Error code 23 for Jeep GC 1996

[adamsetzler]

I have found error code 23, and I know it has something to do with the Blend Air Door or the actuator. Problem is, I am not a mechanic, so I don't automatically know what everything is by name. So, I need pictures or good descriptions.

I have a 1996 Jeep GC with ATC (NOT AZC). Could someone tell (or show) me the locations of the Blend Air Door and its Actuator? I have read everything from "it's under the glove box" to "you have to pull out the dash," so I would like to hear from someone who's worked with or knows this model.

Thanks so much in advance!

-Adam

[reekor]

You know do you?

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

I have found error code 23, and I know it has something to do with the Blend Air Door or the actuator.

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by reekor

You know do you?

According to the error code list, yes, but the person with the 1999+ Jeep heater fix (jeepheaterfix at yahoo.com) said that a loose vacuum line on an older model could be causing my problem.

What do you know?

[reekor]

The 1999+ is nothing like your 1996. 1999+ do have heater blend door issue, but
using advice from a 1999 is like repairing your 1996 using a GMC Jimmy manual.

Now with that said, on a 1996 Mil code 23 translates to OBD2 codes P0112 & P0113 both of the codes point to the same problem "air intake temp too high or low".


QUOTE=adamsetzler]According to the error code list, yes, but the person with the 1999+ Jeep heater fix (jeepheaterfix at yahoo.com) said that a loose vacuum line on an older model could be causing my problem.

What do you know? [/quote]

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by reekor

The 1999+ is nothing like your 1996. 1999+ do have heater blend door issue, but
using advice from a 1999 is like repairing your 1996 using a GMC Jimmy manual.

Now with that said, on a 1996 Mil code 23 translates to OBD2 codes P0112 & P0113 both of the codes point to the same problem "air intake temp too high or low".

Okay... so would this post #9 here be a good starting point?

[reekor]

If your heater does not change between hot and cold yes. If all you're after is to fix code 23 it has nothing to do with your heater.

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

Okay... so would this post #9 here be a good starting point?

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by reekor

If your heater does not change between hot and cold yes. If all you're after is to fix code 23 it has nothing to do with your heater.

Yes, yes, I know it doesn't have anything to do with my heater. I get that already.

So, to follow up, I removed the blend air actuator and inspected the little motor inside... heavily corroded and wouldn't activate with 12VDC, although it would spin when I separated it from the gears.

However, now that I know to replace that, I also flipped the blend air door both ways to see if I could get cold air... the hot air is very hot, and the "cold" air is under the hood temperature.

Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot "no cold air"? As in, is there anything I should check first that's somewhat easy? Please remember that pictures would be extremely helpful!

And THANKS SO MUCH!

[reekor]

Okay you're killing me here, Why are you messing around with the heater box?
This post is about Error code 23 and as you said "I know it doesn't have anything to do with my heater. I get that already". ???????????????

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

Yes, yes, I know it doesn't have anything to do with my heater. I get that already.

So, to follow up, I removed the blend air actuator and inspected the little motor inside... heavily corroded and wouldn't activate with 12VDC, although it would spin when I separated it from the gears.

However, now that I know to replace that, I also flipped the blend air door both ways to see if I could get cold air... the hot air is very hot, and the "cold" air is under the hood temperature.

Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot "no cold air"? As in, is there anything I should check first that's somewhat easy? Please remember that pictures would be extremely helpful!

And THANKS SO MUCH!

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by reekor

Okay you're killing me here, Why are you messing around with the heater box?
This post is about Error code 23 and as you said "I know it doesn't have anything to do with my heater. I get that already". ???????????????

Sorry, I think you misunderstood my second post when I reference the person with "the 1999+ Jeep heater fix." I had sent him an e-mail regarding the blend air door, and he had responded by saying that a leaky vacuum seal is usually the culprit behind an ATC 23 error code in older models.

Unfortunately, mine doesn't use vacuum tubes in that circuit. I was able to isolate the blend air actuator, remove it, and inspected it for damage, where I found that the servo-motor was inoperable.

I then checked the freon charge and hi/low pressures, and discovered that my compressor had died -- the magnetic field wasn't strong enough to pull the plate, although it did pull it when I jumped the circuit. Midas told me that when I replace the compressor, I also have to replace the orifice and collector in order to retain the warranty on the compressor. Is this true? In either case, are there any suggestions from where to buy these parts, and is it difficult to replace them in my 96 JZ?

I appreciate your attention. I'd like to avoid $1,600 in repair costs.

[reekor]

Now we are getting somewhere. That's right you have no vacuum control for your blend door, the 96 uses the same system as Ford a little box with an electric motor to open and close the blend door. Its non repairable, so if bad simply replace it.

What are your hi/low pressures and at what ambient temperature? When you jumped the circuit did it spin? If it did then the compressor is fine you may be low on charge or have a bad pressure switch. A weak clutch is going to be weak even if you jump the circuit. Clutches are replaceable without placing the compressor.

If the compressor is seized and/or making really loud noise then yes, Midas is 100% right, you do have to replace the orifice and collector. The reason for is when your compressor seizes and/or starts making really loud noise it means that the compressor has internal damage which sends metal shavings into the system that end up collecting in the collector and plugging up the orifice tube.
If you simply replace just the compress and leave the old collector and orifice
in place once the orifice plugs up it will overload the new compressor causing it to fail. If you get really luck and the orifice does not totally plug up and your compressor does not fail it will be over worked and not cool anywhere as good as it should.

