Low Coolant level

[luvmy02impala]

I am probably beating a dead horse here, but I thought I might ask.

My 02 Impala Base model, 3400 has 105k on it. The Low Coolant Light (LCL) came on last night. I came on, went off about 4 minutes after accelerating onto highway. Then came on again after 4 minutes, then on again and off again approx same 4/5 minute interval. This occurred 3/4 times. Please note the temperature gause had NO major changes in temp and I stayed in cruise (75mph) for 25 minutes after it came on.

The temperature gauge did not show a big temperature change while cruising and other acceleration while driving on the highway. I got home and looked at the resevoir, it looked to be below the cool level, when the engine was hot (just shut off a few minutes prior to my looking). I also noticed the hose that went from the radiator (under the cap) to the resevoir had 2 kinks in it, like it was disturbed at 1 time. I did not open the radiator since it was still most likely under presure (will do that tomorrow when it is light out).

I shudder to think it needs another intake manifold gasket, as it had one put on 2 years ago @ 60k miles. At that time, I had a new thermostat, hoses and complete fush done on it. Then a week later the Low Coolant Light came on and no temperature chage occurred. The same mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and it was off for 2 years. Just because of the on/off of the Low Coolant Light, I am getting nervous. I am going to add more orange dexcool to the system, to the proper level in the resevoir. I will get a better chance to see if the radiotpr is actually low.

Anyone had to replace the intake manifold gasket 2x? I will cry if I have to spend another $900 to fix it again.

Thanks, just venting and upset about this car I love to drive...

-Tom

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by luvmy02impala

I am probably beating a dead horse here, but I thought I might ask.

My 02 Impala Base model, 3400 has 105k on it. The Low Coolant Light (LCL) came on last night. I came on, went off about 4 minutes after accelerating onto highway. Then came on again after 4 minutes, then on again and off again approx same 4/5 minute interval. This occurred 3/4 times. Please note the temperature gause had NO major changes in temp and I stayed in cruise (75mph) for 25 minutes after it came on.

The temperature gauge did not show a big temperature change while cruising and other acceleration while driving on the highway. I got home and looked at the resevoir, it looked to be below the cool level, when the engine was hot (just shut off a few minutes prior to my looking). I also noticed the hose that went from the radiator (under the cap) to the resevoir had 2 kinks in it, like it was disturbed at 1 time. I did not open the radiator since it was still most likely under presure (will do that tomorrow when it is light out).

I shudder to think it needs another intake manifold gasket, as it had one put on 2 years ago @ 60k miles. At that time, I had a new thermostat, hoses and complete fush done on it. Then a week later the Low Coolant Light came on and no temperature chage occurred. The same mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and it was off for 2 years. Just because of the on/off of the Low Coolant Light, I am getting nervous. I am going to add more orange dexcool to the system, to the proper level in the resevoir. I will get a better chance to see if the radiotpr is actually low.

Anyone had to replace the intake manifold gasket 2x? I will cry if I have to spend another $900 to fix it again.

Thanks, just venting and upset about this car I love to drive...

-Tom

First thing make sure rad is full of coolant.
Is low coolant sensor in rad or coolant tank?
If in Rad I have had good luck just removing them and cleaning the end of them.

[crazy Jim]

my '02 3.8 has done the same thing and I corrected it by cleaning the sensor probe as well, no prob since..

[[email protected]]

Sadley, cleaning off the sensors is not going to fix your problem it will only make the light go off and make you feel better about it but there will be nothing to feel better about. I have your exact car and this is how it all starts. This car (along with others of the same year and the 3.8 Impala) all were built with Coolant system gaskets that breakdown in dex-cool coolant. Chevy did not know it at the time but they sure do now. What is happening to your car is that there is a gunk building up in the coolant. This gunk is much due to the breaking down of the gaskets and WILL lead to a leak. My car started out excatly as yours is. At about 115,000 miles my low coolant light came on. I did a web search for my car and low coolant problems and sure enough it happens to ALL of them. This is not a matter of if it happens it is WHEN it will happen. Some don't even make it to 60,000 miles. Chevy fixed the problem in there newer cars but only recalled the 3.8 liter engines for the coolant leak problem for 2001 and 2002. After my light went on I brought it in to have the coolant changed and the mecahnic told me when he hooked up the suction he could tell there was a slow leak (he was also VERY familiar with the gasket problem on this car and that Chevy was to blam for putting in faulty gaskets). My leak was so minor that there was never a spot on the ground under it. I have kept an eye on my coolant until my brother could fix it (hasn't yet) but I wish I would have fixed it sooned becasue just this week my CAT converter went out. Apparently when the coolant leakes into the exhaust system is ruins the interior of the CAT and clogs it up. Now my car has lost power and is doing all kinds of funny stuff (at first we thought the tranny was going). There is actually a lawsuit against Chevy for this problems and them not recalling it. If you get it fixed in a shop it will cost anywhere between $700 and $1200 and if your CAT goes out too that will be another $600. Trust me. This IS what is starting to happen to your car. If you clean the sensor and the light goes off either fix the prblems I mentioned or sell the thing as fast as you can before the seals go and the CAT breaks down. It WILL happen. The gaskets were not built to hold up to dex-cool.

