97 PA Hums and Buzzes

[Holaday1185]

To all:

I currently drive a 1997 Buick Park Avenue and it runs great with just a few exceptions. For the past 2 months or so I've started to notice a buzzing or humming noise coming from the engine when speeds of 10-15 mph are reached. This noise only becomes slightly louder as I increase my mph. The sound is similar to a buzz or hum that perhaps an airplane might make? It's really hard to describe. When I put the car in neutral and rev the engine, It will not make the buzzing noise. So far, it has just proved to be an annoyance. Anyone out there have any ideas as to what is going on? I was thinking maybe a new belt would help. Not much of a car guru, so any help would be gladly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Sincerely,

David H

[HotZ28]

It is hard to cyber diagnose “a buzzing or humming noise” because everyone’s interpretation of sounds are different. It could be engine/transaxle related, or it could be chassis related coming from the front or rear wheel/hub bearings. If you cannot duplicate the sound when in park/neutral with engine running, I would suspect something in the drivetrain or wheel bearings! Have you tried turning off the A/C & radio while driving, to see if the noise remains the same? Do you notice an increase or decrease in sound while turning the wheel right or left while driving? Personally, I would take the car to a trusted shop to get an onsite opinion.

[Holaday1185]

Thanks,

I have turned off the radio and air to see if I could better hear the noise and such. Yes, when everything is off I can definitely better hear the noise. It's not loud enough to hear though with the windows down and the music at an appropriate level! Yes my car does make its usual groan turning left or right, maybe perhaps more then it should. I've done some research and thought it might be the bearings. I will definitely bring it to a mechanic that I trust. Anymore concrete ideas?

Thanks

[HotZ28]

If you take your car to the shop, this would be a good time to have them check all the tensioner & idler pulleys, especially the hidden one below the front engine mount (if you have the Ultra S/C engine). In addition, while the belt(s) are loose, have them check the water pump, P/S, A/C clutch and alternator bearings for any loose play, or other abnormalities.

[Holaday1185]

If it were perhaps the bearings on either one or both front tires, what am I looking to spend in order for them to both get fixed. Not too car savvy myself. Thanks-

[HotZ28]

Sorry, but I can’t give you a firm estimate, it depends on where you buy the parts & who you have install them. The dealer would charge about $250.00 for each hub assembly and about $125.00 ea to install them. If you shop around, you can find the hub assembly for $100–150, depending on the brand. Like any other part, you get what you pay for!

Any first-class ASE certified mechanic, should be able to install both of them in less than an hour. Of course, they will charge you the flat rate "book time" of 2-hrs. Most ASE shops charge 85 to 100 bucks an hour. If you make a few phone calls, you may find cheaper rates. You can do the math. Good luck!

[Holaday1185]

I've noticed that the problem has progressively gotten worse. I haven't had to time to take my car in because I'm a teacher and obviously work during the day. How important, if it is the front bearings, to get the problem fixed? Am I hurting anything else on my car by not getting this problem fixed immediately? By the problem getting worse, I mean that it had just gotten louder. It sounds a bit like an airplane when driving.

-Thanks

[HotZ28]

If you have a "Spring Break" coming up soon and do not plan on any highway trips in the interim, it may be OK to wait until you have a day off to get this checked out. The problem is, we do not know where the sound is coming from, so therefore, there is no way to determine if it is safe to drive or not. We can only speculate based on the information given.

[Holaday1185]

So I know what the deal is now concerning the buzzing and humming noise coming from the front of my car; it's a bad bearing hub assembly. Talked to the mechanic today and he told me about 350 - 400 per wheel. Does the 97 Park Avenue have a built in ABS sensor in the actual assembly? Also, does that sound about right, that darn much for one hub/bearing assembly? Thanks

[HotZ28]

Well, it is nice to have an on-site opinion of the noise! Obviously, your mechanic is charging dealer list prices for the hub assembly and labor. O’Reilly Auto Parts, list the “National Bearing” brand hub assembly for $126.99 ea with a 1-year warranty. (This is not my preferred brand, but will suffice). It comes with the ABS sensor and harness connector. Advanced Auto Parts, list the same “National Bearing” hub assembly for $149.98. (same part number). Like I said, shop around for parts and mechanics! Buy the parts first and then take them with your car to a trusted ASE shop for installation! Ask for a firm price quote for labor! (None of this -- "anywhere from 75-150 bucks per wheel" crap). BTW, shown below is a pic of the National Bearing Part # 513121 hub/bearing assembly to fit your car.

[wafrederick]

Certain cheap wheelbearings are good and I have very good luck with them.Getting them from Parts Plus for $60.00 a piece and never had one come back.

[BNaylor]

I prefer the AC Delco recommended replacement hubs but not purchased at a GM dealer since they charge too much. They come with a new axle nut and 3 new hub to spindle bolts and threadlocker applied. Cost from certain AC Delco parts suppliers ranges from around $135-$150 plus shipping. Also, the axle nut torque specified matches the specs in the service manuals so there is no question as to what the proper torque value is. Aftermarket hubs have varying axle nut torque values and the one to follow is what they recommend.

Originally Posted by wafrederick

Certain cheap wheelbearings are good and I have very good luck with them.

I find that hard to believe considering you have made a claim at various AF forums that you do not use a torque wrench.

[wafrederick]

The A/C Delco wheel bearings are junk and this is what I hear.I use a torque wrench on headbolts,rod and main caps only and not on the the rest for one reason: WASTE OF TIME!Who torques caliper bracket bolts?No one does and most shops don't do this wanting the car out ASAP.It is called the German torque spec: Good and tight.You cannot overtighten an axle nut and the axle has a stop on it

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by wafrederick

The A/C Delco wheel bearings are junk and this is what I hear.I use a torque wrench on headbolts,rod and main caps only and not on the the rest for one reason: WASTE OF TIME!Who torques caliper bracket bolts?No one does and most shops don't do this wanting the car out ASAP.It is called the German torque spec: Good and tight.You cannot overtighten an axle nut and the axle has a stop on it

What personal experience do you have with AC Delco hubs other than what you hear? I've had no problems with them. Waste of time using a torque wrench?

I torque caliper bolts and the caliper mounting bracket bolts. If you followed the same maybe you wouldn't be breaking bolts or doing the job over again as we discussed at some other forums where you have spread your bad advice.

It is quite obvious you know nothing about proper auto maintenance. Contrary to your misplaced belief you can over torque an axle nut which will lead to premature wheel bearing failure. You are adjusting bearing pre-load.

This is what I am going to do instead of having any further argument with you and having to watch you spread what is obviously bad automotive repair advice at this and many AF forums. If I see any further bad advice deemed as non-contributory, wrong advice, reckless advice or disregard for proper maintenance procedure(s) you are going on a vacation from AF. Consider this your formal and only warning.

[richtazz]

You cannot overtighten an axle nut and the axle has a stop on it

What??? I would like to see this "axle stop"!

The hubs are pressed together as an assembly, but it's the axle nut torque that puts the proper amount of preload on the bearing. This preload clamping force is what keeps the hub bearing together. Too tight, and it will create too much friction making the hub bind, too loose and the hub can come apart. If you install them with an impact wrench, the hammering action will damage the ABS components, as well as impart small dents in the bearing race shortening it's service life. Install all hub bearings with hand tools only and tighten with a torque wrench to proper spec.

Wafrederick, I bet you're the type that will use compression unions to repair brake lines too! Hopefully you don't kill someone when one of your cobble jobs comes apart.