2003 taurus 3.0 vulcan slow/no start sometimes

[noclues]

i have a 2003 taurus 3.0 vulcan engine which worked fine. i got it with 32500 mi as a "certified pre-owned" from a dealer and owned it for a bit longer than 2 years - 55500 miles on it now.

a few days back when i stopped for gas (maybe 10 minutes) the car just wouldnt start (turn over) but all the dash lights and radio were working. it was not making ANY noise when turning the key to start it! jumpstart worked but even with the jumpstart car connected the starter was turning over very slowly and then faster until it started - but it took a long time - probably half a minute. the car had not moved for a day before that and on that day it was driven just a short distance to the grocery store (probably a mile or so) and then back to the gas station near my home (another mile) where the problem happened. it started fine earlier when leaving the grocery store. the weather was above freezing and humidity quite high.

today i got the same problem when leaving the grocery store (maybe 40-50 minutes after last being driven). the car did start on its own without jumpstart but it was barely turning over, then faster and finally started after about 30 seconds. the grocery store is less than a mile from home. the car was driven just a few hours before for about 12 miles at 50mph.

between the first and second problem i cleaned the battery contacts with soda and a brush. the alternator appears to be charging at 14.5volts and when the engine is off the charge goes to 12.5volts. however i could not measure the power when the car wouldnt start since i didnt have the Voltmeter with me.

i have not had any problems like this before and between the 2 events the car started normally every time - even after short trips less than a mile. i've never changed any parts so i'm assuming they're still original. the battery has the green dot visible in the window and it's maintenance free.

i know i have to get a new battery but i'm just wondering if this is a starter issue. as i said there was no noise the first time and both the first and the second time it barely started as if the battery was dead or the engine was stuck and the starter could not move it.

thanks for any help!

[shorod]

You should probably remove the cables from the battery and clean the terminals and cables, then re-install making sure the cables are secured well to the battery posts.

The hydrometer green eye are not that reliable, so I wouldn't trust that just because it's green means the battery is fine. Your local auto parts store is probably able to perform a load test on the battery. You could also have an intermittant open circuit within the battery causing your problems too.

-Rod

[noclues]

Originally Posted by shorod

You should probably remove the cables from the battery and clean the terminals and cables, then re-install making sure the cables are secured well to the battery posts.

The hydrometer green eye are not that reliable, so I wouldn't trust that just because it's green means the battery is fine. Your local auto parts store is probably able to perform a load test on the battery. You could also have an intermittant open circuit within the battery causing your problems too.

-Rod

i'm planning to have it tested at autozone and probably buy a new battery there too. i hope it's just the battery with a shorted cell or smth since that's the cheapest one of the parts that could have a fault in this (alternator, starter). the battery connections are clean - just cleaned a few days ago.

[tripletdaddy]

I put everything on your battery!

[cj091184]

I'll take that bet,

The starter is fried, your battery is good because it aparently has power to turn the starter slow and faster and faster, if the battery was bad it would go slower and slower as the battery died. It could also be a bad ground, but if all the wiring looks good and tight and "clean" then I would say starter.

[tripletdaddy]

Darn, that does sound familiar. What was I thinking?!?

[noclues]

Originally Posted by cj091184

I'll take that bet,

The starter is fried, your battery is good because it aparently has power to turn the starter slow and faster and faster, if the battery was bad it would go slower and slower as the battery died. It could also be a bad ground, but if all the wiring looks good and tight and "clean" then I would say starter.

why would the starter work most of the times then not work twice within a a week? i'm somewhat confused... is that a typical way for starters to die or is it just an assumption?

i would also say that yesterday at the grocery store when the car barely started it did go slower and slower at first but i kept the key in the start position and after a short pause it started moving faster until it started. but it did take a very long time (probably because i was thinking of the alternatives if it wont start...)

[Dave_s]

Just the way it goes. To confirm its your starter, when it won't start try hitting the starter a couple times with a hammer. It is better to hit it while trying to start the car (takes two people) but it will sometimes work either way. Hitting the starter loosens it up and then will start up. Its a temp fix, but at least you will know for sure.

[noclues]

just wondering. i received a "3 year limited powertrain warranty" from ford (not from the dealer) for this "certified pre-owned" car - included in the price. is the starter part of the "powertrain"?

thanks for all your help!

[shorod]

Nope, the starter would be part of the "normal maintenance" item section.

-Rod

[noclues]

Originally Posted by shorod

Nope, the starter would be part of the "normal maintenance" item section.

-Rod

of course i was expecting that... even "bumper to bumper" warranties are just worthless paper

but anyway i went to autozone and murray's and both said the battery is too low but alternator/starter appear to be fine. murray's was more throrough, i had to start/stop the AC, headlights, rev it up... so i replaced the battery and i guess it's wait and see. if it happens again i guess i'll take it to the mechanic - i dont think i'll replace the starter myself since i dont have a garage or advanced tools.

i'll post again if sh1t happens!

[noclues]

Originally Posted by Dave_s

Just the way it goes. To confirm its your starter, when it won't start try hitting the starter a couple times with a hammer. It is better to hit it while trying to start the car (takes two people) but it will sometimes work either way. Hitting the starter loosens it up and then will start up. Its a temp fix, but at least you will know for sure.

OK.. it happened again today. TWICE. driving around lunch time to several places. starts up instantly, then absolutely no noise when trying to start. had voltmeter with me, voltage is 12.47volts or so. still no cranking. took the hammer out and hit the starter and the solenoid gently... a few more tries and hits and it started. then it started normally a few times, then again no start, voltage OK, hammer out, a few hits - crank - hit - crank and it works again. there was NO slow cranking this time, it was either nothing or instant start.

questions:
1. can this be the anti theft (original ford) module? issue happened with 2 different keys. and the keys are in different places - so i'm assuming the keys are fine. it also started again after a few retries, each time the key being removed and inserted again. how can i test the anti theft? i know the slow cranking from last week could say it's the starter but considering the cost i'd like the make SURE it needs replacement...
2. if it's the starter how hard is it to replace it myself? 3 screws and 3 connectors in 30 minutes or does it need more than that (tuneup, testing, special tools, blabla)
3. how long can i drive like this using the good old big hammer method? i wouldnt want to be stranded somewhere.

appreciate your answers!

[noclues]

... and a third one for the day at the gas station but this time it was the slow slow faster cranking and start thing. no hammer luckily

i guess it's the starter after all...

[shorod]

If it's the starter and not cranking immediately after hitting the starter, I'd doubt you'll get by very long this way. Sounds like the brushes are pretty far gone.

Do you at least hear a click from under the hood when you try to start and get nothing? If you hear a firm click, but no crank, then I'd agree it's just about guaranteed to be the starter.

I thought the PATS system just prevented the injectors from opening, but I thought would still allow the engine to crank. However, your 2003 probably has SecuriLock which may disable the starter as well. If the anti-theft is the issue, you'll probably have a flashing or solid "THEFT" or "SECURITY" indicator in the instrument cluster when trying to start the engine. You could confirm this as possibly the issue if you have access to a professional scan tool that can access the anti-theft system. Have you snooped around under the dash to look for evidence that maybe an aftermarket remote start system was installed at one time, or possibly still installed?

-Rod

[shorod]

According to the 2002 service manual, it sounds like the SecuriLock system will prevent the engine from cranking if activated. You don't happen to have two or more Ford transponder keys on the same key ring, do you? If so, try only the key for your car, removing it from the key ring and keeping the other keys away from the steering column.

-Rod