'00 Accord: Interesting Transmission Discovery

[jklingman]

I know this post is long, but I'm hoping someone can confirm/deny what I've been told by Honda, and maybe it'll help you out as well!

Per the advice of an Acura technician friend of mine, I took my 2000 Accord EX-L to Honda about the auto transmission. I'm sure you've all heard/talked about the extended warranty, etc. My car has 96k on it, so I wanted to get it check out real quick before 100k.

For as long as I can remember, if you put the tranny into "2" and let go of the brake immediately, the car starts to go forward, but then suddenly jerks to a near-halt. If you do this on an upward hill (not too steep of one), the car will start to climb, but then you can feel the tranny do something, and it loses its grip after about 2 seconds, and either holds still or starts to roll backwards. My friend told me to definitely take it in because this was a sign that the tranny was slipping in 2nd gear.

The mechanic at Honda yesterday said, of course, "that's normal". He went on to explain that when you shift into 2nd, it's actually shifting into 3rd for a "smoother shift", then shifting into 2nd a few seconds later. I've NEVER heard that before, and it seem to be completely backwards from what's happening. If it does shift into 3rd, I would think it would start rolling backward first, then shift to 2nd and then start climbing the hill. Either way, I don't believe him, and it's just another cover-up so they don't have to do any free work.

MY POINT: Does anyone know if this is true or not? I encourage all you '98-'02 owners out there to try what I described above and see if your cars do it. If someone could report back to me so I can take these people to the cleaners, I'd appreciate it.

ALSO, if anyone has had success in forcing Honda into giving you a new tranny, please explain what yours was doing and how you showed them the problem, or if you used excessive force as a bargaining chip!

Thanks in advance, and sorry for the long post...just very frustrated here!

[BullShifter]

It sounds normal but without feeling it it's hard to say for sure. I was a service advisor at a Honda dealer and we had numerous complaints of cars rolling back on hills. 99% of the time it was NPF(no problem found) The trans is not meant to hold the car at idle, that's what brakes are for and if you need to move forward that's what the gas pedal is for.

If the 'problem' gets worse after the 100K warranty Honda can always go back to your complaint while it was in the warranty period.

[jklingman]

Originally Posted by jackasssi

It sounds normal but without feeling it it's hard to say for sure. I was a service advisor at a Honda dealer and we had numerous complaints of cars rolling back on hills. 99% of the time it was NPF(no problem found) The trans is not meant to hold the car at idle, that's what brakes are for and if you need to move forward that's what the gas pedal is for.

If the 'problem' gets worse after the 100K warranty Honda can always go back to your complaint while it was in the warranty period.

jackasssi, I'm not using the tranny to hold myself on hills. I know better than that. I was merely using it as an example of how the tranny (in my mind) was doing weird things. If I put it into 2 and then press the gas pedal (in snow for example), it starts to go, then the tranny feels like it slips out of gear for a second. That's when I decided to try the hill experiment to show the Honda tech that it was doing something odd.

[QK'SPD]

I have a 2000 Accord, I had a new trans put in 2yrs ago for free, they even paid for my rental. Look on the web for recalls. They did have a problem with tranmissions. Mine slipped in drive "D", it would slip out of grear beteen second and thrid. The key is, have then give you the number to the Honda Factory Rep. Or contact Honda America and tell them your story, they should have a Honda Rep contact you, the number is in the owners manual.

[StealthSonic]

I have the exact same problem; Skippy tranny, but I have a work around for it. Not sure that will work on your Accords.

When I go up hill and there's a stop sign, I just losen the gas pedal and than down shift from D4 to D3 and stop, than gently accel the gas and switch back to D4 when the car picks up speed. It works nicely since the shifter allows the driver to shift between D4 and D3 without having to press the shift knob. I use this alot, it feels sligtly like a BMW's slap stick.

Give that a try?

[jeffcoslacker]

I think I know exactly what you are talking about, that's always been a feature of Honda autos for as long as I can remember. There is that delayed "bump" after shifting to second from a standstill. Try going from Drive to 2 while sitting still, and feel what it does and watch the RPMs change after a few seconds. It's normal.

They have one of the only trannies I know of that will actually shift ranges while stopped.

I think what you are feeling is this.

You put the shifter in 2 then start to go right away. There is a delay, as I mentioned, in that shift when made from a stop. It takes a second or two.

What's happening is you are taking off right away, so it is still in first (because you were stopped) You start to go, actually still in first. Then it suddenly completes the range shift to second. That is the jerk you feel. Then it feels like it is slipping, because it is now in too high a gear range for the speed you are going (just beginning to move, should be in first).

This feels like a slip, but it is actually engaged, it's just very sloppy and mushy because the range is too high. The "second gear hold" feature is included on some trannies (Ford has it too) to aid traction in slippery conditions where the torque applied by first gear starts would cause wheel spin.

It is to be used, for example, if you were sitting on snow, at a stop sign at the top of a hill. If you take off normally, you'll spin the tires, and go backwards down the hill. Select the second gear hold, and it takes off much slower, without wheelspin due to the overly high gear range. Try it.

You just aren't allowing time for the shift. Put it in second, wait 'till you feel the "bump" as it shifts ranges, then go. You'll take off slowly, but more sure-footed in slick conditions.

Anyway, that delay is normal. They've always been like that. It's a Honda hallmark.

[jeffcoslacker]

PS, you will roll backwards from a stop in second with no throttle applied. Your engine is below stall speed for the torque convertor,, and the small amount of power transmitted to the tranny isn't enough to hold the car from rolling. First gear, by comparison, has more torque, even near stall speed, so is able to hold the car in most circumstances.

The part about shifting to third for smoother transitioning is wrong, hate to say. It is simply finding the second gear range. Read your manual and it will explain the proper use of the second gear hold.

[jeffcoslacker]

The old ones would make a weird little "scuff" sound as they hit second when shifted to second at a standstill. Let me know if they still do. I always got a kick outta that, for some reason...I'm easily entertained

[aric3320]

I have a question about stall speed. I own a 00'AV6 with 170k on it. when i do a stall preed test it gets up to 2,300 rpms and at sea level up to 2,500 rpms. this seems kinda high to me.

any info would be nice

[AccordCodger]

Don't hijack threads. Your topic is different.