Professional discussion

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

The PROs (thats me) recommend A/C Delco plugs in GM vehicles.

With all due respect GMMerlin, the "Pros" are not just GM Techs or dealers, etc. Also, they are people or avid enthusiasts that have a wealth of knowledge and experience with the specific model automobile in question.

You can use whatever brand spark plug you so desire in your GM automobile and the rest of us can continue to use or recommend other alternative and suitable brands. Is that fair?






Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

[GMMerlin]

With all due respect GMMerlin, the "Pros" are not just GM Techs or dealers, etc. Also, they are people or avid enthusiasts that have a wealth of knowledge and experience with the specific model automobile in question.

Just for the record
pro·fes·sion·al ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pr-fsh-nl)
adj.

Of, relating to, engaged in, or suitable for a profession: lawyers, doctors, and other professional people.
Conforming to the standards of a profession: professional behavior.
Engaging in a given activity as a source of livelihood or as a career: a professional writer.
Performed by persons receiving pay: professional football.
Having or showing great skill; expert: a professional repair job.

Well since I am all of the above, I am entitled to my opinion as well as you are.

The man has a STOCK GP, the best plug for it is an AC Delco..like I said before, I have seen too many undesirable driveability concerns with non AC Delco plugs.

Once he has modded his vehicle like you have, then experimentation with different plugs and temp ranges will give him the best performance.
In my high performance vehicles I have used different plugs in them other than AC Delco.

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

Just for the record
pro·fes·sion·al ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pr-fsh-nl)
adj.

Of, relating to, engaged in, or suitable for a profession: lawyers, doctors, and other professional people.
Conforming to the standards of a profession: professional behavior.
Engaging in a given activity as a source of livelihood or as a career: a professional writer.
Performed by persons receiving pay: professional football.
Having or showing great skill; expert: a professional repair job.

Well since I am all of the above, I am entitled to my opinion as well as you are.

The man has a STOCK GP, the best plug for it is an AC Delco..like I said before, I have seen too many undesirable driveability concerns with non AC Delco plugs.

Once he has modded his vehicle like you have, then experimentation with different plugs and temp ranges will give him the best performance.
In my high performance vehicles I have used different plugs in them other than AC Delco.

Again with all due respect, that's a poor comparison because personally I don't believe it refers to or was intended to include so called professional automobile mechanics, etc. It may be nice to toot your horn but are you a doctor, lawyer, accountant, engineer? Do you have a professional degree in your field of expertise since you are claiming to be all of the above?

BTW - I race my GTP for money at the local dragstrip which incidently has paid for over 50% of my mods. What category does that put people like me in?

I do agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.





Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

[GMMerlin]

Do you have a professional degree in your field of expertise since you are claiming to be all of the above?

Yes I do

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

Yes I do

Just curious. What type of degree, educational institution and in what field?







Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

[GMMerlin]

Thanks for asking.
Degree in Automotive Technology (Vale Technical Institute) Now Wyo-Tech
Degree in Automotive Management (Mont. Technical College)
ASE Master Technician
ASE L1 Technician
GM World Class Technician
GM Certified Service Consultant
GM Certified Service Manager
Member IATN

Have a nice day

[GMMerlin]

BTW - Does that qualify me as a Professional and qualified enough to throw in my 2 cents on AF?

Just being a car enthusiast qualifies anyone to throw his or her 2 cents here on AF.

But remember you are the one that wanted to see whose tool was bigger.
Since I don’t see anything in your resume that indicates that you have practical or educational experience in the automotive field. Looks like your basis is in the electrical engineering field, that’s cool, we need those too.
So with that info you provided, I would say that you do not meet the definition of a professional in the automotive field.
Sorry, HS auto shop doesn’t count, everyone took that.
NHRA..yea I spent my 60 bucks on a membership, IHRA, its only 50 a year…Remember the AHRA? I was a member of that too.

But I am not here to slam you; the resume is impressive, just not automotive.
I could have added my firefighting resume, contractor’s licenses, the governors commendations or the “Worlds Greatest Dad” sticker I got from my kid, but that is not relevant to our discussion.
The fact is I am a professional automotive technician that has been practicing my craft for 22 years with General Motors, an owner of an auto repair business and an all around car nut.
It’s safe to say that I have probably forgotten more about the Grand Prix then you have ever learned.
I am here to give advice taken on a practical level from years as someone you said “has a wealth of knowledge and experience with the specific model automobile in question”
All experience levels, questions, answers and opinions are welcome here on AF.
The original poster asked for opinions on what plugs to use in his factory stock vehicle…I gave him my professional opinion and you gave yours…lets get the thread back on track.

Oh yea..
I applaud you for your service to the government..Thanks for that!

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

Degree in Automotive Technology (Vale Technical Institute) Now Wyo-Tech

Out of curiosity what exactly is Wyotech. What type of school? I didn't see it listed in my national listing of accredited colleges and universities.

Is it similar to schools like UTI - Universal Technical Institute. My brother attended MMI - Motorcycle Mechanics Institute in Phoenix which is part of UTI. It was a 18 month technical school but not like a traditional college. He's certified by the factory to work on Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha and Suzuki motorcycles (street & dirt). Plus his GI Bill paid for it. It was something like $14K for tuition.

Not to be critical about your education but personally I don't see how these type schools stack up against real 4 year colleges. Just my 2 cents.

Here's a link to my alma mater Texas Tech University:

http://www.ttu.edu/

BTW - You don't need a college degree or training as an automotive mechanic to determine which spark plugs are best for your car.






Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

[Tonkatech]

[quote=bnaylor3400]Out of curiosity what exactly is Wyotech. What type of school? I didn't see it listed in my national listing of accredited colleges and universities.

Is it similar to schools like UTI - Universal Technical Institute. My brother attended MMI - Motorcycle Mechanics Institute in Phoenix which is part of UTI. It was a 18 month technical school but not like a traditional college. He's certified by the factory to work on Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha and Suzuki motorcycles (street & dirt). Plus his GI Bill paid for it. It was something like $14K for tuition.

Not to be critical about your education but personally I don't see how these type schools stack up against real 4 year colleges. Just my 2 cents.

Here's a link to my alma mater Texas Tech University:

http://www.ttu.edu/

BTW - You don't need a college degree or training as an automotive mechanic to determine which spark plugs are best for your car.



hi...i'm a graduate of Wyo-tec and it is like one of the most popular technical schools in the country http://wyotech.com/
i took the auto and diesel courses and now work for a shipping company in the maintence shop.

[BNaylor]

Originally Posted by Tonkatech

hi...i'm a graduate of Wyo-tec and it is like one of the most popular technical schools in the country http://wyotech.com/ i took the auto and diesel courses and now work for a shipping company in the maintence shop.

Good for you. Thanks for the link. I'll check it out.






Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

[GMMerlin]

I figured you would try to discredit my education. You just go to prove the fact that most people think they are above the people who work in the automotive service industry.
General public opinion of auto technicians is that they are uneducated, dirty and rip you off. That may be true of mechanics, but auto technicians are highly trained and disciplined professionals who use advanced procedures and equipment to diagnose vehicle concerns.
Factory trained and supported technicians have a higher level of skill and knowledge of a specific vehicle then independent mechanics and technicians do. That means the trained GM Tech has more knowledge of GM vehicles then a Nissan Tech and vice versa.
Unfortunately the aftermarket and the backyard mechanic are going to get left further behind as the newer technology comes out. This includes mechanics that work at dealers who do not keep up or participate in factory-supplied training.
LAN communication protocols, new diesel technology, hybrid and electronic technology are coming into the automotive field at an alarming rate. Most diagnostic procedures rely heavily on electrical and electronic testing and knowledge. I see every day technicians falling behind and the public having a harder and harder time finding dealers who are competent enough to address their concerns.
People don’t understand the fact that the dealer did not design or build the vehicle they purchased, but have to stand behind the product when it comes in for a concern.
I’d like to think that all GM dealers have armies of highly trained technicians that can repair your vehicle quickly, efficiently and right the first time, but the truth of the matter is that good many dealers would like to eliminate service departments from their facilities.
Its like any other business, there are good ones and bad ones, it’s a crap shoot on which one you get when you roll your car into the shop and even a bigger one if you get a technician who knows what he is doing or a hack that just works there.
The dealer I work for has 18 techs, 1 World Class, 5 Master Certified and that leaves 12 that haven’t met standards and we have the highest training in the area. (Doesn’t say much for the other dealers in town)
My education in the automotive field is top notch, just because I didn’t go to a “real” college doesn’t mean I am not educated.
You don’t need 4 years of psychology to diagnose a High Speed LAN communication failure or Applied Physics to diagnose a sticking trans valve without tearing the trans apart.
Besides your education, what investment do you have in your job? Do you have to supply your test equipment, pens and paper or computer? Probably not.
Most technicians not only pay for their education, but also have to supply the tools of their trade. Usual investment is in the neighborhood of 50K, mine is 75K at last count.
And figuring I live in the same neighborhood as engineers, I would venture to say that my pay scale is comparable (not bad for not having a “real” college education)

“BTW - You don't need a college degree or training as an automotive mechanic to determine which spark plugs are best for your car.”

You are absolutely correct. You don’t need training to determine which plugs are good for YOUR car, but you better have a solid background and experience in automotive repair to determine which plugs are best for someone else’s.

Since I am someone who in your words has “a wealth of knowledge and experience with the specific model automobile in question.” I would say that on a factory stock GP, the original poster would be best served to use the correct A/C Delco plug for his application.
Some things are better left to the PROs.

[BNaylor]

I had the opportunity to check out Wyotech and it looks like a good tech school for it's intended purpose. My brother checked into it too before going with UTI. He says that they are similar. He went with UTI/MMI solely because the Phoenix campus was closer to El Paso and LA and Wyotech did not offer a Motorcycle Repair Certification program endorsed by the major motorcycle companies like Harley and the Japanese companies.

It looks like these type schools fill a void and a certain niche market. Looks good to me. It's the end product that counts.

BTW - I'm not going to get into a debate between the pros and cons of college versus tech school and the legal definition of a Professional. Everyone has made their point and it's time to move on.

[richtazz]

Easy there big fellas, enough already. We could go on and on for days on this. Bnaylor has proven on this forum that he knows what he's talking about. To say that you've probably forgotten more than he may ever know about Grand Prix's was out of line. He gives good sound advice and is a big help to the people here on these forums. On the other hand, he insinuated that your education was from a Watsamatta U. type of school which was wrong on his part. So, why don't we shake hands and make up and stick to what these forums are for, helping people save money by educating them about what repairs they may need.

[GravityAmp]

cheers tazz I agree , I got to admit I now feel like a barnyard animal ! Well as far as formal edumacation goes just kidding
I enjoy and appreciate all of the help , advice and vast knowledge that everyone in these forums share.
now I'm gettin some popcorn ready for round 2 or is it 3?
lol Thanks gents Peace