Suspension Questions.....

[tblake]

Got sort of an annoying problem. Car Handles just fine most of the time.

Here's what happenes....

-Take a left turn, after returning wheel back to straight, car wants to pull a little to the left, and will continue to do this untill I take a right turn.

-Take a right turn, return wheel to straight, car drives 100%.

-Also have noticed that after taking a left turn and straightening out (car now pulls to left), if I come to a stop and turn the wheel to the right a little, when I start to go, If I let the wheel straighten itself out, it wont pull anymore and drive perfect.


Have replaced....

-Lower control arms (NEW with both bushings and ball joint)
-Stabilizer bar links (same time as lower control arms)
-Tie rod ends (Car needed them BAD)
-Numerous alignments (Tire's Plus solution to everything)

Brought it to tires plus one day to have them look it over. When they called me to pick it up, they said they couldnt find anything wrong, but aligned it. Drove home good, then pulled to the left the next time I drove it again.

I cant figure it out. Steering feels tight, and there is no looseness that I can feel while I have an assistant move the wheels back and forth.

I've had it to numerous different shops and they cant find anything loose either.

Was thinking about just replacing the struts and strut mounts to see if it fixes the problem, but I really dont want to spend any more money than I have to just throwing parts at it. Would bad struts or mounts cause a problem like this?

Tell me about adding a strut mount brace at the same time, would this do anything?

What could be the problem?

Thanks for any information guys!!!!!!!!!

[grandprixgtx00]

wild guess, but what about the rack and pinion

if i remember right...there was a TSB on some GP's involving the rack and pinion...

[tblake]

was there a TSB? Thanks I'll look into it!!!

[JonJon68]

There was also a recall for the rack & pinion and my 97 was included. Do not remember what other years were involved.

[BNaylor]

Tim doesn't have the full symptoms as stated in the old TSBs. At least not yet.

You could try checking and adjusting the rack and pinion preload.

[tblake]

Originally Posted by BNaylor

Tim doesn't have the full symptoms as stated in the old TSBs. At least not yet.

You could try checking and adjusting the rack and pinion preload.

Thanks for the reply Bob. What are the full symptoms of the TSB, and how do I check rack and pinion preload?

I dont know quite whats happening with it right now. It almost seems like there is a bushing out somewhere that shifts places when I take a left turn and shifts back when I go right. Dont know what one could be bad. They are all new except for the strut mounts. Its really getting annying, and the fact that numerous mechanics have had it up in the air and cant give me a ddefinate answer, makes me a little nervous.

Thanks for the help!!!

[tblake]

Could bad stabilizer bar to subframe bushings cause this to happen? Just thinking out loud.....

[richtazz]

Going from memory (I don't have the TSB in front of me) the rack issue only involved 97 and early 98 models. The problem was with the lower pinion input shaft bearing. It started with a cracking or grinding sound, and as it got worse, the car would no longer turn one way (I believe it was to the right).

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by tblake

Thanks for the reply Bob. What are the full symptoms of the TSB, and how do I check rack and pinion preload?

If your rack and pinion gets as bad as explained in the old GM TSB you'll know it for sure. Checking and adjusting the preload is not that difficult. It could affect steering centering after turning or wheel side to side movement and could possibly cause drifting issues. Doesn't hurt to check to rule it out.

To start you have to raise and properly support the front end. Get both wheels off the ground and jack it up enough to get under the driver's side of the car. Safely support with jackstands. Turn wheels to the straight ahead position. Loosen rack adjuster plug lock nut. Then turn the adjuster plug clockwise until it bottoms out in the housing. Next back off adjuster 50-70 degrees. While holding adjuster plug stationary tighten adjuster plug lock nut to specs which is 26 lb-ft. Final check is to take it for a test drive ensuring the steering wheel returns to center after turning.

[BNaylor]

NHTSA Campaign ID Number: 02V286000
Recall Date: 11/04/2002
Component: 1997 PONTIAC GRAND PRIX STEERING:RACK AND PINION
Potential Units Affected: 1159156
1997 PONTIAC GRAND PRIX STEERING:RACK AND PINION
Recall Date: 11/04/2002

Summary:
CERTAIN PASSENGER VEHICLES AND MINI VANS HAVE LOWER PINION BEARINGS IN THE POWER RACK AND PINION ASSEMBLY IN WHICH THE RETAINER TABS WERE NOT CRIMPED PROPERLY. THESE AND SOME OTHER RETAINERS USED IN VEHICLES ASSEMBLED BETWEEN JANUARY 1, 1996 AND OCTOBER 31, 1997, COULD FAIL AND PERMIT THE BALL BEARINGS TO ESCAPE.

