2001 LS Starting Problem

[kdierking]

Help please.

My car just started acting different when starting. As soon as the key is turned, the engine starts immediately, then sputter almost dead, then starts running normally. This usually happens on a cold start. It almost seems to be starting too soon. not the normal turnover delay. If i shut it off, the car starts normally again. I am concerned about a problem that will get worse.

Any ideas?

[shorod]

Almost sounds like you might have a fuel pressure regulator issue or a leaking fuel injector or two. Try adding a bottle of fuel injector cleaner to the fuel tank and see if that has any effect. Even if it doesn't fix it, but changes it, then you'll know we're on the right track. Obviously this won't have an immediate effect, you'll need to drive a few miles or have the engine running for some amount of time.

-Rod

[kdierking]

Originally Posted by shorod

Almost sounds like you might have a fuel pressure regulator issue or a leaking fuel injector or two. Try adding a bottle of fuel injector cleaner to the fuel tank and see if that has any effect. Even if it doesn't fix it, but changes it, then you'll know we're on the right track. Obviously this won't have an immediate effect, you'll need to drive a few miles or have the engine running for some amount of time.

-Rod

Thank you,

I added the cleaner like you described and noticed an improvement for the first couple days. On the next tank of gas, the problem did start to happen again so i added another bottle when filling up. The problem happens intermittently now and usually the worst when it is cold. I have never had a problem with it not starting, just acts weird as described. But, i am worried that something major is about to leave me stranded and winter is right on top of us.

Sometimes when i turn over the car, it feels like it does not start but then it starts running after a second or two. Any ideas?

[shorod]

The LS seems to have some pretty quirky issues when the battery gets old/weak. Even if the engine seems to crank fine, it may still be experiencing issues with the battery.

My wife's 2002 LS V6 would intermittantly stall when she'd shift from Park. I tried a cylinder decarbonization using 1/3 can of SeaFoam. Made the car run better, but still had the intermittant stall. I then pulled the upper intake manifold to replace the PCV elbow. No change. The following weekend I put a new battery in it. The car has gone all year without stalling.

-Rod

[kdierking]

A lot can happen in a few months... A trip to the dealer and they needed to reprogram the PCM and replace the IAC to fix the problem (cost $500). The problem still continued. When I took it back they told me the PCM was part of a TSB and was needed. They also told me the IAC was broke and needed to be replaced anyway. Then they kept it for two days and changed the PCM program several times trying to find a solution. Ultimately they told me the next step was to replace the PCM ($1,300). I asked if they would guarantee the problem would be resolved and they told me "We can't guarantee it, it is just the next step in the ford Diagnostic flow chart". So, I did not do it. One of my peers at worked told me to click over the key 5 times and wait in between for a few seconds. He told me that would fully prime the fuel system and if it started, I may need a fuel pump. Much to my surprise, I did this and it workd about 90% of time. I figured the other 10% was due to waiting too long or losing count. Anyway, I had the fuel pump replaced. this was just last week. The problem is still with me today. I took the car to another shop and will leave it with them to diagnose. Everyone that has looked at it tells me the Battery and charging system is good. The batter was replaced about 18 months ago.

Any thoughts???

[shorod]

A new battery would be a lot less than $1,300.... On my wife's LS, the battery and charging system checked out okay. I even desulfated the battery. It took a new one to fix the stalling issue though.

Has the car ever had a tune up? How many miles are on it? Pull a plug or two and see what they look like. Also, try replacing the fuel filter. These are routine maintenance items and would be worth the peace of mind just to have them done. On the V8, the plugs are not too bad to replace. The V6 is a bit more difficult.

Also try holding the throttle open just a bit when starting. If that seems to make things better, then maybe you should consider cleaning the passages to the idle air control, or possibly replacing the Idle Air Control (IAC) servo.

Is there something common that you have turned on when the issue happens, such as always when the defrost is on, or always when the windshield wiper heaters are on, or only when the outside temp is below some certain range? Maybe only after a snow or rain? Any clues like this will help narrow your search.

-Rod

[danielsatur]

1) There's a Hot cycle when the engine is turned off ,if there is fuel on
the injectors it's baked on.
2) With todays emissions,we are recycling EGR,and PCV gases by putting
them back in the intake.

Note: Theres alot of Gunk+junk build-up,I have just replaced a catalytic converter
on 1993 Honda civic that was 95% Blocked.

How many miles are on this car?

I would probably try an off car Injector service! ,it's around $25 per Injector.
The injectors are put in a ultra-sonic bath,pressure cleaned,and checked for flow rate.

LS - Will charge $500 per injector!

** Next time your car acts up during start-up period,turn Engine off and Restart!
''DONT LET THE ENGINE ACT-UP''

MCGIVER

[kdierking]

Good point on the battery. That may be the next thing.

Car has 168K miles and has always been very reliable. Not had the same issues posted elsewhere.

The following maintenance was performed at 160k:
Replace Fuel Filter
Complete interior cleaning of inectors and fuel rail(???)
PCV system cleaned and replaced breather tube (oily)
8 new spark plugs
replaced main drive belt.

The first thing the Dealer suggested to try to solve the starting problem was to replace the Idle Air control servo valve. ( I did this and new program for the PCM - $500)

I will start looking at variables and conditions to see if it can be narrowed down.

Also, do dealers perform the off car injection cleaner? I thought that was what I was getting but looking at the invoice they probably just ran a bottle of cleaner thru it or something.

The dealer did suggest de-carbing for $160 which I did not do based on a recommendation from a friend.

I will try a new battery if nothing else turns up soon. It has never let me down and always start after cranking for a few seconds but it is very annoying.

[shorod]

A $6 can of SeaFoam and some patience, along with a well-ventilated area, and you can do the cylinder de-carb yourself. Why did the friend not recommend you have that done, because of the price or he didn't think it would help? I'm adding the SeaFoam de-carb to part of my annual maintenance, it does good work!

-Rod

[danielsatur]

1) I have done an off car Injector service myself,and it's easier than changing
the spark plugs.
2) Do a GOGGLE on ''OUT OF CAR INJECTOR SERVICE''
$25-$30 per injector.

Note: Auto service wants you to buy new ones,because there's more money made.

3) Make sure all old seals are taken out of fuel rail,or this will create problems.
4) Replace fuel filter.
5) I used 1/2 can of Seafoam in tank only,see YouTube.

** Runs like a new JAG,see S TYPE JAGUAR.


MCGIVER