93 Camry Window Regulator/Fuse

[coolw]

Hey-

Was wondering if anyone had any ideas about a problem with a 93 Camry. I already read several posts, but none seemed to describe my situation. Basically, what has happened twice in the past 3 months is, according to the mechanic I brought it to, the fuse for the power windows/locks has blown out. When this happened, the windows couldn't be put up or down, even on the other panels, as well as the power locks. They claimed that the fuse was behind the dash which resulted in quite a bit in labor charges. Am I being scammed? Also, they told me today that they need to replace the window regulators, which they quoted me $350 for each regulator, $700 total. They claim that the window regulators that are currently installed are the old type and are using too much power which has been causing the fuse to blow out, and that the new type needs to be installed. The driver side window struggles a bit going up and down, particularly when it comes up to the top. One of the techies told me off the record that it might just be a good idea to use a higher voltage fuse. Is this a bad idea? Any help is greatly appreciated, as I don't really want to spend a grand on a car that isn't worth more than 3 grand, particularly something that doesn't affect how it drives. Thanks in advance.

[Toysrme]

Find a new mechanic.
The only fuse for the whole system (including moonroof) is the 30amp power fuse in the cabin fuse box. That's the one by your left knee. There is no hard to get to fuse located anywhere. From that fuse, it goes through the main power relay.
(You can download the 1994 Manual & check the diagram yourself, or check it against a 92-96 Haynes book)

The old style regulators have nothing to do with too much power consumption. If they are functioning to spec, they are fine (like anything else).


I would start by removing the driver's door panel & checking the master control switches, along with the power window relay. If everything is good there, continue to the other doors.

[coolw]

Thanks so much for your help. I had a pretty strong feeling that I was being BSed. Considering I was unable to find more than one type of regulator online, this makes a lot of sense. Just four other questions though. Number one, how would I be able to tell if the master switch needs replacing? Number two, is it possible to get that repair manual for free online, and if so, where? Number three, do you know of a good guide for removing the door panel? I tried to remove it to replace the power mirror, but there seemed to be some catches that I wasn't able to get to. And finally, why doesn't the owner's manual list the fuse you are referring to? I don't doubt your information, I'm just wondering. Thanks.

[ice745]

I have a '94 Camry. At one point in the switch to the drivers side power window got stuck (not visually, but the contacts inside) and the window kept trying to roll up, even tho it was already up, for about a half hour. I couldn't figure out what the clicking noise was, then I took off the door panel, touched the regulator, and got a blister from how hot it was I'm surprised it still works. Anyway, the point of this story, is as Toysrme said, check the master switch at the driver's door, if they are stuck it may cause a fuse to blow. Somewhere on here, I don't remember where, I'll try to find it for you (from when I had a problem) there should be a guide that shows how to test the pinout of the master switch control.
As for the fuse being 'behind the dash' no way, fuses are meant to blow to protect wires, so they are in semi-hidden, yet still convenient locations. I'm not sure its the same for '93, but in my '94 you wanna know where the 'fuses behind the dash' are? Right behind the change holder bottom left of the steering wheel. Its as easy as open the change holder, squeeze two clips, and pull it out, I don't see much labor in that.
For removing the door panel, I'm sure there is a guide on here two, but I will give you my best description from memory (as for '94, should be close if not the same).

