Rear brakes set up on 94 Shadow

[JH32552]

Hey guys,

My 94 Shadow has been sitting in the garage for 3 weeks. I went out yesterday to drive it and the rear brakes we frozen up. Now, they are set up so badly that trying to break them free in gear will drag the back end of the car 4 feet! When I then put the car in reverse, the back end rises then skids backwards too! THis is both rear wheels. Anyone have a clue what is going on? It almost sounds like the emergency brake is on, but it isn't. I just tried to remove the drums to check out the brakes and can't even get the drums off. I tried turning the little star wheel on the adjusters and can't get them to turn at all. What's going on here?????

[KManiac]

I have experienced the same trouble on my older cars in the past. Freezing up of the rear drum brakes for just sitting with the parking brake set indicates that one or both of your rear wheel cylinders may be leaking brake fluid from age. When the brake fluid leaks past the seals, it will collect between the drum surface and the brake shoes, causing them to stick together. And they can stick so firmly that they won't release when you release your parking brake mechanism.

First, check the level of the brake fluid in your master cylinder. It may be low.

Next, look at the inside sidewalls of your rear tires and see if there is a track of dripping fluid between the backing plate of the brakes and the ground. A liquid residue on the tire and the ground will be from a brake cylinder leak.

To unstick, I would suggest rocking the car forward and back. Put in reverse and give power, then back up, shift to drive and give power again. Repeat this several times until they free up.

Good Luck and let us know what happens.

[JH32552]

Originally Posted by KManiac

I have experienced the same trouble on my older cars in the past. Freezing up of the rear drum brakes for just sitting with the parking brake set indicates that one or both of your rear wheel cylinders may be leaking brake fluid from age.

Thanks for your reply, but the car was in the garage in Park only. I again tried rocking the car back and forth but only slid the rear of car on the cement floor. I was able to get the drums off today and found that on both sides of the car, the front brake lining had separated from the brake shoe, and fell out when I pulled the drum. Have you ever seen this happen? What would cause this?

I cannot believe this happened! I just got the money saved up to get the new fuel pump that I need. On and by the way, the bolts for attaching the gas tank straps are completely rusted to the point that I fear a major problem dropping the gas tank to replace the fuel pump.


Jackie (holding a can of gas and a match.. poised and ready! )

[KManiac]

Hi Jackie

Well now, knowing that the car was not sitting with the parking brake on sheds new light on this situation. What I described in my previous post was the most likely scenario for rear brakes sticking, but not the only one.

Given the new information, it is apparent that the rear brakes are stuck in an "applied" position. When you push on the service brake pedal, the shoes push out against the drums to stop the car (...but you already knew that!). They are suppose to retract once you release the brake pedal. Apparently, your brake shoes did not retract and continued to stay applied, even during the removal of the drums. This contributed to the pad material dropping off when you removed the drums.

I have experienced in the past, on other cars, a rare condition where hydraulic brake hoses deteriorate on the inside by peeling off a flap of interior surface. This flap of rubber will act like a check valve, allowing the brake fluid to freely flow in only one direction. If oriented in the correct direction, brake fluid will flow freely to the wheel cylinders when the brake pedal is pushed. But once the brake pedal is released, the loose flap will close, restricting the return of the brake fluid and keeping the brakes applied down stream of the hose. Both of your rear brakes are supplied brake fluid through a single hose. If that one hose has deteriorated in the manner I described, both of your rear brakes will lock and not release.

Now that you have the drums off, take a look at each side and verify whether or not the brake shoes are fully retracted. I suspect now they are not. Then slowly open one bleed screw on a wheel cylinder of your choice. If brake fluid sputs out of the bleed screw when you first open it, just like a soda when you open a soda can, then you have a blockage in the line like I described above. And you will also find the shoes retracted once the fluid has bled out.

The next thing to do is inspect the wheel cylinders. With the brake shoes still installed, peel back an edge of each rubber cup on both ends of each wheel cylinder. If you find brake fluid accumulated and dripping from these rubber caps, you will need to replace the wheel cylinders.

It is time now for a brake job on your car. At a minimum, you will need to replace the brake shoes. Removal and installation requires one special tool for the retainers and one for the springs. The shoes use retainers, springs and adjusters, which are refered to together as "hardware". It is a recommended good practice to replace the "hardware" when you replace the shoes. So you should get a "hardware kit" for each rear wheel. Next, you should take your brake drums to a machine shop and have them "turned". This will give you a clean and smooth surface for the new shoes to contact. If, however, the machine shop finds the brake drums worn past their service limit, you may have to replace one or both. You won't know this until the machinist inspects the drums. You should also replace any wheel cylinder that shows signs of leakage. And just because of the special problem you described, I suggest replacing the hydraulic hose on the line that feeds your rear brakes.

