Syncro problem

[Gene H]

Hi all: My 95 3cyl,manual transmission had bad syncros in 1st and 2nd gear but the others were fine. I swapped it out last fall with a $20 93 trans. That trans worked OK except 2nd gear was a little stubborn when downshifting. Yesterday it crunched while shifting up into 2nd gear. Now it won't go into 2nd gear at all. I figure I must have wrecked that syncro for good. I gutted the original trans and I have all the parts. Will the 3rd and 4th gear syncros from my original trans swap into the 1st and 2nd gear position of this other transmission?
Thanks for your response.

[91Caprice9c1]

No. The third and fourth gear synchros [33] are the same. First [15], second [11] and fifth [25] gear synchros are different altogether. They are not interchangeable. The OEM part number for your second gear synchro is: 96065439

-MechanicMatt





"The low speed synchronizer mounts on the countershaft. The low speed synchronizer will engage with either the countershaft 1st gear or the countershaft 2nd gear. The high speed synchronizer mounts on the input shaft. The high speed synchronizer will engage with either the input shaft 3rd gear or the input shaft 4th gear. The 5th speed synchronizer mounts on the input shaft. The 5th speed synchronizer engages with the input shaft 5th gear. The countershaft meshes with and turns the ring gear of the differential assembly that supplies power to the drive axles."

[dwendt1978]

If your worried about fixing it you could also just double clutch it and bypass the syncros all together.

[Gene H]

Thanks guys.
Double clutch doesn't work. Using first gear syncro technique doesn't work. Heck, I even tried engaging 2nd gear when I push the car in my garage and it doesn't go in. The other gears do. I'll call the dealer to get the cost for the new syncros.

[91Caprice9c1]

fwiw: Autozone sells two versions of the same rebuild kit. One w/ synchros one w/out synchros.

-MechanicMatt

[Woodie83]

Who would rebuild a trans without replacing the only part that goes bad in normal use? A rebuild kit without synchros makes no sense at all. Synchronizers are little tiny clutches that are made out of brass and wear in normal use. Reusing them is like reusing brake pads or a clutch disk.

To the original poster, you're way past the point where you need synchros, that was back when it was hard to downshift. You need new gears or at least dog rings. It was in the 60's that synchronizers became standard, if you shift properly a transmission will work fine without them.

[91Caprice9c1]

Originally Posted by Woodie83

Who would rebuild a trans without replacing the only part that goes bad in normal use? A rebuild kit without synchros makes no sense at all.

Haha I agree man, just stating the facts.

Originally Posted by Woodie83

To the original poster, you're way past the point where you need synchros, that was back when it was hard to downshift. You need new gears or at least dog rings.

Yeah, that's true, if you can't get it into 2nd when not moving you're definitely in for some expensive hard-parts.

Originally Posted by Woodie83

It was in the 60's that synchronizers became standard, if you shift properly a transmission will work fine without them.

Thats true, but it does require some practice, and a tireless left leg.

-MechanicMatt

[Crvett69]

you can get a complete rebuild kit with syncros, bearings and seals for about $160 on e-bay. also on teamswift.net under tranny section they have a step by step procedure on how to rebuild it

[Gene H]

Syncro Update. I,ve been running the car by skipping second gear and going from first to third. I kinda got used to it. This worked but it stressed the motor a little. Last weekend I replaced the transmission with a good one from a 91 Metro. Only 118,000 miles on it. So far so good. It's as smooth as silk. Now I have to get used to using second again. Funny thing, during my initial test run on the new trans, my first shift was from first to third. Completely skipped second. Bad habits are hard to change.
Anyway, I'm confused about the speedo gear. When you get a transmission out of a Metro, you can never be sure that it's the original transmission. Over on "TeamSwift" a thread indicates the gear color and teeth as follows:
speedometer ratio (faster) 18 x 16(brown) for wheels 14" (GT,GTi)
speedometer ratio (slow) 18 x 17(white)for wheels 13" (GA,GL,GLX,GS)
speedometer ratio (slower)?? x ?? (yellow/beige) for wheels 12"
My 95 metro has a brown gear, 16 teeth and 13" wheels. The '91 and '93 transmissions had white/ish gear w/17 teeth and 12" wheels. Is my brown gear correct for the 13" wheels?