There are two screws in the arm rest of the door panel. One has an obvious cover hiding the screw (this can be pried off carefulled with a small flat head screw driver [put some electrical tape or a rag at the end to prevent scratching and chewing the material of the armrest]) Then toward the hinges there should be two circle shaped things about 1" in diameter, they can be pried off same technique to reveal two more screws, remove these. On the side of the door panel toward the non hinged part (by side of the door panel, I mean the actual side, the part that touches the door, comes forward for about 2" then rounds 90 degrees to the rest of the door panel) you should see two small circular clips. They will look like a circle, with a smaller circle inside. Press in the smaller circle on each one, it should pop in, then either grab the bigger circle with small pliers gently (one finger of the plier inside the circle, one outside) and pull out, or use the flathead underneath the outside of the bigger circle and pull out. (If I haven't missed any screws or clips yet, besides the next ones coming up, we're at the two hardest parts.) First, if you look at the interior door handle, it'll have the handle, the manual lock, and the little plastic 'cup' like thing that they are in. This 'cup' thing has two clips holding it in place. You have to fit the flathead driver between the manual lock and this plastic cup, and pry the plastic cup up a little bit and pull it out (from the side toward the nonhinged part of the door). Once you can tell that its off the top clip, then its a similar process for the bottom, just between the cup and the door handle. Both clips are at where the manual lock switch and door handle hinge. Once off both clips, the actual cup swings open like a door (it 'hinge' being toward the hinged part of the door) and should come off, once that is off observe how that pieces simple hinge works to make it easier to put it on later (its not hard at all). This should reveal another bolt, I do not remember if this one needs to be removed, I think its only for if you need to take the handle and manual lock switch off. You'll be able to tell at the end if you need to remove this if the door panel is still stuck by this screw. Now for the final steps, you need to squeeze either a door panel removal tool, or simply an (at least 6" long) flat head screw driver between the door panel and door. You should start from a lower corner, I usually start from the hinged part. Make sure the screw driver is taped head or use the rag cover idea to protect your paint, as you start to seperate the door panel (you will feel A LOT of resistance at first because of the clips) look in the crack and see if you can see the clip (it should be white or yellow, you'll see it connecting the door panel to the door) you need to get the screw driver head right next to these (you may have to back out and go back in if you started from a bad location. Once you have the head next to the first clip, gently pry to pop it (these clips are simple pressure clips and do not need to have anything done but have some pressure put on them to release). Once this is popped, move up to find the next, once you finished one side of the door, do the bottom, then the other side (if in the process any of these clips should break, do not worry, they are cheap and widely available at parts stores, you can even go without a few [if you break two or more consecutive ones, move a good one to one of the now empty spots on the door panel (they slide out easy with the panel off) to spread out the empty spots]). The Top edge also has the interior weather strip for the window attached, and this part has no clips. To completley remove the panel; you should be able to hinge the bottom of the panel open about 7 to 10" just enough for you to reach up and disconnect the wire harness connected to the master switches (You should see something you need to press toward the center or the harness before pulling it out). Once this is disconnected, you can slowly push up (toward the sky) on the door panel to remove it, if it seems stuck, try doing it about an inch at a time from each corner (because the weather strip sometimes causes too much friction on the window to do it in one motion). You should see how the weatherstrip part of it kind of hooks into the space between the window and the metal of the door, make sure you hook this back when putting the panel back. Now the panel is completely off, looking at the panel the master switch control should have one screw holding a piece of metal on that keeps it in place in the panel, remove this screw, and the metal piece should come with it, now the control should swing free from the panel for easier inspection. To put everything back, just follow the instructions backward for the most part, exceptions are:
First, make sure you reconnect the wire harness for the window controls. For the clips that hold the door panel to the door, use your index and middle finger like scissors to line them up with the holes in the door the go in, they should fall in place about 1/4". When they are all aligned, use the side of your fist like a hammer (not TOO hard, but hard enough to pop them back in). Starting from the top of the sides, and working down, then doing the bottom. (If one seems stubborn, don't hit harder, it may have become misaligned, just double check it to prevent breaking it). For those clips on the side of the panel, the "circle inside the circle," You'll see the inner circle is kind of like a nail in the hold of the outer circle, from the pointed edge of the 'nail' pull it out all the way through (it may take a little force), this will leave the outer circle with an empty inner hole. Put the outter circle part in its hole in the door panel, then put the 'nail'/inner circle through the hole and press it with your finger until its even with the outter circle (it should pop into place).

If you need any clarification or additional help, let me or anyone else know. Again, these are instructions for the '94 that I own, but I think they should be very similar to the '93.

As for the struggling window, I had this problem with my front passenger window, it even stuttered. With the door panel off, you'll see a silver colored metal going up and down, this is what the cable that raises and lowers the window is guided by. I put Vasoline/Petroleum Jelly on it to lubricate it, and its been fine. I'm currently having a similar problem with my drivers door, but I haven't lubricated that one yet (it may even be from when the switch was stuck, I may have burned my regulator a little). You should see a white piece of plastic that the cable is attached to that runs up and down this metal, you really only need to lubricate the sides of the metal, not the whole piece.

Best of luck to ya.

[ice745]

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=194822

That thread has a lot of information (including the pins to check on the master cotnrol) that should help you.

[Toysrme]

Number one, how would I be able to tell if the master switch needs replacing?

Check the contacts, make sure the switch operate OK, test it with any fashion of continuity testing to make sure they're not shorting & to make sure they pass current when you push the switch.

Number two, is it possible to get that repair manual for free online, and if so, where?

The 1994 Toyota Camry Repair manual is 110mb zip file. You can find links for it in this FAQ, and on other Camry forums (ToyotaNation) also.

Number three, do you know of a good guide for removing the door panel? I tried to remove it to replace the power mirror, but there seemed to be some catches that I wasn't able to get to.

Repair Manual/Haynes manual

And finally, why doesn't the owner's manual list the fuse you are referring to? I don't doubt your information, I'm just wondering. Thanks.

I have no idea. I don't have an owners manual for my ES, never even seen one for a Camry in person. The zip file contains the pdf's off the repair CD. If the names are letters you want BE. If you get the one I repackaged, it's Body Electrical Systems.

Quickest bet would be to open the pdf & find/search "Window".

[ice745]

Ahh, one screw I forgot, In the mapholder part of the door, there is another obvious screw cover, pop that off like the other one, and they'll be a screw.

More than likely the catches you couldn't see were either the part of the interior door handle, or the clips holding the panel to the door. (Both are described in my long post above)

And if you don't feel like downloading the 110 mb file, you can go to www.autozone.com They have the Chilton/Haynes style repair guides online for most cars (ours included). It doesn't nearly have as much information as the 110 mb repair manual, but you only look at what you're looking for (so you don't need to download 110 mb to read 1 mb). Check there first, if they don't have what you're looking for, then resort to the 110 mb file.

The www.autozone.com site has an illustrated step by step instruction to remove door panel, which will be better than my descrip. Go there! With power windows you will not need that "windshield molding/door handle pliers"