B18c5 Vs K20

[Gipergon]

Acura integra B18c5 vs RSX Type S !

Which One You Want in Your Civic and Which One You Think Worth $$$ ?

[CivicSpoon]

Both too expensive. You could buy a b16a and build it up for the same price as either of those; and have more power.

[95whitehb]

both would be worth the money, if you have that much money to spend, the rsx-s swap would be especially expensive. both could be built tons for N/A or FI... depending on what you want. i dont know what kind of civic you have; but to give you an idea, if u put the type r into an EG, it'll run mid to high 13's; the rsx-s in an EG will run mid-high 12's; all depending on the driver of course. obviously an EK hatch, or coupes are going to be slower b/c they are heavier. but both those (depending on your model of civ.) could beat NA built b16's and turbo'd ninja's w/a good driver. i dont kno if u plan on doing the swap yourself or not; but to have a shop do the rsx-s swap it will probably run 7-9k (for everything, labor, parts, full swap...blah blah blah) depending on what civ. u have; the type r swap some where around 4-6k(everything again). these are rough estimates. the shop i talked to about a k-series said he'd do it for 7k and wouldnt go over, but i know him pretty well, so idk. hope that helps.

[iVteC_PoWeR]

I didn't know you could hit 12s with a rsx-s motor in a civic. The K series is that good? I guess theres a reason for that price for it.

[95whitehb]

yea, u can !! lol, but only w/the cx and vx - or lightened up EG hatch's. i'm not sure about other model civics....???? that would sure be kool hey.

[jcrx]

This thread makes my head hurt.

K20A is more expensive because A) primarily because it is a newer motor B) a more technologically advanced motor. Motor retailers don't give a shit what it does in the quarter mile, and don't base prices off it. Swapping a K series in can run upwards of $6000+ after mounts, custom header, and wiring harness. Both motors will run very comparible 1/4 mile times
If that's all you're interested in, go with an H22A for half the price, or a swap in a B16A, boost it.

[95whitehb]

Originally Posted by jcrx

K20A is more expensive because A) primarily because it is a newer motor B) a more technologically advanced motor. Motor retailers don't give a shit what it does in the quarter mile, and don't base prices off it. Swapping a K series in can run upwards of $6000+ after mounts, custom header, and wiring harness. Both motors will run very comparible 1/4 mile times
If that's all you're interested in, go with an H22A for half the price, or a swap in a B16A, boost it.

very true on why its expensive, although, an h22 will run about 4-6k b/c of all the custom work involved. the only problem in h22 and b16 swap is... when you want a new motor, there is a very low re-sale for both of those ^. no one wants an h22, and everyone has a b16.... the itr and k will have a higher re-sale value. however, it'd be much cheaper to boost a b16... and if you have the money, can easily run 10's and be streetable.

[jcrx]

Originally Posted by 95whitehb

very true on why its expensive, although, an h22 will run about 4-6k b/c of all the custom work involved. the only problem in h22 and b16 swap is... when you want a new motor, there is a very low re-sale for both of those ^. no one wants an h22, and everyone has a b16.... the itr and k will have a higher re-sale value. however, it'd be much cheaper to boost a b16... and if you have the money, can easily run 10's and be streetable.

I want you to show me two things. How to hit 10's easy in a B16A, and a streetable 10 second B16A powered Civic.

For an H swap you need mounts ( can be bought for under $300), other than that you can make the harness/axle/shifter mods, so where are the hidden cost that equal 4-6G's?

[CivicSpoon]

Originally Posted by jcrx

For an H swap you need mounts ( can be bought for under $300), other than that you can make the harness/axle/shifter mods, so where are the hidden cost that equal 4-6G's?

I see what you're saying, but the things do add up. With the mount kits that are under $300 (like e-bay mounts), I've never read a good review of them. But just because I've only read bad reviews doesn't make them all bad, but I'd never go the cheap way on something that's holding the engine into engine bay. Wiring and shifter can be used from either the stock or what comes in the kit, but you have to get axles from some place. Civic and prelude ones won't work, so that's a little $ (assuming you get $ back from the lude or civic axle cores when buying new ones). Then maintenance stuff like clutch/flywheel, belts, hoses, oil/filter, plugs, etc (obviously all stuff you'd need for any swap). But then you need shocks and springs or coilovers and a fuel pump for lower end cars (5th gen CX or VX's). So all of that might be say roughly $3,400 (including shipping charges for the engine, since most people aren't lucky enough to have an engine suplier right near them). Not quite $4g's but fairly close. Then if you decide to upgrade parts (stage # clutch and lightened flywheel, exhaust manifold, exhaust [stock Civic exhaust sucks], thinner fan). But all those aren't needed, just added stuff. But you've got to think about the people who won't do the swap themselves. I've heard of shops charging over a grand to do the swap. So someone who is going to have a shop do the swap for them and/or add upgraded parts; the cost could definently fall into the $4-6G range easily.

