Series II or Series I 3800 In My 1995 LeSabre?

[CarDude225]

Just a quick question. I read on Wikipedia that Series II 3800 was introduced in 1995, but I read somewhere else on Wikipedia that the LeSabre didn't get a series II until 1996.

I have a 1995 LeSabre. Do I have a Series I or Series II 3800? Is it stamped somewhere on the engine? Thanks.

[HotZ28]

The eight digit on your VIN should be an "L" and that is telling you it is a series I. If it was a series II, that same eight digit would be "K", however, LeSabre did not get the series II until 1996.

[BNaylor]

If you have the Series II it will look like this. The plastic engine cover will say it. When you remove the cover you will see the infamous plastic UIM plenum.





The SII 3800 was first introduced on certain GM models in '95 like on the Bonneville, Park Avenue, and Riviera and supposedly did not come out on the LeSabre until the 1996 production year. Someone has claimed they have a Series II 3800 in a 1995 LeSabre but no one has been able to show proof of that.

Check your VIN number and see if the 8th digit from left to right says "L" or "K". VIN "K" is the SII 3800.

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

The eight digit on your VIN should be an "L" and that is telling you it is a series I. If it was a series II, that same eight digit would be "K", however, LeSabre did not get the series II until 1996.

Sorry Bo, didn't see you had this covered. Pic is worth a thousand words.

[vrmlbasic]

Wikipedia also says that the 1992 LeSabre has folding rear seats, and I can assure you that the only way that seat back is folding is if you wrangle the seatbelts out of the way, and bust out a hacksaw on the restraining metal hook in the middle of the seat.

Wikipedia is a great site, with less errors on average than Encyclopedia Brittanica, but it can be wrong at all the wrong times

[CarDude225]

Thanks all!

My 8th VIN digit is an L and I do not have "Series II" printed on my plastic cover so it must be a series I. Poops.

My 96 Olds Ciera Wagon (say what?!) was totaled on 9/5 and my wife drives the 95 LeSabre. So I am looking for a replacement car and really like her LeSabre.

Can someone advise what the specs are for the Series I 3800 and the Series II in terms of hp and torque? I heard the Series II have alot more power. If that is the case I'll be looking for a LeSabre 1996 and up.

Also, are there any reliability issues for the Series I and the Series II 3800s? I'm convinced not to go with any vehicle that has the 3.1 or 3.4 up to and including model year 2003 due to the infamous lower intake manifold gasket flaw. I realize that if this gasket is replaced early on then the engine should be fine. I just don't want the headache though. I had to have it replaced on the Ciera (3.1).

Thanks!!

[CarDude225]

I found that the 3800 Series I is 170hp & 220 ftlb of torque, and the 3800 Series II is 205hp & 230 ftlb of torque (hardly any more torque, but big gains on hp).

Have any of you driven a LeSabre with a Series I (1995 and prior), and a LeSabre with a Series II (1996 - 1999)? Is there much of a power difference?

I found also that the Series II has a upper intake maifold gasket issue. Expensive fix when it goes?

I have to decide if I am going to purchase 1995 or stick only with 1996 and newer LeSabre.

T-H-A-N-K-S

[HotZ28]

Why not search for a 96-98 Park Avenue Ultra? If you could find one of these, you can forget about UIM & gasket problems. The intakes are all aluminum, plus the PA has a lot more options for just a little more money. It took me about two years to find my ultimate 96 Ultra.

Take your time and look long & hard for the right car. BTW, the reason I refer to the 1996 Ultra as being the “Ultimate Ultra” is; it is 250 lbs lighter than the 97 up, plus it has the same Series II VIN "K" supercharged engine, so therefore, less weight = better gas mileage and better performance. The pics below shows what a little time, work & money can do for the 96 PA!

[CarDude225]

That's awesome...I love your car man!!!!

Only one question...why is the 97 and up 250 lbs heavier??

[HotZ28]

Sorry, I was 46 lbs off, I stand corrected, it is actually 204 lbs lighter. This was due to the body style change in 97.

[BNaylor]

Is that a pic of yor engine Bo? Man that is clean. I thought I had the cleanest SII 3800 Supercharged Vin "1" around. 10 years old now.

[HotZ28]

Yea Bob, that is an actual shot of my PA engine. I have one before any cleaning/painting was started (top pic) and two after, posted below. New set of MSD 8.5 mm spiral wound wires will be installed in a few days.

Before any detail work was started

Engine cleaned with SC cover removed

Final cleaning & painting of SC cover

[Blue Bowtie]

SI/SII really doesn't matter. The rotating unit is essentially the same. The durability is there regardless. The only difference is the induction system. The SI is completely SFI, so there is not a major difference. And the supercharger is not the "ultimate" induction for the little Buick, anyway. The best induction system was done long before there was either a SI" or "SII" designation. The turbocharged Buicks had considerably more HP and torque than any of the later iterations with or without blowers. Yes, I know the factory "officially" listed the Turbo Buicks at a paltry "250HP" net. We all know that was a political joke.

As long as you have a Buick 231, consider yourself fortunate. Every other auto manufacturer has tried to copy it (unsuccessfully) for 40 years. It still reigns as King of V-6s, even with it's "antiquated" single, central camshaft and only two valves per cylinder. It doesn't need more camshafts than liters to make power, be efficient, and be very durable. Try to put 25 pounds of boost on a Ford 3.8L V-6, Toyota 3.5 or 4L, or Chrysler 4.0L V-6 and see what happens to the crank after a few passes. The Buick just keeps rolling and asking for more. Oddly, even the "serious" Toyota-driving off-roaders are switching to Buick 231s in their Toyotas:

http://www.off-road.com/4x4web/toyot...k_v6_swap.html

http://toyota.off-road.com/toyota/ar....jsp?id=274607

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by HotZ28

Yea Bob, that is an actual shot of my PA engine. I have one before any cleaning/painting was started (top pic) and two after, posted below. New set of MSD 8.5 mm spiral wound wires will be installed in a few days.

Good job!

I recall we talked some about it when you first got it. Any other mods planned?