Potential Of B18C1?

[ox03]

[As cross-posted in the Integra forum...]

An '00 EX wants to swap in a B18C1 w/ a Garret T04 setup. Model year unknown. Which model year B18C1 is considered the most venerable and desired? What is the typical transmission used? On average, what kind of numbers (HP, TQ SAE) can be expected to be put down? What is the streetable HP/TQ limit of the B18C1 and what kind of numbers can be expected to be put up (60', 1/4 , MPH)? Generally speaking.

A little background info: I hail from Los Angeles, CA and boost around town in a BPU '03 Cobra. Mods listed in sig. Put down 420 RWTQ and 390 RWTQ pre-pulley and tune. Mid-12s are feasible. Used to troll the streets in a '91 HKS Stage IV MR-2 Turbo. '00 B18C1/T04 wants to run, straight-line, no juice. I thought I would post a few questions so as to prepare myself for the upcoming race. Many questions!

What does the torque curve of a stock B18C1 look like? Where are the sweet spots? Any dyno charts, graphs available? I envision taking the hole shot and then fighting to keep the lead. Or would it be vice-versa? I should be able to put down at least 450 RWHP, 450 RWTQ and low-12s on street tires by the time we meet up. I will certainly take into account additional mods (suspension, drivetrain, ignition), but as of now am concerned with the oft-mentioned B18C1/T04 combo...

[civickiller]

i think the best b18c to turbo is the obd 1, one. most people stick with the gsr tranny because it has good ratios.

streetable limit kind depends on lots of things so its hard to say.
i think with a stock b18c runnin about 8 psi, with slicks should pull about mid 12s. idk how fast on street tires

[esp]

all i read was i whole bunch of gargled sentences that didn't seem to make any sense to me? but yeah i a civic with a b18 that it turboed depends on what model it is in if it is a hatch i would watch out those things can get going pretty quick.

[ox03]

Thank you for the responses, guys. Keep them coming!

> esp: all i read was i whole bunch of gargled sentences...

Excuse me for the rash of questions. Perhaps if each sentence is taken in one at a time and addressed before the next? I am going up against a setup (B18C1/T04) I am not familiar with. Just looking for some numbers. Again, thank you for the response, esp.

[edman24]

ok lets start from the top. as stated the obd1 gsr motor would be the best and easiest for your project. its a lot easier to tune and will probably cost you less then the obd2 motor.

all different kinds of trannies are used. but for your turbo project i say gor for a b18b tranny because it has wider gear ratios and will allow boost to build better.

on a turbo b18c with stock internals i would say to expect about 220 to the wheels. someone correct me if im wrong on that. its just an educated guess. oh and our cars arent RWD so stop using rwhp and rwtq. you will get ridiculed for it.

for a streetable b18c its hard to say how much is streetable. ive seen some with 200hp, and ive seen some with 450. but anything above about 500hp would be very hard to drive on the street because of rough idle, emissions, and numerous other things. 450hp is possible on a street motor if done right.

for trap speeds it depends on the driver mostly. i could give many examples but im goin to answer the questions you asked instead of filling this with stories. but a good driver with a well built turbo b18c should be able to get into the 11's and a full blown one should get into the 10's.

the torque curve on the b18c is like most other 1.8 liter engines. its a little more lower rpm biased but has plenty of oomph on top end. with a turbo motor such as the one youre considering with that much hp you will be getting the slower start and flying by later in the race.

now for the advice....
from now on dont ask so many questions in one post. its very annoying and very few people will take the time to answer those questions. second be a little more specific. a b18c turbo can range from 200hp to 850hp and you specified no other mods then that the engine will have a turbo. and yes if he builds his b18 turbo to over 300hp you will have a very good race against you. his car is much lighter and doesnt require the torque or hp to move it like your car does. so be careful or will get burned by a little 4 cylinder.

now is there anything else i can help you with???

[esp]

remember this


power to weight ratio. he might only be puting 250 hp but his car is way lighter then yours i'm sure. so do act to cocky because you might get your ass handed to you if this guy can drive

[Frostbyte]

Originally posted by ox03
[As cross-posted in the Integra forum...]

