All-Trac???

[Chiquae07]

i have a all-trac for sale in my area. its a 1990 and has about 65k miles on it. manual and the usual upgrades. how powerful are these cars? Is it worth 6500?

[91 Celica St]

its only 200 hp at the stock boost, but if you boost to 15psi and kill the fuel cut, youll smoke evos and hang with sti's all day....keep in mind even tho it wil only have about 260 hp at 15psi of boost, its about 300 pounds lighter than an sti and 200 less than an evo

not to mention the fact you can rally...witch is fun

[bluespeed]

Originally Posted by 91 Celica St

its only 200 hp at the stock boost, but if you boost to 15psi and kill the fuel cut, youll smoke evos and hang with sti's all day....keep in mind even tho it wil only have about 260 hp at 15psi of boost, its about 300 pounds lighter than an sti and 200 less than an evo

not to mention the fact you can rally...witch is fun

What would be considered safe boost for an All Trac?

[Chiquae07]

i dont think 15psi is good to run on stock internals. although it does have the fuel cut differencer, bov, short shifter, intake, and clutch mods to it. I think there must be some good reason for him to be selling the car since if its that fast, y would u sell it?

[91 Celica St]

15 psi is fine to run on a 3sgte, this isnt some crap honda built for n/a,m this engine was engineered to be boosted, there hav ebeen many 3s-gtes with over 20psi+ on stock internals....

again go over to the mr2 forums and check out jekleandhyde
hes running 23 psi i think on stock internals

[Yaggus]

Well all I have done on my car is a 2.5" exhaust and a boost controller.

I have the boost set at a touch under a bar, so thats about 15psi and it runs GREAT.

It gives you a lovely little backshove when it hits full boost. I would definately recommend getting it.

[blakscorpion21]

hey 91 arent evos and stis equal in performance i rwead a mag that said they run the same in the 1/4 mile. i say you should jump on this deal only 65 k miles thats a good deal just check it out rweal good or have someone do it for you i would be all over that car if it were me.

[jaybratt]

Go for it, I got a 91 for 6250, with a 126000 on it. Rebuilt turbo. They are AWESOME. It is a great car.

[91 Celica St]

i dont care what mags say, goto a real trac, mags are ALWASY wrong, you know that in car and driver tehre not allowed to go withing 250 RPm of redline? they usually shift about 500-750 rpm before redline becuase they usually have dealer cars or they buy them

ive seen sti's pull 13.2's the fastest ive ever seen a stock evo hit is 13.5... so there not even close to being equel, not to mention evos actaulyl dont handle nearly as good as sti's, completely diffrent wheelbase, as well as they have ALOT higher center of gravity

the 4g63 sucks, the only reason why they can even come close to hangin with the ej20 is the turbo, the sti has a bigger turbo, and the engine is suited to witshtand more power

look at the cranks on the motors, the 4g63 only has a 6 bolt flywheel pattern, the (fairly odd) ej20 boxer crank is an 89 bolt pattern (keep in mind if you didnt know the ej20 is a boxzer motror, instead of the pisonts going upside down, there are 2 pistons on each side facing diretcly away from eachother, tand there laying down, basically the pistons go tward the fenders, intead of going upwards to the hood

[Chiquae07]

does the all-trac have a knock sensor, or can i install one from a 2000 to run 87 octane gas, its like almost 3 bucks a gallon for it up here

[blakscorpion21]

the evo has motre power though its just underrated at the crank. they dinoed them and the evo got 236 and the sti got 234 im pretty sure those were the numbers.

[91 Celica St]

never heard of that, and the evo may put almost the same down to the wheels (because of the sti's tractions system and the tourque split), if you look at a dyno sheet of both cars, the sti even pulls MUCH stronger throughout its power band

its not that i hate the evo, id take one anyday, i just hate how poeple (no offense its not directed to you) think the evo is just as good or better when it fact its not....granted boxer engines arent notorious for being good, its kind like having a v-6, its a crap platform, but when its done right like the ej20, it can kick ass

what im sayin is buiild an evo to the moon, do the same to the sti, give em the same turbo and same boost level at same comp and tuned nearly the same, the sti will KILL the evo, not to mention the evo isnt as good as handleing as a sti

reasons mainly being, evo hurryd production to try and beat the sti to the market, when thats done, lots of corners are cut( like they were) they tried to squeeze every bit of power of of the 4g and its noticable....have you ever driven around in a evo when your not in boost? its slower than my st, at least the sti has balls when its not boosting

[Yaggus]

Originally Posted by 91 Celica St

never heard of that, and the evo may put almost the same down to the wheels (because of the sti's tractions system and the tourque split), if you look at a dyno sheet of both cars, the sti even pulls MUCH stronger throughout its power band

its not that i hate the evo, id take one anyday, i just hate how poeple (no offense its not directed to you) think the evo is just as good or better when it fact its not....granted boxer engines arent notorious for being good, its kind like having a v-6, its a crap platform, but when its done right like the ej20, it can kick ass

what im sayin is buiild an evo to the moon, do the same to the sti, give em the same turbo and same boost level at same comp and tuned nearly the same, the sti will KILL the evo, not to mention the evo isnt as good as handleing as a sti

reasons mainly being, evo hurryd production to try and beat the sti to the market, when thats done, lots of corners are cut( like they were) they tried to squeeze every bit of power of of the 4g and its noticable....have you ever driven around in a evo when your not in boost? its slower than my st, at least the sti has balls when its not boosting

But you do have to consider the fact that you are basing your argument on the US spec EVO and STi. Its something that i see quite often on this board. People live in the US are always going on about how the STi has more torque and how it handles better etc etc... As the saying goes "Only in America"

Everywhere else in the world the EVO completely DOMINATES the STi. For ease of comparison I will base this argument on the base model JDM STi and the base model EVO (not the FQ series or anything).

