grinding in third gear

pbrizzle86 · #1 08-24-2006, 03:53 PM

i have a 1990 civic dx with a sohc mpfi zc swap in it with the stock dx trans.ive always had this problem when i shift into third it will always grind if i dont let the revs drop a lot more then i should have to.just wondering what posiblities it could be all the gears work fine no shift problems with any other gears.had this same problem with second ger on my 89 prelude si but it died before i ever got the chace to look into it.the civic grinded into 3rd even when i had the 1.5 in it.have a new cluch and had the flywheel resurfaced.

DirtyD777 · #2 08-24-2006, 05:23 PM

sounds like a bad gear synchro

SiZ · #3 08-24-2006, 05:58 PM

Check the fluid, but the synchros are probably on the way out. You'll probably be fine for a long time though, mine ground 3rd for almost 3 years before it started popping out of gear, then it's a problem. I raced it at the track like that too, it's fine.

Actually, the guy that bought my car is still using that tranny.

pbrizzle86 · #4 08-24-2006, 11:28 PM

so are the syncros hard to replace or is this a better off to get a diffrent transmission kind of thing.

SiZ · #5 08-26-2006, 01:14 AM

Better off to get a different transmission for what they cost used.

Just grind it! You'll get lots of grinding left before its actally a problem.

Christ · #6 08-26-2006, 02:40 AM

My LX trans did the same, started right after I put the STS in it.. (short throw)... I changed the fluid to a heavier weight, and it stopped, and 38000 miles later, my friend is driving it and it only does it when we start rippin gears down the highway.. but then again, the shifter is 70% shorter than stock, so the tranny and engine don't have time to spin down before it's trying to go in gear.

The moral of the story is, check the fluid, drain it, check for metal, then refill it with something a lil heavier, say 20W50 motor oil, since some tranny's take motor oil, or some manuals take ATF, and some take gear oil... I wouldn't use gear oil in a honda... it's too thick... and they are more precisely put together than the older ones were... basically figure out what yours takes, then put something just a lil bit heavier in it.. if that don't stop it, go one step heavier, and if that don't stop it, it just ain't gonna happen...

Good luck with it though, and he's right, it will last forever with the grind, but it's just a lil annoying.

viper-blue · #7 08-26-2006, 04:40 PM

what happens when the tranny starts popping outta gear? Mine never ground in any gear, but awhile ago it did start popping outta third when I would turn corners with the clutch in, tranny in third going around corners and stuff. Now yesterday, I downshifted and the car stopped moving, and I found fluid leaking under my car. Funny thing is I can feel all the gears on my shifter, and the speedo works when I let the clutch out...just the car won't move..is this the synchros?

CRXperiment · #8 08-26-2006, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper-blue

what happens when the tranny starts popping outta gear? Mine never ground in any gear, but awhile ago it did start popping outta third when I would turn corners with the clutch in, tranny in third going around corners and stuff. Now yesterday, I downshifted and the car stopped moving, and I found fluid leaking under my car. Funny thing is I can feel all the gears on my shifter, and the speedo works when I let the clutch out...just the car won't move..is this the synchros?

Sounds like your differential gear is dead, your able to select gears and all but the power is not being tranferred to your axles, while your VSS is reading a speed. I'd say just swap out for a used tranny as the cost for a rebuild will be a lot more than buying one used.

viper-blue · #9 08-26-2006, 07:15 PM

thanx for the info...I was baffled cause normally when a tranny has blown on me you usually hear some grinding noises and whatnot to let you know something inside has let go..I hear no grinding or anything and the clutch was weak to begin with...now I'm sure its a tranny problem

Christ · #10 08-26-2006, 07:22 PM

Excessive engine/trans rolling can cause that too, check all your mounts for wear and replace as necessary

This is due to the solid linkage between the shifter and transmission, the transmission rolls at an odd angle, and that puts pressure on the shifter, which may cause it to kick out of gear

FrodoGT · #11 08-26-2006, 11:39 PM

Check your cv shafts, you could have snapped the driver side one and thrown it out of the trans, it will leak fluid if this happens, and also will get you nowhere with an open differential, one wheel spins, but isnt connected..

hondacivic99sivtec · #12 08-27-2006, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr0pZ0n3

My LX trans did the same, started right after I put the STS in it.. (short throw)... I changed the fluid to a heavier weight, and it stopped, and 38000 miles later, my friend is driving it and it only does it when we start rippin gears down the highway.. but then again, the shifter is 70% shorter than stock, so the tranny and engine don't have time to spin down before it's trying to go in gear.

