Intake manifold gasket/leaking

[troubld]

I haven't seen any new posts for this problem, so here goes. I'm new at at this so please be patient.

Two months ago I replaced my water pump due to "low coolant" problems and leak. Yesterday I again had "low coolant" problem, thought it was a faulty pump. Took it back to the mechanic who told me that the lower intake manifold gasket had leaked coolant into the engine. He advised me to look into any class action suits that may be out there regarding the gasket problem, but I have also heard there is a class action for Dexcool which may be causing the gasket to fail.

This repair cost me $1,250 (also had plugs and wires replaced at the same time). The mechanic told me he has heard this could happen again 3-6 months down the road. Info: I know nothing about repairing cars. Anyone have info?

[GMMerlin]

Decool does not cause the problems with the gaskets like everyone claims.
If the mechanic told you this could happen 3-6 months down the road, I would be very suspect of his mechanically ability and the quality of parts he used.
There are several updated procedures and gaskets that have come out over the years to eliminate the leaking concern.
My concern would be the condition of your engine internally if the coolant leaked inside the engine for any length of time.

[troubld]

I very much appreciate your information. I did get the opportunity to see into the top of the engine (?) (oil cap is on top of this) when it was removed. It was in two sections. There appeared to be a yellow mayo looking goop around and under the cap extending about six inches on both sides of this part, but not "down" more than 2 inches (I hope I described this understandably.) I looked into the section that was still in the van, but did not see any of this goop in there. Would it be noticeable? What type of problems should I expect if this is not done correctly?

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

Decool does not cause the problems with the gaskets like everyone claims.
If the mechanic told you this could happen 3-6 months down the road, I would be very suspect of his mechanically ability and the quality of parts he used.
There are several updated procedures and gaskets that have come out over the years to eliminate the leaking concern.
My concern would be the condition of your engine internally if the coolant leaked inside the engine for any length of time.

[GMMerlin]

With the "goop" in the oil fill, that is a good indication of coolant mixing with the oil.
That my friend is a BAD THING.
The babbit material in the bearings does not like water or coolant and can cause some serious internal engine concerns (bearing noise and in some cases a broken camshaft)

[troubld]

Thanks again for the info. I guess I should start looking for another vehicle before the $$$ start to get much higher. Any suggestions?

Originally Posted by GMMerlin

With the "goop" in the oil fill, that is a good indication of coolant mixing with the oil.
That my friend is a BAD THING.
The babbit material in the bearings does not like water or coolant and can cause some serious internal engine concerns (bearing noise and in some cases a broken camshaft)

[DRW1000]

I would not panic ahead of time. Change your oil a couple of times.

If your mechanic used GM parts then he would have purchased a redesigned gasket.

Although I don't think there is proof of Dex-cool causing gasket failures it is the common belief. I think there is a class action suit as well. (although lawyers will jump on anything they can. Who wouldn't want a piece of GM).

I had my gaskets on my 99 replaced under warranty. I don't think the new style gaskets were available at the time and I think I have the old style. It has not leaked again thus far (5 years). I change my coolant (or at least half of it) every 2 years even though it is 5 year coolant.

Again I would not panic right now.

[troubld]

I very much appreciate your opinion. I really would hate to have to look for another vehicle at this time. I did talk to my mechanic. The new gasket he is installing (bear with me here) was redesigned about a year or so ago. I think her said it has some metal clips(?) on the ends(?). He also is sending the intake to a machine shop to have it worked on because it can be warped. Does this sound correct?

Originally Posted by DRW1000

I would not panic ahead of time. Change your oil a couple of times.

If your mechanic used GM parts then he would have purchased a redesigned gasket.

Although I don't think there is proof of Dex-cool causing gasket failures it is the common belief. I think there is a class action suit as well. (although lawyers will jump on anything they can. Who wouldn't want a piece of GM).

I had my gaskets on my 99 replaced under warranty. I don't think the new style gaskets were available at the time and I think I have the old style. It has not leaked again thus far (5 years). I change my coolant (or at least half of it) every 2 years even though it is 5 year coolant.