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

Sadley, cleaning off the sensors is not going to fix your problem it will only make the light go off and make you feel better about it but there will be nothing to feel better about. I have your exact car and this is how it all starts. This car (along with others of the same year and the 3.8 Impala) all were built with Coolant system gaskets that breakdown in dex-cool coolant. Chevy did not know it at the time but they sure do now. What is happening to your car is that there is a gunk building up in the coolant. This gunk is much due to the breaking down of the gaskets and WILL lead to a leak. My car started out excatly as yours is. At about 115,000 miles my low coolant light came on. I did a web search for my car and low coolant problems and sure enough it happens to ALL of them. This is not a matter of if it happens it is WHEN it will happen. Some don't even make it to 60,000 miles. Chevy fixed the problem in there newer cars but only recalled the 3.8 liter engines for the coolant leak problem for 2001 and 2002. After my light went on I brought it in to have the coolant changed and the mecahnic told me when he hooked up the suction he could tell there was a slow leak (he was also VERY familiar with the gasket problem on this car and that Chevy was to blam for putting in faulty gaskets). My leak was so minor that there was never a spot on the ground under it. I have kept an eye on my coolant until my brother could fix it (hasn't yet) but I wish I would have fixed it sooned becasue just this week my CAT converter went out. Apparently when the coolant leakes into the exhaust system is ruins the interior of the CAT and clogs it up. Now my car has lost power and is doing all kinds of funny stuff (at first we thought the tranny was going). There is actually a lawsuit against Chevy for this problems and them not recalling it. If you get it fixed in a shop it will cost anywhere between $700 and $1200 and if your CAT goes out too that will be another $600. Trust me. This IS what is starting to happen to your car. If you clean the sensor and the light goes off either fix the prblems I mentioned or sell the thing as fast as you can before the seals go and the CAT breaks down. It WILL happen. The gaskets were not built to hold up to dex-cool.

The poster said he had a 3.4 engine witch is different than a 3.8.


And it is not the dex cool that causes the problems.
Go back to late 70"s and early 80"s> they had intake and gasket problems back then before Dex cool was even made.
Old green or Dex cool will give problems if you do not keep your cooling system serviced.
People that do have a lot less problems.

[[email protected]]

Originally Posted by MT-2500

The poster said he had a 3.4 engine witch is different than a 3.8.


And it is not the dex cool that causes the problems.
Go back to late 70"s and early 80"s> they had intake and gasket problems back then before Dex cool was even made.
Old green or Dex cool will give problems if you do not keep your cooling system serviced.
People that do have a lot less problems.

You missed the part where I said I have this EXACT car. My car is the 3.4 liter engine. It IS the dex-cool that is the problem. They simpley only admited to it in the 3.8 liter engines and recalled those. They put the same gasgets in the 3.4L of this year. It is true that unmaintained, you can have the same problem with either coolant but the 2002 Impala owners manual specicially states that dex-cool last 150,000 miles before you need to change it. I have always maintained my car, coolant included, but dexcool still ruined my gasgets. This is where owners of these cars run into problems and where Chevy is too blame for backing dex-cool in there engine for 150,000 miles. There IS a lawsuit on this issue (I am sure they will not get to much against such a big company). The two companies are playing the blam game. Chevy states it is Dexcools fault and Dexcool blams Chevy for gasgets that would not hold up. Chevy did change gaskets in newer cars because they KNEW they broke down in dex-cool coolant. You need to look up this info more if you do not trust me. I have this car and have been dealing with these issues on it for almost a year now. I know plenty about the gasget flaw on these cars and know many others with it too. Mechanics are also very familiar with it (the ones around here anyway). It is sad because I love my car if is wasn't for this one BIG problem.

