fuel pump gone bad?

[rdeckert]

So, my van hasn't been starting at all. I have the 89 Caravan. I went and got can of starting fluid, sprayed it into the intake, and it started...for like a second. So basically it'll start but then die when I use the starting fluid. That would indicate my fuel pump being bad, right? What else could that mean? I was told my fuel filter is a possibility. How long are fuel filters supposed to last?

Also is it possible to somehow "reset" the computer by just temporarily disconnecting the battery? I've tried collecting the error codes from the Check Engine light and I just get the obvious 12 and 55.

[Bernard Feltzer]

What happens when you bang on the bottom of your gas tank with a rubber mallet? Does it start then?

[rdeckert]

Don't have a mallet or anything to use really.

Second question though: Does anyone know where the fuel filter would be located or even what it looks like? (I know what the fuel filter should look like). I don't see one anywhere under the hood and I don't see one running along the under sides of the van. I already tried looking in the owner's manual, but no such luck.

Here's another note as well. I'm almost always running on low fuel. Which I think I know that it could make my fuel filter go bad because I know that can let in dirt and stuff into the the tank which will then get into the fuel filter and clog it.

[Bernard Feltzer]

Bang on the bottom of the gas tank with your fist, the fuel pump is in gas tank. If it starts, your pump is bad.
Fuel filter is underneath van near passenger front seat. It is in series with the fuel line. They rarely ever go bad because they are oversized on that model.
Running the gas tank below 1/8th is very bad., fuel pump will be ruined if it runs dry.

[Spit]

I have a 96 grand caravan and the fuel filter for it is on top of the gas tank,
not sure on a 89. On the 96 it's tricky to get to, You should get a Haynes or Chilton's manual and check it out. They are less than $20 a have a wealth of knowledge in them... Good chance that your local public library
has one on the shelf..if you don't want to spend the cash.

[rdeckert]

So if it is on top (if it is), then I should just have to drop the tank and it'll be right there? And if I drop the tank, can I still leave the lines connected and try to start it before I put the whole thing back on?
Another problem. That tank has about 1/4 to a 1/3 tank of gas in it. I can't siphon it out because there's a trap inside. Can it be let down slowly or something without completely taking off the supporting straps?

Secondly: The whole banging on the tank with the mallet and then trying to start it. That'll let me know if my fuel pump is bad (if it were to start), right? And do I need someone else to be there at the same time so one can try to start while one is hitting the tank? or can I do it by myself?

[Spit]

The science behind banging it with a rubber mallet is that the pump can stick either due to a mechanical problem...junk in or around the impeller or wear on a bearing surface in the motor (a flat spot) that the armeture is stuck against. Either way the banging can possibly knock it loose.

I have read other posts on this forum where people have said that they were able to replace the on-top of the tank fuel filters without dropping the tank.
Some have said that they only loosened it slightly, to get some room. I think some said that they were able to do it without either.

If you need to drop it with gas in it... balance a piece of plywood on a rolling jack, make sure it's big enough to support the tank. Pump the jack up flush to the tank, and then undo the bands that support it and slowly lower the jack to the level you need to have it at to work on it.

Before you do all this make sure that on a 89 that filter is in the same place

Good Luck

[rdeckert]

Thank you for that information. I've come to find that filter is indeed under the passenger door running along the fuel line. I looked before but I guess I just didn't look very good because I didn't see it last time. But to the point, if it's not the filter, then it is the pump, right? I mean, I used the starting fluid and then got it started for a second (then died) which would indicate a problem with the fuel not getting there. Not lines are busted, not gas is leaking, and there's fuel in the tank.

P.S. Sorry for being such a pain in the neck about this whole thing

[Spit]

There could be other electrical problems other than the pump. There is a fuel pump relay, possibly a fuse for the fuel pump also. I think for your model the fuel pump relay is under the hood on the driver's side wheel well. Should be 3 relays there about the size of a matchbook maybe 3/4 of an inch tall. They should be identical and you should be able to switch one with another and eliminate the relay...But I'm not sure which is which..maybe someone else more experienced with the 89 can reply. If you have an owners manual it may show you in the section that has the fuse information etc.

I wouldn't drop the tank for fun...but one thing that proves it's the pump and not the wiring it to check for voltage at the pump..if the voltage is there and the pump doesn't run..it's the pump. if there is no voltage there it's somewhere in the wiring/controls

You may not have to drop the tank to check the wiring..maybe you can loosen it a little to get some room to probe the wires.

Good Luck

[Bernard Feltzer]

I wish I was there so I could bang your head on the gas tank.
You will need a helper to drop the tank, you should remove it completely.
The fun part? removing the screws from underneath where the fuel filler pipe connects to the body.
You will need a hammer and a punch to remove the mounting lock ring of the fuel pump.
Another thing I am not sure of, the replacement pump may have a wiring change, so make sure you have the instructions.

Make sure your gas tank is not leaking at the seams, if it is , then install a new tank.
Wear gloves when lowering the tank so you don't cut your hands up.

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by rdeckert

Thank you for that information. I've come to find that filter is indeed under the passenger door running along the fuel line. I looked before but I guess I just didn't look very good because I didn't see it last time. But to the point, if it's not the filter, then it is the pump, right? I mean, I used the starting fluid and then got it started for a second (then died) which would indicate a problem with the fuel not getting there. Not lines are busted, not gas is leaking, and there's fuel in the tank.

P.S. Sorry for being such a pain in the neck about this whole thing

Instead of throwing parts at it do some proper testing.
have you got spark?
Have you got proper fuel pressure?
Can you her the fuel pump prime up.
Is this a 3.0 V6?
If so check that timing belt timing and see if the dist is turning?
And sparking at all spark plugs?
Has it got compression.

[Bear]

If the fuel pump is gone, you can replace it without fully dropping the tank, you will need a floor jack,sheet of ply wood, strap wrench and sockets (to loosen the strap hangers). I would try and burn fuel level down as low as possible and then put car on ramps (forgot to mention ramps), place floor jack head at center of the tank and place a sheet of plywood on the jack head (plywood is simply to distribute the load), jack her up to put a bit of pressure on the tank, loosen strap bolts and slowly lower tank just enough to reach on top and disconnect fuel lines and get a strap wrench on the lock ring, remove lock ring and take the pump out and replace with a new pump, hook fuel lines up and jack tank up to point where you can reattach the hangers and then tighten the strap hanger bolts. fire her up and check for leaks.

[rdeckert]

ok then.. is it the front or the rear ring in which this pain in the arse pump resides in?

[Scrapper]

sounds like fuel pump but i'd chane gas filter first alot cheaper....