95 Lesabre vibration. At wits end!

[Totes]

Looking for possibilities. My 95 Lesabre, a great running car, has been plagued with a vibration at highway speeds. It is not a consistent vibration, sometimes smooth as silk. But when she shakes, you know it! I,ve replaced all wheel bearings, cv/drive axles, motor/tranny mounts, f/r struts and new tires. What next?

[HotZ28]

Welcome to AF !

I did a Search Forums for you and found this thread, which has some good info that may help you.

[Smith1000]

That's frustrating. Were the new tires balanced when they were put on? You mentioned new tires were put on, but did they balance them out? Might check to see if you have wheel weights on the rims (inner or outer of each rim). Some do not balance tires when they put them on. I have had my fair share of road speed shakes and vibrations through the years. I have also mounted and balanced many tires, including tractor tires and other equipment tires. I do not always balance new car tires because they often do not need balancing when new, but some do, particulary if the rim is out of balance to begin with. I have balanced rims without tires on them by spot welding weights to rims and then added the tire for more balancing. I often rebalance later after the tires have been on the car for awhile.

If the vibration is left to right in the steering wheel, I usually look to the front tires first. If it is more of a general vibration, or front to back, I usually start with the rear tires. Mud and small rocks that accumulate on the inside of the rims will cause vibration problems because the wheels are thrown out of balance. Our roads around here are rock/mud. When it rains, the mud accumulates on the inside of the rims. It usually is slung evenly on the inside, but when it dries out, chunks fall off and the car begins to vibrate at road speed. Usually have to power wash the rims from the inside to balance out the weight.

Also, if there is anything on the inside of the tire, it can throw it out of balance. I have had problems with fix-a-flat throwing wheels out of balance. Also, the way I do it, a tire with liquid in it cannot be accurately balanced. As the liquid moves, it throws off the bubble.

My sister had some tires that would supposably not go flat because there was some type of sealer inside. When it would freeze out, the sealer would freeze also. The truck would bounce and vibrate down the highway until things thawed out.

I had one car that I could not balance the wheels. They would read balanced, but it would still vibrate. I took them to a tire shop and they could not balance them. They said I needed new rims. The new (salvaged) rims did the trick.

I would look to the wheels (rims,etc.). Might have the wheel balance checked on all of the wheels or rebalanced all together. Or, rotate the front tires to the back to see if it changes anything. Have them inspect the rims carefully to see if they look okay. Make sure they are cleaned out thouroughly, etc. I have experienced some vibration problems in my 97 Lesabre (whole dash vibrates) and have always been able to resolve it by rebalancing the wheels or cleaning the rims well. They are very sensitive to balancing. Good luck.

[imidazol97]

Originally Posted by Totes

Looking for possibilities. My 95 Lesabre, a great running car, has been plagued with a vibration at highway speeds. It is not a consistent vibration, sometimes smooth as silk. But when she shakes, you know it! I,ve replaced all wheel bearings, cv/drive axles, motor/tranny mounts, f/r struts and new tires. What next?

Is the vibration in synch with wheel speed vibrations? Otherwise it could be other moving parts.

The simplest is always wheels and tires. You didn't talk about your tires. Brand, model, size, age, miles on them. Has the car been aligned? Tires run out of alignment may be worn unevenly they will be next to impossible to balance to run smoothly. Some brands of tires have tendency to become uneven rather quickly. Michelins have given me best service for decades and stay round--belts don't shift, e.g.

Your rims are easily checked for being with the 0.015 thousands lateral and radial runout values.

REmember that back wheels on the soft suspensions can transmit shake to the front and even feel like front wheels--maybe they set up sympathetic vibrations in the front wheels. I've been fooled several times and the tire store doing the free rebalancing said they'd check the rears first and there was a problem in them.

Also a brake caliper can drag slightly by not releasing completely and heating up a rotor causing the contact at the high/low to increase in force giving front wheel shake. I had that on 98 leSabre at about 30K miles. I lubed slides on the calipers and so on, but at 40 K I replaced rotors with Raybest top heaviest rotors and rebuilt calipers and ceramic pads and it was like a new car again. When the shake occurs have you used the brakes in advance of that time?

[Totes]

Originally Posted by Smith1000

That's frustrating. Were the new tires balanced when they were put on? You mentioned new tires were put on, but did they balance them out? Might check to see if you have wheel weights on the rims (inner or outer of each rim). Some do not balance tires when they put them on. I have had my fair share of road speed shakes and vibrations through the years. I have also mounted and balanced many tires, including tractor tires and other equipment tires. I do not always balance new car tires because they often do not need balancing when new, but some do, particulary if the rim is out of balance to begin with. I have balanced rims without tires on them by spot welding weights to rims and then added the tire for more balancing. I often rebalance later after the tires have been on the car for awhile.