[crazy Jim]

I have both the 3.4 and the 3.8. The 3.4 has a weak design gasket that allows a minor leak and can be corrected by installing the improved gasket (I replaced the gasket myself). The 3.8, on the other hand, has an issue with the EGR burning a hole through the palstic intake manifold and can be corrected by installing an improved aftermarket mainfold available at better auto parts stores. Also, not all 3.8s were recalled in the affected years. When I recieved the recall notice my car did not meet the prerequisites and it is an '02 Imp.

My 3.8 with the Low coolant light issue does not have low fluid level. Each time I checked it the radiator was full.
The light would come on and go off all the time. I simply removed it and cleaned it up. Whether or not this fixed the sensor the light does not come on now as it did before.

[[email protected]]

Originally Posted by crazy Jim

I have both the 3.4 and the 3.8. The 3.4 has a weak design gasket that allows a minor leak and can be corrected by installing the improved gasket (I replaced the gasket myself). The 3.8, on the other hand, has an issue with the EGR burning a hole through the palstic intake manifold and can be corrected by installing an improved aftermarket mainfold available at better auto parts stores. Also, not all 3.8s were recalled in the affected years. When I recieved the recall notice my car did not meet the prerequisites and it is an '02 Imp.

My 3.8 with the Low coolant light issue does not have low fluid level. Each time I checked it the radiator was full.
The light would come on and go off all the time. I simply removed it and cleaned it up. Whether or not this fixed the sensor the light does not come on now as it did before.

I believe you that not all 3.8 liters were recalled. I am not familiar with the exact engines recalled because mine was not. Regardless though, the 3.4 that I own does not have a simple problem. Mine leakes at at least two different gasgets one is at the intake manifold and the other has leaked into my exhaust from yet another gasget. I have had three seperate mechanics look at it and both state the gaskets are deteriorating and leaking. My coolant was not low when my low coolant light went on either and the mechanic did state that the sensor was most likely covered causing the problem but that the leak also existed. I just don't want to see someone else miss this on this car and end up with even more problems. It is a VERY common problem with it. To replace one gasget may not be to hard and anyone a little mechanically inclided can do it but we are talking about the entire gasget kit to be installed which requires much more then a simple fix.
The mechyanics had also stated that the "gunk" that tends to build up in the coolant of these cars is partly due to the gasket deteriorating. I am basing my opinion here (which we all have a different opinion on this) on much research and people looking at my car. I have yet to get a differant answer but that my gaskets are breaking down.
The big thing with Chevy was that they stated 150,000 coolant and this it is not. I am not a car expert but alot of people who own cars haven't a clue how they even run. When the manual says 150,000 coolant they trust the company. I hope you can understand why I could be upset about this. My car should have held out much longer then it did. I might as well bought a GEO. Though some may have the know how to fix this themsleves (I included) many do not and will have to take it in to have it done for a rediculous amount of money.

[MT-2500]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

You missed the part where I said I have this EXACT car. My car is the 3.4 liter engine. It IS the dex-cool that is the problem. They simpley only admited to it in the 3.8 liter engines and recalled those. They put the same gasgets in the 3.4L of this year. It is true that unmaintained, you can have the same problem with either coolant but the 2002 Impala owners manual specicially states that dex-cool last 150,000 miles before you need to change it. I have always maintained my car, coolant included, but dexcool still ruined my gasgets. This is where owners of these cars run into problems and where Chevy is too blame for backing dex-cool in there engine for 150,000 miles. There IS a lawsuit on this issue (I am sure they will not get to much against such a big company). The two companies are playing the blam game. Chevy states it is Dexcools fault and Dexcool blams Chevy for gasgets that would not hold up. Chevy did change gaskets in newer cars because they KNEW they broke down in dex-cool coolant. You need to look up this info more if you do not trust me. I have this car and have been dealing with these issues on it for almost a year now. I know plenty about the gasget flaw on these cars and know many others with it too. Mechanics are also very familiar with it (the ones around here anyway). It is sad because I love my car if is wasn't for this one BIG problem.

