Sister's Saturn wont start! Need help!!

[theothermac]

Hey All....I'm not a Saturn owner but my sister's just died (it has died before, hot or cold, just sitting at a stop light...dies.) Anyways, this time it will NOT start back up. It turns over fine, but wont start. Haven't had time to check for spark or anything, did do the paperclip thing and only got the code 12, nothing else. It looks like it has a new EGR valve, plug wires don't "look" bad. She did tell me that one of her sons put some heavier oil in it (it burns some oil) and I just read where the wrong viscosity oil can cause stalls??? Is this true? What do I need to look at first. There IS a prob with the ignition switch...sometimes very hard to turn the key on...not sure if there is a switch inside there keeping it from starting or not.

Thanks for any help!!!

Not sure what model it is...Small 4-door sedan, has the DOHC 4 in it. Sorry for being so vague...

[mysatilac]

Lots of things can cause a no start,
Check for spark,
and check the ECTS, it is known for going bad and an older saturn like hers probably has a bad one that could be causing the problem, you can use a multimeter to check the resistance of the ECT (you can find the correct readings by searching for "ECT IAT resistances" in the SC/SL/SW forum)
If you dont have a multimeter, You can pull the ECTS out and check it good for cracks, but have quick hands and cover the hole it comes out of, cause you can lose alot of coolant if you dont,
If its cracked or the reading is wrong, get a new one from saturnparts.com or a dealership, it'll cost you about ~13 bucks in all,

Check all the fuses, especially the INJ fuse

If neither of the above helps, check for fuel at the fuel rail, and check the air intake and TB for obstruction
Repost after these checks

[sierrap615]

how offen does it die?

what you need to look for for a no start
1. air
2. fuel
3. spark
4. compression
5. exhaust

99% of the time is one of those

inspect what you can, then get back to us.

[theothermac]

ECTS...Engine Coolant Temp Sensor?? I would assume on top of the engine somewhere..I did look at a pic of one on the advance auto parts site...I didn't see any wire connectors to check?? and didn't find the specs on here. THANKS!!!!

[mysatilac]

Did you check for spark yet? (thats the main suspect IMO, then check for fuel at the fuel rail)
Yes, the engine coolant temp sensor, it is on the block just below the top radiator hose where it connects to the block, it has black and yellow wires runnin to it, on the side of the engine
Went and snapped a couple of pictures for you

Originally Posted by mysatilac

Here are the resistances for the ECTS or IAT in various tempertures
-20 degrees F________39K-53K OHMs
0 degrees F__________21K-27K OHMs
60 degrees F_________3.9K-4.5K OHMs
120 degrees F________1.0K-1.1K OHMs
160 degrees F________430-480 OHMs
200 degrees F________215-235 OHMs

Take off the little wire clip by sqeezing it with your fingers first, then if you can't get it after a few tries, use a small pair of pliers, Take a good look at it, you squeeze on the sides opposite the little hooks (hard to explain, easy to do)
Then use a multimeter to probe for the resistances, its kinda difficult to get both probes in there to check, if you give up on it, you can pull the ECT out and probe it like that (but thats messy, you lose coolant)
Follow sierrap's suggestions though, I do

DONT BUT AN ECTS FROM ANYWHERE BUT SATURNPARTS.COM OR A SATURN DEALERSHIP, THE ONE AT AUTO PART STORES IS A PLASTIC COMPOSITE INSTEAD OF THE BRASS TIPPED ONE, WHICH IS WHY YOU HAVE THE PROBLEM, Saturn redesigned them into an all brass version that holds up in the hot coolant, the black tip on the one you looked at is a dead give away that its the plastic one,
this should be the new brass tipped one

Originally Posted by sierrap615

how offen does it die?

what you need to look for for a no start
1. air
2. fuel
3. spark
4. compression
5. exhaust

99% of the time is one of those

inspect what you can, then get back to us.

1. air- check for obstructions in the intake, including the air filter
2. fuel- check for fuel at the fuel rail using the pressure valve (looks like a valve stem), turn the key to the on position not start, then turn it back off and press the valve to see if fuel squirts out (use a rag)
3. spark- many ways to test, hold the plug wire close to the block and look for a spark when you crank
4. compression- do a compression test, using a compression tester with a spark plug hole adapter
5. exhaust- take out the O2 sensor and try to start

[theothermac]

Thanks SO much for the info. I really appreciate the pics too. I am going after work today to check for spark, fuel and test the ECTS. Will let you know what I find....again, THANKS!

[mysatilac]

Not a problem, hope it works out for the best

[theothermac]

Ended up being the fuel pump. We put one in and she's been going fine since. Thanks for the help. I know where to go now if she has any further probs with her Saturn!