,000 miles on it believe it or not. A month or so ago she started complaining about the car dying immediately after it starts while it was warm (Taking 2-3 tries before it would start). I knew from previous experience reading these forums to check the FPR, and sure enough it had fuel in the vacum line. I replaced it myself, and it seemed to run fine for a couple weeks, but now is doing the same thing every once in a while whether cold or warm. The MAJOR issue I am having now, is the car dying while driving at steady speeds with absolutely no warning whatsoever. When the car does die, it can be restarted with no issues. This is extremely dangerous, as I was almost hit from behind when it died earlier today. I have checked the car for codes, and it does not show any recorded every time I scan. I have never seen the service engine soon indicator light come on while driving except for when it dies along with the security indicator. Once the car is restarted, both lights go out. I am suspecting 3 things. Faulty ignition, Crank Sensor, or fuel filter/pump going out. Has anyone had any similar problem with their 3.5? I don't want to start throwing money at this with no evidence.... HElP!!!!

I bolded the sentence in your original post about the security indicator coming on. I would replace the ignition switch first. If you can replace the FPR, the ignition switch shouldn't be a problem. Littlehoov was nice enough to post directions. There are couple of tricky parts that has more to do with space constraints than complexity.

I would think if the CPS or CKS were the issue, it would have thrown a code by now esp. if it causes stalling.

[LittleHoov]

If nothing else, cleaning the ignition switch only takes time and effort, not money. It might be worth a shot.


You could have your wife help you do it. Just think of it, the two of you cozied up in the garage, frustrated, cursing, bleeding slightly from your knuckles, maybe a tad dirty. Ive worked on a car or two with the ladies, I wont lie, I found it strangely arousing

[1979hurst]

not to jack the thread but how hard is the cleaning and removal of the ignition switch??

[sl9536]

Ok, guys. I have seen several of you reply with Ignition Switch replacement or Cleaning. If I had a Faulty switch, I would think that the car wouldn't even crank over at times (Only A Click or nothing). With this issue, the car will crank with no problems but just will not start without a lot of effort. Once the car is started it runs like a top, except for the very occasional stumble and die issue while driving. I really don't want to tear my dash apart to clean the switch or replace it if I don't have too. This issue is Classic Cam Sensor or the Crank Sensor, but what I cannot understand is the NO Code issue. Has anyone out there experienced this type of issue?

[dtownfb]

I suffered from a bad ignition the first part of 2008 before I finally changed mine. At first, it would occasionally take 2 attempts to start. No big deal only happened a couple of times a week. Later in May & June, it would take 5-10 attempts to start my car. I had one incident where it took 20 times to start the car. I knew i had to change it when my car stalled on 3 occasions driving home. The last stall the red security light came on which confirmed it was in fact the ignition switch.

I finally changed it in mid-June and have not had any issues since. I never had a code. Ignition switches do not throw a code. And dash mounted ignitions tend to have more problems than your traditional column mounted switches. This is why when people report hard starting, stalling, weird electronic issues AND there is no code, we immediately point to the ignition switch or FPR.

A bad crankshaft position sensor can cause hard starting and stalling as well but normally when the sensor gets that bad you do see a code. This ignition switch causes some strange problems. On another forum, a guy was complaining about his climate control unit acting strange. he replaced the unit with no luck; thought maybe it was a bad battery. Finally his mechanic suggested the ignition switch and it fixed the problem.

[brcidd]

To prove ignition switch is a problem- I tap a test light into the pink ignition wire-either under dash or in behind the ignition fuse- then drive the car-- test light needs to be lit during ignition on, and during crank mode- then if you ever see it flicker, go out- and engine stall- then you'll know the ignition switch is at fault- arcing, making bad contact, etc...Very easy to do, and gains valuable info....may take a week or so, but you won't change ignition switch needlessly