It is not the Dex cool.
The problem is with the gaskets and intake manifolds.
GM only warranty them until the warranty runs out.
They did overdo the 150K or 5 year part.
But Under Ideal conditions it might make 150K.
Just use good common brains and service you coolant ever 3 years or 50K.
Intakes and gaskets leaking is nothing new.
I have saw it on older ones and newer ones.
Nothing new there. And the class action suit is not going to amount to much.
They did get someting out of Ford on bad intakes but another deal altogether.
And even then ford weaseled out on the older ones.
If the intake is leaking and it is out of warranty just bite the bullet and fix it.
I have been around under hoods 45 years.
Same old same 0.
MT

[[email protected]]

Originally Posted by MT-2500

It is not the Dex cool.
The problem is with the gaskets and intake manifolds.
GM only warranty them until the warranty runs out.
They did overdo the 150K or 5 year part.
But Under Ideal conditions it might make 150K.
Just use good common brains and service you coolant ever 3 years or 50K.
Intakes and gaskets leaking is nothing new.
I have saw it on older ones and newer ones.
Nothing new there. And the class action suit is not going to amount to much.
They did get someting out of Ford on bad intakes but another deal altogether.
And even then ford weaseled out on the older ones.
If the intake is leaking and it is out of warranty just bite the bullet and fix it.
I have been around under hoods 45 years.
Same old same 0.
MT

I totally agree with you. I won't fight you on any of that. My point is not who's fault it is at all. The point is if you own this car you will have this problem - there is a strong pattern in this particular engine. I agree too that intakes and gaskets leaking is nothing new but niether is any repair on any car - same old same old. Chevy still made claim of 150,000 mile coolant and they were wrong (they should not have put it in black and white in the manuel). To many people actually believed them.
The lawsuit is against Chevy because it was faulty gaskets that did not hold up to thier claim. Chevy is the one blaming Dexcool. Chevy pretty much admitted to the problem by simpley changing the gaskets in newer model cars and the problem was gone. Dexcool gets pulled into it because they made claim that thier coolant was 150,000 mile coolant. Grant it, it was not thier fault that Chevy used gaskets that would not hold up for 150,000 (regardless of the coolant used). This is where the whole blame game comes in. I am sure the lawsuit won't go too far either. They are too big a company. Bottom line still is that this car has major Coolant leak problems even on maintained vehicles. There was not much an owner could do to stop it from happening. Regular changes could slow the process. That may be why I got over 100,000 before mine went, but the break down still occurs. Letting the problem go by covering up the symptoms is only temporary and the major problem is still going to be underneath. I only told my story to save some other impala owners the whole guessing game. My story is very "cookie cutter" for this car. I love my Impala - how it drives, fuel economy..... but I have had more problems with this car then any other car I have owned and I have maintained them all well in my book. I hope this entire post has been educational for all Impala owners and opens thier eyes to what the root of thier problem could be. As for "biting the bullet" and fixing it - that is being done. The only reason I had been waiting to fix it was because I was under the impression, as others may have been, that the leak was only in the one gasket and since it was not showing up under the car I thought it would be fine until the winter when I could get it into my brothers garage to work on it with him (the entire gasket set is only $50 and the shop wanted to charge me $700). Anyway, I waited to only find out later that all the gaskets were actually deteriorating and that was what ruined my Cat converter now. Needless to say the car will be in for repair this weekend to replace the gaskets and fit a new CAT on the exhaust. I do thank you for you input.

[crazy Jim]

"all the gaskets" are actually two and they are on the lower intake manifold. Some trouble to get down to them but I'm a shade tree mech and I had no problem replacing them.

[[email protected]]

Yeh, I don't think it is a problem replacing them but if you don't have a shop it is a bit more work. Estimate I had from others who had done it themselves was about 9-10 hours including replacing fluids (oil and coolant). If you are not mechanically inclided though you are going to really pay for this work. I was quoted $700 others I talked to were charge up to $1200.
Yeh, it is truley only "two" gasgets (sets of gasgets) but if that one goes it takes out your CAT and some owners have not had any coolant leak signs pior to it ruining the CAT.

[crazy Jim]

135K miles at the gasket change and my cat does not seem to have been adversely affected.

[[email protected]]

Consider yourself lucky.
When mine started having power issues (just over 140,000) I looked up problems with it in this car and sure enough. It made sense too since it was linked to the coolant problem that is already so common with them. It was actually a relief since my initial thought was that the transmition was going (as others had thought, who had the same syptoms with thier Impala) I am sure the CAT won't go on all these cars. Probably will all depend on how the coolant leak comes about.

[luvmy02impala]

I am the submitter of this post. After a day at the dealers, I know what is the issue.

- sensor on the radiator corroded and shot
- water pump leaking thru weep hole
- intake manifold gasket (shot again, this will be 2nd time I changed it)
- complete cooling system flush
- complete oil system flush

**Cat Conv changed last year under GM notice, free for me**

*All for $1800. I love spending Christmas money on my car. I guess my wife will not get her Diamond jewerly this year...

-Tom