N/A v f/i

[zx2guy]

this is something we have touching in one of the other forums. and i think its all about personal preference. but if you had a choice in cars or upgrading what you have through one of these avenues which would you go. forced induction (turbo, supercharger), or naturally asperated ( just swapping cams, crank, pistons, ect). i know its vague. but do what you can

[BlackGT2000]

Yeah really vague, if there are two identical motors and one is tuned for NA and the other is FI I guess the FI would be preferred. Just thinking...NA Supra vs turbo Supra or 01 Cobra vs 03 Cobra.

[zx2guy]

ill try using an example to try to convey this a little better.
lets say you have a 03 zx2 (just so happens to be my car...huh... imagine that) it has a naturally asperated motor. i can decide to put on a turbo ( since there really arent any superchargers that are reliable) or i could swap cams, pistons, just about anything but use forced induction. what would you do?

[TatII]

n/a mods on a small displacement engine you will have a hard timing breaking 250hp.

even the 10 second all motor drag honda's only makes 350 crank hp and those things are built to the balls running rediciously high compression pistons, a cam that barely lets the engine idle, head work, a super high rev limit, very very high strung engine.

however with boost, you can make 300-400-700- and some extreme cases, 1000whp on a 2.0 boosted 4 cylinder. the SR20DET's have been known to make 700whp and the 4G63's have been known to put down over 1000whp at all 4 wheels.

if you want to go mild with great throttle response, get a hybrid ball bearing turbo, it will give you near instant response, waay more tq then n/a tune, you wouldn't have to rev the shit out of it to make power, and you can still make 300whp easy with a good setup with great power delivery.

[NISSANSPDR]

Along those same lines and related to a thread I started:

I was trying to consider getting a RSX-S or a GTi Mk V. One's NA, one's turbo. I dont know enough about turbo's and dont want to get mixed up in it, but I feel like a Mini Cooper S JCP or Cobalt SS would be more reliable than a turbo car like a SRT4, WRX, or GTi Mk V. Now is it right to say that any NA car would trump a FI car in reliability b/c it doesnt have as many things going and an issues to worry about like fuel mixtures, detonation, etc etc.

[zx2guy]

ok so ill have reliability on my side but i will suffer in way of not reaching very high in hp. thats livable.... i wont have to worry about more stuff breaking... not turbo lag... il probibly just go half and half. ill work on the car i have and make it n/a and ill turbo the car i want (which is the same car just w/ a stick)

[SuperHighOutput]

I like both and I respect someone's choice either way. They both have pros and cons, but it comes down to the one you prefer. Personally I'd consider nitrous, it's cheap, effective, and allows for everyday drivability while giving you power when you want it.

[zx2guy]

my only problem with no2 is it leans out the mix so much. ild have to put in a wet system so i dont burn up the pistons or valves. the other thing is the power increments arent to my liking.... i mean if i could add 25 hp... that will put my car at 155. which is good enough. but i worry about adding more then that because im sure ild break something. but the smallest ive seen is 35.

[TatII]

most cars can handle a 70 shot. and thats a dry kit i believe.

and also yeah to a certain degree that a n/a tuned car is more reliable, but if you want to make any real meaningful power, you need do all that i have mentioned and it won't be reliable one bit. super high compression, plus super high rev plus super advanced ignition timing, plus leaner air fuel ratio = stress on rods trying to pull itself apart from high piston speed, alot of heat inside the cylinder from high compression, big stress on valvetrain due to higher rev limit and more lift from cams.

but i you want a reliable n/a you really only are looking at a 20 whp gain, and thats with intake, headers, exhuast, and a chip, and maybe cams. a turbo can almost make that much more power on a nice cold night vs a hot day.

[BlackGT2000]

Yeah thats a really good point, as soon as you have significan't power gains regardless of how you get it, you are going to be looking at reliability problems, particularly if you are talking about doing FI on a motor that wasn't even made for it. There is going to be alot more things that will either need to be replaced or be broken.

[blakscorpion21]

if looking for big power go f/i, if looking for just a little bit go n/a. i would always prefer f/i personally though. more torque, better throttle response, plus easily upgradable for big power.

[zx2guy]

stock my car makes 130 ponies.... im willing to bet thats crank, not wheel... what im looking to do is build it to maybe 175.... ish. thats 45 hp. i think if i get a CAI (or short ram), ported throttle body, and do something to the intake, and intake cam. ill have a nice little gain. (maybe 15) then i have a 421 header. ill move the cat (which is in the engine compartment) to under the car... which allows for more options on a cat back. then ill balance the motor (for longevity reasons... not performance), and put in flat top pistons. which will possibly add another 15. these are only guesses though on my gains. so they may be high or low.... i really dont have the tech here to measure any gain.

going a little wilder. if i put in a .400 lift cam the motor becomes interference(... which im not a big fan of the idea incase the belt breaks) and i could put in domed pistons (forged... rods too)to further add compression. with that a stronger bolt kit might be a good idea. ill also build up my tranny (which on my car are notoriously bad to start with) shift kit, any other goodies ill try to think of. oh and there is also a kit out there that will stroke the motor from 2.0 to 2.4.... something i dont like the idea of (i like my high winder... and i dont know how it will effect my motors chemistry) but ill throw that out there for you guys to comment on.

[TatII]

that would be the like a $3000 dollar engine job for like 40 hp gains. if thats how you want to spend your money, then be it. but $3000 you can get a blower and make atleast 75hp more, with decent reliablity too.

[pre98zetec]

run a 100 shot, zetecs will take 100 shot's stock..


your tranny however...

[zx2guy]

Originally Posted by TatII

that would be the like a $3000 dollar engine job for like 40 hp gains. if thats how you want to spend your money, then be it. but $3000 you can get a blower and make atleast 75hp more, with decent reliablity too.

i have yet to find a good reliable SC for my car... ive found a few, but ive asked one of the guys in the zx2 forum, who has worked on these cars since 98. and he has yet to find one that he would reccommend(and ive done some of my own snooping and i tend to agree). in fact there are 2 really
knowledgeable guys there one is altec and the other is skater in ny.

this is whats limiting me to either turbo or na status. ive found a guy that builds turbo kits and of all the turbo kits ive found he is the cheapest(but the best). for his stage 3 its only like $1750. but i can go through gude (but they have fitment problems) and go for a head and turbo for 2800(good kits though). thats not including what ild have to add in the bottom end (forged pistons... anything else i feel like doing). these are my basic options. im a little afraid of adding a turbo... for all the reasons you could think of. which is why i like n/a but it is more expensive. and me no liky nos< i tend to break shit when i have power at my finger tips.