The compressor is fairly easy to change however you do need special tools to change the orifice and collector. The tools are fairly cheap and are also used to remove engine fuel lines. You will also need to vacuum the air out of the system to about 10PSI negative before recharging.

Last year I bought a couple compressors with orifice and collector (sold as a kit) on ebay. Ebay item # 320252303150

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

Sorry, I think you misunderstood my second post when I reference the person with "the 1999+ Jeep heater fix." I had sent him an e-mail regarding the blend air door, and he had responded by saying that a leaky vacuum seal is usually the culprit behind an ATC 23 error code in older models.

Unfortunately, mine doesn't use vacuum tubes in that circuit. I was able to isolate the blend air actuator, remove it, and inspected it for damage, where I found that the servo-motor was inoperable.

I then checked the freon charge and hi/low pressures, and discovered that my compressor had died -- the magnetic field wasn't strong enough to pull the plate, although it did pull it when I jumped the circuit. Midas told me that when I replace the compressor, I also have to replace the orifice and collector in order to retain the warranty on the compressor. Is this true? In either case, are there any suggestions from where to buy these parts, and is it difficult to replace them in my 96 JZ?

I appreciate your attention. I'd like to avoid $1,600 in repair costs.

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by reekor

Now we are getting somewhere. That's right you have no vacuum control for your blend door, the 96 uses the same system as Ford a little box with an electric motor to open and close the blend door. Its non repairable, so if bad simply replace it.

Actually, if the blue "gear sensor" goes bad, you can try to replace the potentiometer that it's connected to. I didn't check, but they are usually 100k ohms and can be replaced with a simple soldering job since it isn't a surface mounted board (SMB).

What are your hi/low pressures and at what ambient temperature?

I can't remember. I was at Midas and they showed me there... I remember the low pressure being 50-60 and when the compressor plate was tapped into place (with a hammer as the Jeep was running and the A/C was turned on), the low pressure did not change. I don't remember the high pressure or the ambient temperature.

When you jumped the circuit did it spin? If it did then the compressor is fine you may be low on charge or have a bad pressure switch. A weak clutch is going to be weak even if you jump the circuit. Clutches are replaceable without placing the compressor.

Yes, it did. However, the low pressure didn't change when it did (or when it was manually tapped into place)... So, we know that the windings for the magnetic field are still good (or whatever is being used). Is it possible that I just have a bad pressure switch? What problems would that cause?

If the compressor is seized and/or making really loud noise then yes, Midas is 100% right, you do have to replace the orifice and collector. The reason for is when your compressor seizes and/or starts making really loud noise it means that the compressor has internal damage which sends metal shavings into the system that end up collecting in the collector and plugging up the orifice tube.
If you simply replace just the compress and leave the old collector and orifice
in place once the orifice plugs up it will overload the new compressor causing it to fail. If you get really luck and the orifice does not totally plug up and your compressor does not fail it will be over worked and not cool anywhere as good as it should.

The compressor is fairly easy to change however you do need special tools to change the orifice and collector. The tools are fairly cheap and are also used to remove engine fuel lines. You will also need to vacuum the air out of the system to about 10PSI negative before recharging.

Last year I bought a couple compressors with orifice and collector (sold as a kit) on ebay. Ebay item # 320252303150

I don't ever recall the compressor making a horrible noise or anything. My fan belt had broken while driving down the loop a while back, so would that have potentially damaged the compressor? (My A/C wasn't working back then, either).

I will look up that kit.

[adamsetzler]

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

I will look up that kit.

Holy moly. That kit is $235, whereas those parts would have cost me $1,200 at Midas. The compressor alone was $790. Thanks for the find!

[reekor]

You forgot to tell me that they had to tap the clutch for it to engage, this means the clutch has an issue. There are ways to try to fix that but in your case its pointless to try. Since the low side pressure did not change once engaged this tells me that the compressor is blown. When they blow they tend to lock up and break the belt or make a heck of a squeel until the compressor frees up or eats the fan belt.

You can't beat those prices on ebay, its nice when there is no middle man getting his hand into our wallets.

I almost forgot, If you do this swap make sure to check the compressor label and if it does need to be filled with oil do so. Same goes for the collector, simply dump the old oil out of the old collector and match the same amount of new PAG oil for the new collector.

Originally Posted by adamsetzler

Actually, if the blue "gear sensor" goes bad, you can try to replace the potentiometer that it's connected to. I didn't check, but they are usually 100k ohms and can be replaced with a simple soldering job since it isn't a surface mounted board (SMB).



I can't remember. I was at Midas and they showed me there... I remember the low pressure being 50-60 and when the compressor plate was tapped into place (with a hammer as the Jeep was running and the A/C was turned on), the low pressure did not change. I don't remember the high pressure or the ambient temperature.



Yes, it did. However, the low pressure didn't change when it did (or when it was manually tapped into place)... So, we know that the windings for the magnetic field are still good (or whatever is being used). Is it possible that I just have a bad pressure switch? What problems would that cause?



I don't ever recall the compressor making a horrible noise or anything. My fan belt had broken while driving down the loop a while back, so would that have potentially damaged the compressor? (My A/C wasn't working back then, either).

I will look up that kit.