The moral of the story is, check the fluid, drain it, check for metal, then refill it with something a lil heavier, say 20W50 motor oil, since some tranny's take motor oil, or some manuals take ATF, and some take gear oil... I wouldn't use gear oil in a honda... it's too thick... and they are more precisely put together than the older ones were... basically figure out what yours takes, then put something just a lil bit heavier in it.. if that don't stop it, go one step heavier, and if that don't stop it, it just ain't gonna happen...

Good luck with it though, and he's right, it will last forever with the grind, but it's just a lil annoying.

so your saying that you put a shifter that was 70% shorter than stock? um...wtf?

let's do some round numbers.
so if the shifter stock was 10 inches long and yours is 70% shorter than that means your shifter is 3 inches long.

and someone explain to me how making your shifter an inch or two shorter is going to cause your engine and tranny don't got time to spin down? that makes no sense.

and putting heavier oil in huh? wow, why don't you just go get some lucas and pour it into your tranny. it will work, however, it comes out the bottle slow as shit. that's no joke.

and the term sts is used for the turbo system. who makes the short throw shifter into an acronym? but you should look up the sts. it's a really cool system, completely eliminates the muffler.

Christ · #13 08-27-2006, 01:07 PM

dude.. the shifter INSIDE the car is literally pretty close to the same length as stock.... they don't cut the shifter to make the throw shorter, only ricers do that.. and it fucks up your shifting, b/c the torque angle is wrong... they extend the bottom of it, so that there is more movement at the shift actuator with less movement at the knob.

It's not just one shifter though, it's a APC short throw with a secondary on it... bolted a couple of bars to it, one on each side at the bottom, then ran those half way up another shifter that just bolts to the floor in front of the Ebrake, (it don't go through the floor) effectively making the throw at the second shifter about 70% shorter than stock, so instead of throwing the shifter 5 inches (close to stock) it goes about 1 1/2 before you're in the next gear... and since the shift time is so short, even if you're not ripping gears, the synchro's hit before the flywheel/engine can spin down... it's pretty much common sense though.

And it's a lot cheaper to just put heavier fluid in it... not to mention that he will want to drain it anyway.. if he's grinding, there are metal shavings in the oil... bad for bearings etc.

STS is also a model of caddilac... has been for years... I just decided to abbreviate short throw shifter for some odd reason.. I do that sometimes.. got a link I can check for the STS turbo thing? I'd like to look at that.

hondacivic99sivtec · #14 08-27-2006, 10:43 PM

so your saying that when i race i want my engine and tranny to spin down?
wont that make me lose rpm's?
don't you want to shift as fast as you can before the engine and tranny have time to spin down?

sts link: ststurbo.com
watch the demo it will explain everything.

Christ · #15 08-28-2006, 12:08 AM

Nah, but you're prolly not racing with a trans that has bad synchro's in the first place... the synchro's are to make the gears spin at the same speed, so that they engage easier. When they go bad, spindown plays a major role in the life of the rest of the tranny.

When you're racing, however, you shouldn't be grinding gears either, if you're shifting too fast to not grind, try taking the selector out of gear BEFORE you hit the clutch, as you're letting off the gas pedal. Literally, start pulling/pushing on the shifter as you're getting ready to lift off the pedal, and it will kick out of gear as soon as you hit neutral throttle...

That's how I drive all the time.. just used to it I guess.

POST REPLY TO THIS THREAD