If the vibration is left to right in the steering wheel, I usually look to the front tires first. If it is more of a general vibration, or front to back, I usually start with the rear tires. Mud and small rocks that accumulate on the inside of the rims will cause vibration problems because the wheels are thrown out of balance. Our roads around here are rock/mud. When it rains, the mud accumulates on the inside of the rims. It usually is slung evenly on the inside, but when it dries out, chunks fall off and the car begins to vibrate at road speed. Usually have to power wash the rims from the inside to balance out the weight.

Also, if there is anything on the inside of the tire, it can throw it out of balance. I have had problems with fix-a-flat throwing wheels out of balance. Also, the way I do it, a tire with liquid in it cannot be accurately balanced. As the liquid moves, it throws off the bubble.

My sister had some tires that would supposably not go flat because there was some type of sealer inside. When it would freeze out, the sealer would freeze also. The truck would bounce and vibrate down the highway until things thawed out.

I had one car that I could not balance the wheels. They would read balanced, but it would still vibrate. I took them to a tire shop and they could not balance them. They said I needed new rims. The new (salvaged) rims did the trick.

I would look to the wheels (rims,etc.). Might have the wheel balance checked on all of the wheels or rebalanced all together. Or, rotate the front tires to the back to see if it changes anything. Have them inspect the rims carefully to see if they look okay. Make sure they are cleaned out thouroughly, etc. I have experienced some vibration problems in my 97 Lesabre (whole dash vibrates) and have always been able to resolve it by rebalancing the wheels or cleaning the rims well. They are very sensitive to balancing. Good luck.

I definitely do not think it's a balance issue. Two new sets of tires, first set Michelins' X, second and present set Goodyears Regatta 2's. I've been to at least 5 service centers, each one balanced the tires when I brought the car in to try to resolve this issue. Thanks, Totes.

[Totes]

Originally Posted by imidazol97

Is the vibration in synch with wheel speed vibrations? Otherwise it could be other moving parts.

The simplest is always wheels and tires. You didn't talk about your tires. Brand, model, size, age, miles on them. Has the car been aligned? Tires run out of alignment may be worn unevenly they will be next to impossible to balance to run smoothly. Some brands of tires have tendency to become uneven rather quickly. Michelins have given me best service for decades and stay round--belts don't shift, e.g.

Your rims are easily checked for being with the 0.015 thousands lateral and radial runout values.

REmember that back wheels on the soft suspensions can transmit shake to the front and even feel like front wheels--maybe they set up sympathetic vibrations in the front wheels. I've been fooled several times and the tire store doing the free rebalancing said they'd check the rears first and there was a problem in them.

Also a brake caliper can drag slightly by not releasing completely and heating up a rotor causing the contact at the high/low to increase in force giving front wheel shake. I had that on 98 leSabre at about 30K miles. I lubed slides on the calipers and so on, but at 40 K I replaced rotors with Raybest top heaviest rotors and rebuilt calipers and ceramic pads and it was like a new car again. When the shake occurs have you used the brakes in advance of that time?

I'm running Gooyear Regatta 2. 215/70/15. I like the wider profile. I had run Michelin X same size, before these Goodyears. Same problem. I thought that maybe I had bought a "bad run" of tires, even though I had purposely gone out and bought a new full size spare and ran the car with the spare at each hub. No difference. That's why I sprung for another new set of tires, these Goodyears. The car has 130,000 mi. on her, the engine runs strong, I put almost 600 mi a week on it. The vibration occurs 60+ mph, at random times. I can't do anything to "bring it on" except to continue at highway speeds. When she starts to shake I have shut the engine off to see if it was some sort of ignition problem, but she'll still shake until speed is reduced. And you can't speed through it either, the shake/vibration is relevant to the speed. These tires have about 5000 mi. on them. Like I said it's random. She'll shake for a little bit, then it will go away. I do not necessarily have to slow down to make the vibration stop. Thanks, Totes

[LeSabre97mint]

midazol97 said:"I have experienced some vibration problems in my 97 Lesabre (whole dash vibrates) and have always been able to resolve it by rebalancing the wheels or cleaning the rims well."