[95whitehb]

Originally Posted by CivicSpoon

I see what you're saying, but the things do add up. With the mount kits that are under $300 (like e-bay mounts), I've never read a good review of them. But just because I've only read bad reviews doesn't make them all bad, but I'd never go the cheap way on something that's holding the engine into engine bay. Wiring and shifter can be used from either the stock or what comes in the kit, but you have to get axles from some place. Civic and prelude ones won't work, so that's a little $ (assuming you get $ back from the lude or civic axle cores when buying new ones). Then maintenance stuff like clutch/flywheel, belts, hoses, oil/filter, plugs, etc (obviously all stuff you'd need for any swap). But then you need shocks and springs or coilovers and a fuel pump for lower end cars (5th gen CX or VX's). So all of that might be say roughly $3,400 (including shipping charges for the engine, since most people aren't lucky enough to have an engine suplier right near them). Not quite $4g's but fairly close. Then if you decide to upgrade parts (stage # clutch and lightened flywheel, exhaust manifold, exhaust [stock Civic exhaust sucks], thinner fan). But all those aren't needed, just added stuff. But you've got to think about the people who won't do the swap themselves. I've heard of shops charging over a grand to do the swap. So someone who is going to have a shop do the swap for them and/or add upgraded parts; the cost could definently fall into the $4-6G range easily.

thanks for saying it, i didn't really want to type all that
and yea, with a boosted b16a, AND enough money, you can have a car that runs 10's and is streetable.... there has been a couple people around where i live that have done it. mighty fine motor building i'd say!

[jcrx]

Originally Posted by 95whitehb

thanks for saying it, i didn't really want to type all that
and yea, with a boosted b16a, AND enough money, you can have a car that runs 10's and is streetable.... there has been a couple people around where i live that have done it. mighty fine motor building i'd say!

Really, show me some timeslips and then prove they are daily driven. Sorry dude, but this ain't the movies. Race gas and slicks = not daily.

For axles on an H22/Civic you use the inner joint from the H and the outter from teh Civic, easy, maintainance and parts are a cost on any motor, H doesn't make a difference nor does it if someone wants to get raped by a shop to do it FOr the mounts you can go the cheap Egay route, or you could find some online from someone getting rid of a project, or not starting one they planned, you gotta look, but it's out there.

[BlazeD0ut06]

Originally Posted by jcrx

This thread makes my head hurt.

K20A is more expensive because A) primarily because it is a newer motor B) a more technologically advanced motor. Motor retailers don't give a shit what it does in the quarter mile, and don't base prices off it. Swapping a K series in can run upwards of $6000+ after mounts, custom header, and wiring harness. Both motors will run very comparible 1/4 mile times
If that's all you're interested in, go with an H22A for half the price, or a swap in a B16A, boost it.

lol i agree that threads like this are annoying as hell..but every1 needs answers..

i disagree with u on the part about getting the h22 for half the cost..
u can get a h22 swap for 2 g's but after alls said and done with the parts and all u will be spending close to if not over 4 g's...
i know people that have done it and the costs will amount to that much...

i would say for that price u can get a gsr dropped in..for about a few hundred more u can drop the c5..
but the k20 is way more than all of these..for the reasons that u mentioned...

for the threadstarter..if money is not an object drop the k20 because that will be the future of swaps...
but other wise i would drop the c5..because after all that is a hand made motor from honda and i personally think its hella sexy..
but if u have plans of eventually going turbo then forget the c5 and get the c1..

[jcrx]

Originally Posted by BlazeD0ut06

i disagree with u on the part about getting the h22 for half the cost..
u can get a h22 swap for 2 g's but after alls said and done with the parts and all u will be spending close to if not over 4 g's...
i know people that have done it and the costs will amount to that much...

I know a few people that have as well, now if someone could please show me this mysterious $2000 extra dollars I'd be appreciative.

Complete H22A swap $2200
Brand new mounts from HAsport $600
Spal slimfan brand new $149 (or just trim the shroud on OEM one)
Brand new custom hybrid axles $349 w/halfshaft (or you can make your own by using the Prelude axle with the Civic outer joint)

This is buying everything brand new, and stuff you just don't need, for $3298, of course if you're buying axles and only need the motor,, tranny, ECU, and shift cbales, the price is about 200 less. And if you decide to buy it from HMO, you can get the HAsport mounts with it for only $450, so subract another $150 to $3148, which is pratically the same cost of a GSR swap and 30 more Hp and 35lbs-ft more torque.

IMO, it's almost always better to go B series, especially if it is a first time swap, as far as ease goes. Every swap, including a same motor replacement is going to have extra cost, shipping, shop time (or someone doing it for you), oil, coolant, tools, time, oh shit something broke, oh noes mah clutch is shit gotta replace it, whatever.

[95whitehb]

if you scoll up ^^^CIVICSPOON already showed you the where "the hidden costs" are.
and no, i dont have timeslips, the car's weren't mine, and no they did not run on race gas, and no, they didn't don slicks everyday.... i never said they ran tens on the street, i said they ran tens and were streetable- there is a complete difference. you wouldn't run that high of boost for daily driving. and no, just in case you were going to ask, i'm not sure how the motors were built, or what turbo & setup were used; i'm not a "turbo expert" but i know it can be done b/c i've seen it done.
and, sorry if i'm being rude, would you drop the nonsense about the h22 being cheap; its not cheap. besides the point- the kid never asked about an h22- he asked about a k20 vs an itr motor.

[BlazeD0ut06]

everythin that u get on a swap if now guranteed or warrantied..
things like alt dist starter can go bad sitting around..when ur doing a swap the costs are never str8 forward...u'll end up spending more..
also ur assuming that ur doing the swap urself..every1 is not so mechanically inclined to do an engine swap so they might have some shop put it in..
believe me the costs add up..
putting a h22 in 6th gen ur looking at 4000..give or take..