Consequence:
IF THIS OCCURS, THE PINION SHAFT CAN BE FORCED UPWARD DURING LEFT TURNS AND BACK DOWN AS THE STEERING WHEEL IS MOVED BACK AND TO THE RIGHT. IF THE PINION SHAFT MOVES FURTHER, THE DRIVER WILL NEED TO EXERT MORE EFFORT TO TURN THE STEERING WHEEL, SIMILAR TO A VEHICLE WITHOUT POWER ASSISTED STEERING. IF THE PINION SHAFT MOVES EVEN FURTHER, THE DRIVER WILL REQUIRE MUCH HIGHER EFFORT TO TURN LEFT AND MAY NOT BE ABLE TO TURN THE WHEEL AS MUCH AS INTENDED. WITH THE MAXIMUM PINION SHAFT MOVEMENT, WHICH REQUIRES INTERNAL GEAR COMPONENT DAMAGE, THE DRIVER CAN ENCOUNTER HIGH RESISTANCE TO TURNING LEFT, FOLLOWED BY UNINTENDED POWER ASSIST TO THE RIGHT. IN ANY OF THESE CONDITIONS, A CRASH COULD OCCUR.

Remedy:
DEALERS WILL INSTALL A NEW LOWER PINION BEARING UNLESS INSPECT OF THE EXISTING BEARING INDICATES THAT REPLACEMENT OF THE GEAR ASSEMBLY IS NECESSARY. OWNER NOTIFICATION BEGAN JANUARY 24, 2003. OWNERS WHO TAKE THEIR VEHICLES TO AN AUTHORIZED DEALER ON AN AGREED UPON SERVICE DATE AND DO NOT RECEIVE THE FREE REMEDY WITHIN A REASONABLE TIME SHOULD CONTACT CHEVROLET AT 1-800-222-1020, PONTIAC AT 1-800-762-2737, OR OLDSMOBILE AT 1-800-442-6537.

Potential Units Affected: 1159156

Notes: PONTIAC GRAND PRIX TSB 02049 JAN 03

Note: 1998 should be included.

[tblake]

Thanks for the info guys!!! I will have a look at my rack and pinion preload as soon as I can. Will preload cause it to pull slightly after turning left, but when I turn right return to normal? It just puzzles me.

That TSB is defenatly not what I'm seeing. It sort of pulls to the left, thus its easier to steer to the left, or sometimes I can just let go and it will steer itself around curves.

Another things I've noticed but failed to mention....

After the car is turned to the left and straightened out (so now pulling a little to the left) when I hit bunps in the road going 45-60mph, the steering wheel will like dive to the left and it seems to make the car pull harder when the suspension has to work. Does that make sense? Does it sound like bad upper strut mounts?

Maybe I should just get new struts and mounts, just to eliminate that as the cause.

Thanks for the help guys, I really appreciate it. As soom as I have a day off when its nice out, I'm gonna crawl under and check everything. Got any specific ideas on what I should look at or how I should do it?

I was gonna start by having the vehicle on the ground, have it running, and have an assistant steer it from stop to stop and back and forth while I feel the front end components.

[Grand Prix SD]

sounds like strut bearings.

[tblake]

Does it? Other than that, it drives 100%.

[BNaylor]

How did your wheel alignment figures come out Tim? Do you have the specs? Hate to see you throw away money at parts that may not resolve your issue. Also, was your GTP ever in an accident?

[tblake]

Sorry for resurrecting an old thread here guys, I just wanted to let everyone know what fixed the issue in case someone happens upon this thread doing a google search with the same issue.

Replaced the strut mounts/struts today. The bearings were so seized together they were pretty much one! I couldnt even turn them by hand.

Car drives pretty much perfect now, and the ride seems a lot smoother.

Now all i need is an alignment. The wheel is just a little crooked.