My 97's dash does the shake too. It really bugs me! I've changed: Struts (less bouncing but didn't change the shaking), and drive axels (pass side was out of ballance). The drives side looked like it might be shaking too. But I don't think the shaft is long enough to make a difference. I put a new wheel bearing on the drivers side (no change). Ballance the tires....no change. I put new rotors and pads on because of the wear indicator doing a bit of talking. I too had a caliper hanging up causing the rotor to warp during driving and causing a pulsing when stoping, and causing the pads to wear faster. I believe one of the rotors were out of ballance. The car does drive smoother now...not like I would like it....but better.

Regards

Dan

[imidazol97]

Originally Posted by Totes

I'm running Gooyear Regatta 2. 215/70/15. I like the wider profile. I had run Michelin X same size, before these Goodyears. Same problem. I thought that maybe I had bought a "bad run" of tires, even though I had purposely gone out and bought a new full size spare and ran the car with the spare at each hub. No difference. That's why I sprung for another new set of tires, these Goodyears. The car has 130,000 mi. on her, the engine runs strong, I put almost 600 mi a week on it. The vibration occurs 60+ mph, at random times. I can't do anything to "bring it on" except to continue at highway speeds. When she starts to shake I have shut the engine off to see if it was some sort of ignition problem, but she'll still shake until speed is reduced. And you can't speed through it either, the shake/vibration is relevant to the speed. These tires have about 5000 mi. on them. Like I said it's random. She'll shake for a little bit, then it will go away. I do not necessarily have to slow down to make the vibration stop. Thanks, Totes

If the X-Ones did it and were well balanced on a spin balancer, WOW. I assume they were perfectly round and no lateral runout showing which would mean your rims are okay... The X-Ones were great tires and very well made by Michelin.

Is your alignment right on mid settings front and rear?

I reviewed and you've replaced a whole boatload of parts...

Have you tried pumping the tires up in pressure to 35 or more to see if the tight tires still do it? They my hop a little more on tarstrips and bumps but it may change your problem symptoms. Is there any chance it's the road surface with little waves that set off tires hopping and then you get sympathetic reactions from others?

Have you checked the mount bolts on the rack? See if turning the steering wheel while stationary makes the rack move side to side from the push and pull? I recall people having loosened bolts on racks, but don't recall the symptoms.

[greg123]

I recently experienced the same thing with my mini van> Have you replaced your rear drums recently? After 600 bucks A mechanic nailed it down for me. My right rear drum was out of balance thus making it a hell ride. Watch out for aftermarket parts

[Alibi]

I skimmed the page, so I'm not sure if this has been brought up yet... but have you checked for slop in your inner and outer tie rods?

And I assume the car was aligned after you had all that front end work done, right?

[Totes]

Originally Posted by Alibi

I skimmed the page, so I'm not sure if this has been brought up yet... but have you checked for slop in your inner and outer tie rods?

And I assume the car was aligned after you had all that front end work done, right?

Yes , The alignment was done, she tracks straight as an arrow.

[chevymut]

here is something to think about could it be something related to the traction control and abs system?im not too knowledged on the the lesabre yet but i have problems with abs and traction control right now.
my thought after all that has been my car shakes when i apply the brakes at high speed , i havent completely diagnosed mine yet, but could be something to look into,,try disconnecting your traction control and try it,
best of luck to u

[Totes]

After all was said and done, I had discovered that there was a bit of corrosion on the inside of a couple of the rims. This corrosion prevented the tires from being balanced correctly because the chunk of corrosion was near the center of the wheel, around the inside where the lugs go through the rim That prevented the rim from seating flush on the balancing machine, as well as seating flush on the hub when the wheels were mounted on the car, So, they were never spinning true until I cleaned the corrosion off with a die grinder. She rides like a "Champ" now. "This is a Word to the Wise".

[polarzak]

Originally Posted by Totes

After all was said and done, I had discovered that there was a bit of corrosion on the inside of a couple of the rims. This corrosion prevented the tires from being balanced correctly because the chunk of corrosion was near the center of the wheel, around the inside where the lugs go through the rim That prevented the rim from seating flush on the balancing machine, as well as seating flush on the hub when the wheels were mounted on the car, So, they were never spinning true until I cleaned the corrosion off with a die grinder. She rides like a "Champ" now. "This is a Word to the Wise".

Nice to come back and let everyone know what the problem was.
Didn't whomever did the balancing not notice the corrosion? My guy thoroughly inspects my rims and tires before they even get on the balancer.

[Totes]

Apparently not. As I had said before I had the tires balanced by at least 4 different shops, all for naut. Sometimes ya gotta do your own head scratchin'.
Regards, Totes