95 grand am over heating problems

[rdub202]

hello, my coolant was really dirty when i looked to add more so i took it in to get it flushed and get an oil change and such. the guy at the shop said he couldnt do it because it was that bad so i took it to radiator shop where they flushed it. they told me there that i have a small leak in the water pump i believe. the next day i was driving and the car was running very warm/hot. i called them and took it back, they looked and said exhaust was getting in the cooling system which may be head gasket or cylinder head. took to engine shop, they said not head gasket, but it was my radiator. today i got the car back and it is still up around 220 which is way warmer than it had been before. 1st is this too hot? 2nd what could be wrong. i believe before i took it to the radiator place that it was using dex cool as it was red/orange and that is what i was told at the autoparts store when i bought coolant. (they looked it up or whatever) could that be the simple fix? just having the right coolant in there? thanks, Ryan

[bvillepioneer]

I also have a 95. Is it a 3.1 or 2.2? My car is a 3.1 and it had a leak like that and i had it checked also and they said it is very common to have a leak in the intake gasket. Is there water/antifreeze getting into your oil system? If so than it is either the head gasket or intake gasket. When an intake gasket blows than you will have water loss but won't be able to see a leak. This is because the water hits the exhaust and evaporates. I was told that the normal temp for a 3.1 is between 210-220, but i don't know the exact temp. Mine runs at around 220

[crazy Jim]

My car would run hot and the temp would fluctuate when the water pump began to fail. I replaced it before it went completely bad. On my 3.4 it was very simple procedure that anybody with just a handful of tools can do.

[xeroinfinity]

Welcome to AF !

rdub202, It would help to know what engine, how many miles, etc etc.

But 220 is way to Hot !

One thing about a flush it sometimes can put a biuld up of the crap into the gaksets and or heater core and cause it not to flow very well, and if the water pumps weak then it'll be even worse flow.

Could also have a thermostat bad, if that wasnt replaced.

The LIM can leak into the oil, into the exhaust and on the ground.
The 3.1's usually get a leak on the LI under the throtle body(or the other end of the engine) and you will see it pooling on the transmission bell housing.
The 4 cyl, they have many leaky, gasket troubles. Esspecially with higher mileage and neglect.

[rdub202]

thank you. here is information requested

it has 95000 miles on it
it is the quad 4 engine, grand am se
i dont know if its 3.1 or 2.2 or whatever

and i dont know if things are getting into my oil. when my oil was changed last they didnt say. i believe the guy said it looked alright/normal.

crzy jim what do you mean fluctuating like it would be running hot then randomly lower a bunch? cuz mine does that.

[crazy Jim]

yeah, the temp would not remain constant at 200 (according to the factory gauge), it would go up to 220+ and then back down quite often. I don't have the same engine as you but some situations would be similar.

[xeroinfinity]

Also a clog or an air pocket in the cooling system will cause the temps to go up and down.

And it could be a water pump, on your 4 cyl 2.2 its a bear to change!

[rdub202]

thanks guys. it might just be the water pump, since i wsa informed already that it has a small leak. and yes i heard it was a "you know what" to change

[skibum1111]

It's not too bad to change if you are a contortionist Anyway, remove the exhaust manifold, thermostat housing and some skin from your knuckles. You don't have to touch the timing chain on the 92-95 quads, so its not quite as bad as some will tell you. I changed mine, used a lift, and it took 8 hours to get it done. Good luck, if you can afford to pay someone else to do the job, have them do it.

[xeroinfinity]

Usually Ski, when I have to tear into someones water pump on these,
I suggest replacing the timing set which isnt that expensive and since you have it all apart it just makes sense.

Let us know what yo find out rdub202 .

Happy New Year everybody!

[rdub202]

heres the update. went in yesterday to voice my displeasure in the fact that what they did saturday didnt work. they changed the radiator, they said it was like clogged solid. my step dad later said, something isnt right, because the radiator place that flushed it, wouldnt have been able to flush it if it was plugged up. so someone possibly wasnt telling the truth.

they said okay np bring it in tomorrow. so i went in this morning and dropped it off. the guy who i spoke with and took care of me on the first time asked me "its still running hot?" and i said yes. he said what temps and i said 220 or around 220. and he asked if it was like spiking right to it, said something could be the thermostat, or air pocket like one of you said....so i said well idk, you tell me. so whatever.
i went home, hours passed and they called. they said it was not running hot, the guy said they could not get it to run hot at all. and then proceeded to tell me i needed new tires. i interrupted him to ask what temps its at, and he said 220-225, and i said isnt that too hot. he said no, that is fine. so idk if the moron at the counter didnt know what temp it should run at or what, but i feel like they wasted my time with it, if he would have just told me, 220 is okay. and 220 is what i told them it was running at when i brought it in the FIRST time. so im confused. but he reassured me i needed the radiator i guess. so i am going to try and keep my cool when i go in there tomorrow. (lol pun was not intended)

[gmack221]

ok a 95 quad 4 car is a 2.2L 4 cylinder car. The normal operating temp is around 190 - 200 degrees, the electric fan should kick on at 210 degrees. The best advise I can give you is get your car out of that shop before they try to charge you for anymore work. They sound like they throw parts at the problem instead of doing the real work.

It is time for a water pump & thermostat, and changing the timing gears & timing chain is money well spent. I would also recomend getting your compression tested before having this work done, I don't think there is anything wrong, but these cars are known for bad head gaskets (since the water pump is so hard to change people put it off, the car overheats and the head warps). start by having that checked, a good mechanic will not have a problem with you watching him do this, all 4 cylinders should be about the same, if one is much different then the others its probably time for a head gasket. So to answer your question 220 - 225 is not normal for that motor! The cooling system on this car is tricky to get all of the air out of, so chances are when you got the car back at first it still had air in the system, see what temp it runs on the way home from the shop.

[xeroinfinity]

Chances are if the radiator was cloged so is everything else.
Most shops dont like changing the thermostats either on the 2.2.

Assuming the thermostat is a 195deg, then it should not get over 210

So I would start with a whole system flush since they said the rad. was clogged badly.
Using two bottles of preston rad flush will do wonders.
Also make sure the heater is open to full heat so that gets cleaned too.

IF you do that and are still getting 220 temps then I would change the waterpump and thermostat. And get the cylinder compression tested, though I dont think they'll be as high as gmack stated, maybe around 220psi tops.

Hope that helps!

[gmack221]

So to answer your question 220 - 225 is not normal for that motor! The cooling system on this car is tricky to get all of the air out of, so chances are when you got the car back at first it still had air in the system, see what temp it runs on the way home from the shop.

sorry I was talking about temperatures here! should have been its own paragraph or told what units I was talking about .... my bad ... I knew what I was talking about why didn't you ... lol

as far as compression goes ... you'd have to look that up, my guess would be your looking at something around 100 - 120 psi

[xeroinfinity]

A top notch 2.2 from this year is around 150-180ish PSI on the compression test, but can ne lower or higher depending on how the engine has been treated as in regular servicing.

But you want to compare the highest readings from each of the cylinders to that of the others. The compression pressures are considered within specifications if the lowest reading cylinder is within 75 percent of the pressure recorded for the highest reading cylinder.

Example, if your highest reading cylinder pressure was 150 psi, then 75 percent of that would be 113 psi.
So the lowest reading cylinder should be no less than 113 psi if so thiers a problem.

Hope that clarified compression