Again I would not panic right now.

[cdru]

If they have the metal posts as part of the gasket, it's the redesigned gasket and correct. I'd still check to see if they are using the OEM gasket or an aftermarket. I'd pay the extra (if any) and go with the OEM. I was cheap the first time I did mine and paid the price less then 6 months later.

Sending it to a machine shop to be resurfaced probably isn't a bad idea, although it likely isn't necessary.

Are you going to a dealer to have this done or a independent shop? 1250, even with plugs and wires, is very salty. Dealers are usually the most expensive ones and they are usually around $800. Maybe market prices are higher in your area.

[troubld]

Well, I checked with the mechanic again (he's still patient with me). He is replacing the gasket with a Felpro(?) redesigned part. He says that the OE doesn't have the metal posts that it is cardboard covered with rubber. ??? This is an independent shop which I thought would be cheaper also.

Originally Posted by cdru

If they have the metal posts as part of the gasket, it's the redesigned gasket and correct. I'd still check to see if they are using the OEM gasket or an aftermarket. I'd pay the extra (if any) and go with the OEM. I was cheap the first time I did mine and paid the price less then 6 months later.

Sending it to a machine shop to be resurfaced probably isn't a bad idea, although it likely isn't necessary.

Are you going to a dealer to have this done or a independent shop? 1250, even with plugs and wires, is very salty. Dealers are usually the most expensive ones and they are usually around $800. Maybe market prices are higher in your area.

[DRW1000]

I am no expert but I agree with CDRU that the heads probably are not warped but it is common practice to have them resurfaced. They can be checked with a straightedge but it sounds like your mechanic is trying to be thorough.

Felpro are well known aftermarket gasket suppliers and as far as I know are of quality. Whether their their gaskets meet the re-designed GM version is another question. Usually aftermarket suppliers need to get the facts before they can adjust their design. If it was designed a year ago then they have most likely taken the original OEM leaking knowledge into consideration but I would not know how this could be verified.

[cdru]

The redesigned GM gaskets have the metal inserts, the older design didn't. And all the intake manifold gaskets that I've seen have been plastic with a rubber-like orange sealing substance around openings. The orignal gasket was this way, the replacement Fel-pro (w/o metal inserts) was this way, and the redesigned OEM gasket was this way.

I wasn't necessarily saying that you HAD to go with OEM vs the Felpro gasket. It's just that Felpro burned me once and really didn't want to have to take everything apart a 3rd time for another failure (side note...I ended up doing just that a week later due to a head gasket failure...sigh).

The upper intake manifold gasket was primarily paper, but it's not subject to the same conditions so paper works fine.

Originally Posted by DRW1000

I am no expert but I agree with CDRU that the heads probably are not warped but it is common practice to have them resurfaced. They can be checked with a straightedge but it sounds like your mechanic is trying to be thorough.

You are talking about heads. He's talking about intake manifold. Big difference. Although if you go down to the intake manifold, the heads are just another hour or two more. Heads, due to the very high pressure, must be perfectly smooth. The intake manifold, since it's not under high pressure due to compression/combustion, mainly just sits there, so its a little more forgiving of surface imperfections.

[DRW1000]

CDRU,

You are correct. I was thinking heads for some reason and not intake.

[GMCritic]

I just had my 2000 Montana done last moth and it came with a one year, 12,000 mile warranty (didn't use the dealer, but a good shop). With a coolant and oil change (and a new radiator cap) it was just under $800.00. Luckily, the coolant didn't get into the oil so I'm hopefull this is that last I'll see of the lower intake leak saga.

With the goop you describe inside the engine, it would be worthwhile to flush the oil and do another oil change after a few hundred miles to make sure everything gets cleaned out.

[cdru]

Originally Posted by GMCritic

With the goop you describe inside the engine, it would be worthwhile to flush the oil and do another oil change after a few hundred miles to make sure everything gets cleaned out.

Even then, you likely wouldn't get it all. The 'mayo' likes to stick to the valve covers. While they are off, be sure to remove the plasic pieces screwed to the covers and get all the gunk behind there as well.