cel po171/174 windstar

[sfetch]

I got the dreaded po171/174 cel code on my 2001 windturd. Per the numerous posts on this subject, I replaced the isolater bolts and gaskets. Thanks to the fellow with the website. I truly appreciate the effort put in the instructions for the repair. It was a breeze. I checked the valve cover for the hole and am pretty sure that mine doesn't have the hole. It's really difficult to see well through the pcv valve hole. As a result, I decided not to change the valve cover ($60 savings).

Here's my question: If missed seeing the hole and left a "bad valve cover" in place, should I anticipate seeing the dreaded CEL po171/174 down the road or different issue? Or does it not matter much? I'd appreciate any input. Also, If I need to replace the valve cover, do I need to use a silicon gasket sealant material with the replacement and what torque should be applied to the valve cover? My local autoparts never seems to have the Haynes Windturd book in stock. Must be a hot item.

Thanks for the help.

[DRW1000]

When I repaired my 99 I did not replace my valve cover even though I definately have the old style with the hole. The reason is that I don't believe the hole makes that much of a difference.

The oil that is sucked up into the intake will once again pool in the intake plenum. The new green rubber on the bolts is supposed to be resistant to the effects of the oil so the intake should not leak. The EGR ports however will more than likely clog up again due to the oil mixing with the hot gases.

[sfetch]

How has your windstar been running since the repair? How many more miles since the repair?

[sfetch]

How has your windstar been running since the repair? How many more miles since the repair?

[phil-l]

I've discussed this in the past. The cover can easily be modified. Note that the gasket is reusable, so the cover is easy to remove and reinstall.

My original post:

I performed the isolator bolt/port seal procedure http://leckemby.net/windstar/windstar01.html on my 2000 Windstar LX 3.8 a few months ago. I bought the parts from my local dealer, based on the part numbers included in the procedure (i.e., it wasn't a kit, just a collection of parts).

However, if I had to do it over again, I would not buy the valve cover.

First, take a look at the comparison of the two valve covers here: http://www.miracerros.com/mustang/pcv_filter.htm. Yes, these are pictures of the Mustang version of the 3.8, but they look exactly the same as the Windstar.

This means budget-sensitive Windstar owners should be able to modify their original valve cover to match the revised cover. You'd probably only need some tin snips (there is one corner of the interior baffle that has a new notch), a pair of pliers (one corner is bent slightly differently) and some reliable way to plug the hole (I'd suggest an appropriate size bolt, with a nylock-style locking nut).

I highly recommend performing the isolator bolt/port seal procedure. If you spend some time reading and paying attention to details, it isn't a terribly difficult DIY job. All of the symptoms I had seen before (pinging, etc.) are now gone; van runs great.

[rfmc9081]

My 2002 Windstar has 71000+ miles. During the past few months the engine light came on. Few other symtoms have appeared other than some rough cold morning starts. I took the vehicle to mechanic and paid $100 to have the code checked out. They recommended the isolator bolt TSB. Not having a spare $650 I declined. More recently the battery died. I took the battery out and did an exchange. Now there is no engine light. Apparently the code reset when the negative cable was removed. Engine is running well now for about a week (it is summer now so no cold starts).Any opinions as to when the light will re-appear and if in fact I am having the dredded po171/174 problem? Can I get a history of the codes read for free by going to Auto-Zone?

[C. Cleve]

Hi, You can get a history of the codes read or posted only with a WDS scanner at the dealer, IF they will respond to your request...GOOD LUCK,...Clay,..

[DRW1000]

Originally Posted by sfetch

How has your windstar been running since the repair? How many more miles since the repair?

About 13 months and 30 000 km, If I was going to do anything though I would do something like Phil-1 has suggested.

[bopritchard]

are the isolator bolts and gaskets are dealer part or can i get them at the local parts store?

Originally Posted by sfetch

I got the dreaded po171/174 cel code on my 2001 windturd. Per the numerous posts on this subject, I replaced the isolater bolts and gaskets. Thanks to the fellow with the website. I truly appreciate the effort put in the instructions for the repair. It was a breeze. I checked the valve cover for the hole and am pretty sure that mine doesn't have the hole. It's really difficult to see well through the pcv valve hole. As a result, I decided not to change the valve cover ($60 savings).