An '00 EX wants to swap in a B18C1 w/ a Garret T04 setup. Model year unknown. Which model year B18C1 is considered the most venerable and desired? What is the typical transmission used? On average, what kind of numbers (RWHP, RWTQ SAE) can be expected to be put down? What is the streetable RWHP/RWTQ limit of the B18C1 and what kind of numbers can be expected to be put up (60', 1/4 , MPH)? Generally speaking.

A little background info: I hail from Los Angeles, CA and boost around town in a BPU '03 Cobra. Mods listed in sig. Put down 420 RWTQ and 390 RWTQ pre-pulley and tune. Mid-12s are feasible. Used to troll the streets in a '91 HKS Stage IV MR-2 Turbo. '00 B18C1/T04 wants to run, straight-line, no juice. I thought I would post a few questions so as to prepare myself for the upcoming race. Many questions!

What does the torque curve of a stock B18C1 look like? Where are the sweet spots? Any dyno charts, graphs available? I envision taking the hole shot and then fighting to keep the lead. Or would it be vice-versa? I should be able to put down at least 440 RWHP, 440 RWTQ and low-12s on street tires by the time we meet up. I will certainly take into account additional mods (suspension, drivetrain, ignition), but as of now am concerned with the oft-mentioned B18C1/T04 combo...

Looks like we have a Newb here. A B18c1 is not going to have any RWHP or RWTQ because it is not a Rear Wheel Drive. RWHP stands for Rear Wheel Horse Power which a B18c1 (GSR) is a front wheel drive car and so is your 00 EX. If you were to get a GSR motor I would N/A it if you werw going to Turbo I would get an LS B18a or B18b and then Turbo it.

[edman24]

hey frostbyte did you read my post at all? just wondering, cause i could have sworn i said the exact same things

[ox03]

edman24 said...
...be careful or will get burned by a little 4 cylinder.

esp said...
...so [don't] act to cocky because you might get your ass handed to you if this guy can drive.

I don't mind being burned by a 4-cylinder. Not at all. Heck, I used to boost around town in a four. I have had my ass handed to me several times at LACR. Fast is fast, period. Cocky? If I were, I would not be asking for your words of wisdom =>) See <http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...threadid=33023>. SoCal residency means less vs. Camaro, vs. GN (domestics) and more vs. Supra, vs. 300ZX (imports). And now, vs. Civic.

Frostbyte said...
Looks like we have a Newb here.

Indeed. New to Honda/Acura tuning, but not necessarily new to the scene. Although I should have known that you guys are FWD. Sorry 'bout that.

220 to the wheels is not bad at all. I did not figure 11's. In drag or street trim (slicks, ET streets, street tires, weight savings)? I am impressed. What about MPH in the 1/4? A good indication of accelerative abilities on a roll...

[edman24]

well yah 11's are very possible. especially if he gets built internals and a nice t4 turbo. but as far as mph in the 1/4 goes i wouldnt know what to tell you. its always very different. plus isnt saying that it goes 11 in the quarter enough? you got a nice car man but i must tell you that i really dislike fords and especially mustangs. no offense its just my personal opinion. i mean really whats the point of all that power if most of it gets wasted in wheelspin? anyway if youd like to get into the why i like hondas better then fords id love to, im just in that mood right now. but yah just be careful. a 300hp civic would make you regret spending that almost 40k you spent on your cobra.

hope i helped.

[4thgen91hatch]

I dunno but i saw a guy form my school with a Del sol with a GSR swap and t3/t4 and he only ran 14.8! This is at an elevation of 480 ft.

[civickiller]

like i said mid 12s

[edman24]

well ill bet anything that either that del sol wasnt tuned right or just had a turbo bolted on with no other modifications. plus the del sol is quite a bit heavier then a civic coupe or hatch. but still he must be a horrible driver to get only a 14.8 he should break into the 13's even with the stock setup.

[ox03]

edman24...
i mean really whats the point of all that power if most of it gets wasted in wheelspin?

And IRS wheelhop. I hear you loud and clear.

anyway if youd like to get into the why i like hondas better then fords id love to, im just in that mood right now.

When you are in the mood, I am all ears...

a 300hp civic would make you regret spending that almost 40k you spent on your cobra.

Perhaps.

civickiller...
like i said mid 12s

That is probably what he will pull when we run. Very good. This forum, you guys have certainly been helpful. I will post video and results of the run when the time comes. Much thanks all.

[shepworldwide]

is evryone to lazy to show this guy a graph..
b18c1 n/a w/standard bolt-on's