Now that you have to work on the rear brakes, I suggest inspecting the front brakes, as well. If the front brake pads have plenty of material and the wear indicators are not touching the discs, leave that part alone. If they are thin, this is a good time to replace them. When you replace the pads, you should have the rotors "turned" as well. Replace any rotor worn past its service limit. Look, too, at the condition of the hydraulic hoses to each front wheel (one per wheel). If they have surface cracks or scuff marks, I would recommend replacement at the same time that you replace the rear hose. Leaking calipers, like leaking wheel cylinders, should be replaced, too.

Now for a couple of notes:

Does your car have an "Anti-locl Brake System" (ABS)? My Haynes Repair Manual indicates that ABS was an available option on 1993 Shadows. There was nothing stated about the 1994 or any other model year. To verify, turn on your ignition and see if you have an ABS light on the dashboard. If your car has ABS, there are special precautions you will need to take before opening up the hydraulic system. Good time to get a service manual.

After you open up the hydraulic system, you will need to bleed the air out of the brake system before you drive the car. Obtain a service manual if you don't know how to do this.

Now, there is something else that could be causing this problem that I will describe briefly below:

It is possible that something has caught and jammed the parking brake cable. So even though your parking brake pedal is released, a jammed cable may be keeping the brakes applied. Inspect the cables under the car just to be sure.

Anyway, sorry to hear about this unplanned condition. However, it can be overcome and you will end up with more confidence in your car once you know what has been repaired. Please blow out the match and put the gasoline can away. I always look at these situations as a challenge that I cheerfully undertake. It feels so good to me when I can overcome the challenge on my own and succeed.

Good luck and let us know what you find and do.

[JH32552]

Today I installed the new brakes on the Shadow. I honestly have no clue why the old brakes set up in the garage as they did. There was no excessive pressure when I opened the bleeder valve, so I knew the lines were okay. <whew> The brake lining that fell out was all chewed up on the inside as though they had been loose and floating around for some time. Could they have gotten wedged in there somehow and jammed everything up??????

The only problem I had installing the new brakes was getting the parking brake released from the lever then getting it back on. When I did the second side, I just removed the lever from the shoe and never took the cable off. I repacked the wheel bearings and put everything back together.

Next..... that dreaded fuel pump. I looked closely at the bolts that attach the tank straps and they don't look very healthy. I'm betting that they snap off even thought I've been spraying them for a week now. Any suggestions here? My thought is to drill right up through the floor of the car and install new bolts under the rear seat!

Thanks for all the help!
Jackie

[KManiac]

Wow! You may very well have had defective linings that separated as you say. A very plausible situation.

Now for the gas tank. The strap studs are somehow fixed to the under carriage. I'm not sure how they were installed to begin with. The nuts are a clipped speed nut assembly. A few years ago, when I was experiencing a drivability problem and wasn't yet versed in the workings of the fuel injection system, I attempted to change the fuel pump in my Shadow. Now here in Sunny California, we don't experience road salt and inclimate weather that can rust the bolts on the under carriage. I did discover, though, that Chrysler used a stud and nut combination with an interference fit, to prevent the nuts from backing off on their own. Anyway, I replaced the fuel pump, but couldn't get the car to start. I guess I got a defective pump. I put the old one back in and the car started up just fine. I took the defective pump back to the store and got my money back. I decided to keep the old pump for the time being. But when I tried to bolt up the straps, I somehow stripped one of the stud/nut combos and drove the car for four plus years with one tank strap hanging loose. Earlier this year, I dropped the tank and used a tap and die to cut new threads on both studs and nuts, because I wanted both straps working again. Since I had the tank out, I changed the pump on general principle, even though it seemed to work great at 114,000 miles.

Now that you have soaked the studs and nuts, I suggest working them off slowly with a deep socket. If they happen to break, just deal with it. But if you are lucky, they may come off intact and you should be able to reuse them. If they somehow strip on you, buy a tap and die and cut new threads. That should work.

Good luck and keep us posted on the progress.

[JH32552]

I (we) finally got the fuel pump installed in the Shadow! I couldn't get the nuts off the studs to remove the gas tank straps, so I asked a strong friend to help. To make a long story short, one of the nuts eventually came off, and the second one snapped. We just drilled up through the floorboard and attached the strap with a bolt fastened under the seat. It would have been a quick job it it hadn't been for the rusted strap bolts.

Now, re: the brakes.....
Now that I can safely take the car for a ride knowing that the fuel pump won't fail, it was time for a road test. The brakes were making a lot of noise so I pulled th drums again. The wheel cylinders are not leaking, but the are not as fee as they should be. I am going to install new wheel cylinders in the next few weeks. I'm just hoping I can get the brake lines off without twisting or breaking them.

[KimMG]

If your flex brake lines to the rear are original they should be replaced. A deteriorated flex line can cause the brakes to lock up. I have seen this happen on many cars.