Here's my question: If missed seeing the hole and left a "bad valve cover" in place, should I anticipate seeing the dreaded CEL po171/174 down the road or different issue? Or does it not matter much? I'd appreciate any input. Also, If I need to replace the valve cover, do I need to use a silicon gasket sealant material with the replacement and what torque should be applied to the valve cover? My local autoparts never seems to have the Haynes Windturd book in stock. Must be a hot item.

Thanks for the help.

[wiswind]

You do not need to add any sealant to the valve cover gasket.
You NEVER want to use ANY sealant with SILICONE on your engine at any location.
Silicone will bleed out gasses that can damage the oxygen sensors, in even a small amount. The air inside that valve cover goes into the cylinders, and out to the oxygen sensors. You have 4 of them....so it can be an expensive mistake.
Look for a sealant that does NOT have silicone, AND clearly states that it is "Safe for Sensors".

The valve cover replacement / modification is to reduce the amount of oil that is drawn into the engine.
Not only can it pool in the intake manifold, it goes on into the cylinders and causes carbon build up inside the cylinders if you draw too much oil in.
This can lead to "pinging", which is why the dealership TSB includes a "re-flash" of the PCM to slightly retard the timing advance.
It is normal to have some oil drawn in, but too much is what leads to problems.

[kafkacell]

Sorry for resurrecting a very old post.

Windstar 1996, 144k miles, 3.8l.
I cleaned EGR ports (not fully clogged, but yes they were dirty), removed plenum and all the stuff to get into it.

At the end of the job, installed plenum and everything. Started the van and I heard a shhhhh (air leak) coming out from plenum. So, I removed plenum again and put it some Red Silicone Sealant at valve cover gaskets (red ones). Not too much. Installed again, and again a leak can be heard.

After doing a little search about plenum leaks, I see that you wont recommend putting silicone sealant on plenum.

What do you guys recommend me? remove plenum and clean silicone and just use the original valve cover gaskets, or just let it as it is now (silicone + air leak). Remember that I tried original gaskets and there was an air leak.

regards.

[kafkacell]

Update:

I removed the plenum again and with a razor blade carefully removed the red silicone. Ajusted too hard too bolts and broke them my bad.

Put it everything together and air leak can be heard. At night CEL came out flashing indicating a misfire code (I bought an OBD II USB cable to use with my laptop, since it was cheaper than getting the codes read at store, still waiting for it to arrive).

I guess I have to use sealant (sensor safe off course, as wiswind already mentioned), I hope to get it at napa by monday.

Here is the one they sell online, I hope they have it here:



I think I'm on the right track.

EDIT: how can I remove the broken bolts? or they can stay there forever without presenting issues?

Regards.

[javanes]

I would like to post my experience as I think is relevant and may save alot of time and money for the rest of the forum members.
I got the P0171 and P0174 codes on my 2002 windstar. As per the suggestions in this thread, I bought the gasket kit and replaced the isolater bolts and gaskets. Many Thanks to the website with the deatiled description on how to do this. However, during the process of changin the gaskets, I couldn't help noticing that the Intake Manifold Runner Control (IMRC) actuator arm bushings are all broken and the actuator arms are fallen off of their respective runner locations. Fortunately the arms were not lost while driving since the IMRC end was still attached. I bought the 4 little bushings for $14 each and replaced them in addition to finishing the gasket replacement projects and started the engine and there were no engine lights for 4 days now.

I think the culprit of these codes for my case were the IMRC arm bushings rather than the whole gasket project since they open air intake valves in high RPM situations and if they are broken ina slight open position , they may cause lean mixture and fire the codes.

[eroosa]

If you replace the Intake Manifold Runner Control (IMRC) actuator arm bushings please search the forums. I posted this summer about ordering them online for much less money. I think it was orielly auto parts and the part number for the packet (5 pack) is on the forum post from myself.