Ok to start off with, Imagine the STi only having a 2L engine because everywhere else in the world, thats all it gets. Level playing field now. There goes that torque advantage the Sti had from having an extra 500cc. In stock form, im actually pretty sure the JDM Evo has more torque than the JDM Sti. You were saying that if you built both engines to the moon the STi would be faster. As a general rule if you go balls to the wall with an engine, the larger engine will make more hp. By using the JDM engines as the basis it becomes a lot more comparible. I may be wrong about this given that i dont live in the US, but i read in a mag that the STi's internals werent as good as the EVO's internals. Anyone care to clarify for me? The Evo IX (not sure if its released in the US yet but ill include this fact anyway because its kool :P) Also had MIVEC technology introduced to it This boosted the midrange torque of the EVO by quite a substantial margin. Result: In stock form JDM EVO engine outguns JDM Sti. EVO:1 STi:0

Ironic that you mention the handling... The US is the ONLY country for the EVO NOT to get AYC (Active Yaw Control) This makes for a HUGE difference to the handling of the EVO. In laymens terms AYC is basically a bunch of electonics and sensors that keeps you planted on the road in nearly all conditions. Im surprised that the US didnt get this given that it was one of the championed selling points when first released and even now it remains one of the major highlights of the EVO. To counter the EVO's domminance in the handling department, Subaru introduced their new torque split system which has gained them much ground. Im not sure but I think this IS available in the US but if someone could clarify this for me too it was be appreciated While the new diff on the Subaru gained them a LOT of ground on the EVO but it is still edged out on a racetrack by the EVO's eletronics. Result: In stock form the EVO can still make it around the track faster than the STi. EVO:2 STi:0

In modabilty it would be pretty close. The STi, I think, has a slightly larger aftermarket support in Japan. This is much more obvious in Australia where the EVO was never sold locally :'( Only private imports made it over here. Even still the aftermarket on the EVO is still quite extensive. The cult following is still huge resulting in a plentiful supply of parts and info for the EVO. Result: Ill give this point to the STi. they are just a little bit more popular than the EVO, mainly due to their awesome sounding engine. EVO:2 STi:1

End result. The EVO comes out on top. I really hope one day you guys get to go for a spin in a JDM EVO. They really are an AWESOME machine.

[91 Celica St]

lol put it this way...we live in america, NOT IN JAPAN, unless you import in a jdm evo, then i could GIVE A FLYING FUCK about them this is america not japan and ewe dont have jdm cars over here we have USDM cars with USDM specs and USDM parts.... the sti is faster in the 1/4 mile stock for stock, nuff said
speed:
STI:1 evo:0
(and yes the 4g63 is being used again on the evo 9 and it does come with mivec technology, horsepower is only bumped up to 287 HP from 278 of the evo, and tourqe is NOT gained, its just a smoother tourque curve, peak tourqe stay s exactly ythe same....but WHO GIVES A FUCK, this argument is based off UDSM evo8 VS USDM STI
power:
sti:2 Evo:0

handeling, is no contest, the sti outhandles the evo any day, and yes for those who dont know AYC is pretty much a traction control system kinda like a 350z VDC but on all 4 wheels, and instead of killing power it transferrs it....but who cares anyway evo8 didnt coem with it

and yea like i said earlier the tourqe split system in the STI makes for perfect power displacment, it can tranferr up to 75% power up front or %90 power to the rear as needed, making handeling superb...not to mention the suspension is stiffer on the sti and the evo sits ALOT higher, making a lot higher center of gravity
sti:3 evo:0

the only thing ill give the evo credit is her e they both have LARGE aftermarket suport systems, i can and will say ive seen more moded evo's than sti's, but yif you were given a budget, you could make an sti faster than an evo for the same price
ill give that a no contest due to the fact taht there is slightly more evo support than sti, but due to the fact taht alot of parts for WRX imprezas are sold and some parts swappable with the stli, i would call that a draw


most people on this site are american, and AN AMERICAN is asking the question, so who cares about JDM stuff? cuz i sure dont

i dont disagree jdm evo and jdm sti are ALOT diffrent than usdm ones, this argument is basically pointless becuase neitehr site has any merit anyway.... cool ur right jdm ones are better then usdm and who knows, the jdm evo maky handle better/be faster and blah blah blah....but who cares?


and fyi blackscorp, theres no way in HELL ethe evo and sti are putting down that much to the wheels, a 350Z only puts down 229 WHP, and its only RWD, and evo and sti is lookin at about 25% drivetrain loss, that would put the sti at 225WHP and the evo at 218WHP, a 6th gen celcia all track only puts down 210WHP at 15psi and it has 270 hp (at 15psi, runs 14 psi stock at 260 hp)

[blakscorpion21]

the whp might be less i dont have the mag. on me now though. the z only has 287hp though an sti has 300 and the evo has 278 but is underrated. if the z put more power at the wheels and weighs about the same as an evo/sti then why is it slower? evo 0-60 4.7 ; z 0-60 5.4. dont get me wrong id take a z over an evo/sti anyday, twin turbo it 400hp.