RWD entry-level luxury-sport sedan comparo

[kman10587]

Here's a five-way comparo between entry-level front-engine, rear-wheel-drive sedans from luxury brands. The cars must meet these criteria:

- Must be a 2005 model.
- Must be from a luxury brand.
- Must be front-engine (front-midship counts) and rear-wheel-drive.
- Must have a manual transmission.
- Must be a sedan.
- Must be an entry-level model.
- Must cost between $30,000 and $40,000.

The five competitors I found that meet these criteria are the Cadillac CTS 3.6L, the BMW 330i, the Mercedes-Benz C320 Sport, the Lexus IS 300, and the Infiniti G35. The question is, which one of these would you buy if you had the money, and why? This means take into account the price of the vehicle as well.

I really love the IS 300: the crisp styling, the beautiful handling, and the excellent Lexus customer service make it a great choice for any luxury buyer. However, Lexus doesn't seem very motivated to making the car perform as well as it should. It's very difficult to find manual transmission-equipped IS 300's at the Lexus dealerships, and for 2005, you can't even get an LSD with the manual transmission. It's too bad, because the 2JZ-GE is a great motor and the IS 300's suspension and chassis are top-notch in my book.

So, I voted for the G35. It's the most powerful of the bunch, the styling is pretty nice, the reliability is rock solid, and the handling is razor sharp (95% of a 330i is what they say). Why I didn't pick the others...the Cadillac seems like a excellent car to bring Cadillac up to modern standards as a legitimate luxury brand. But it still seems a little bit too rough around the edges, mainly in the engine and suspension department. It's a little too large for my tastes, as well. The C320 is a joke, in my opinion. It's a decent luxury car, I suppose, but any attempt it makes to be sporty falls flat on its face. The engine is a big yawn, the transmission is unworthy of a sports sedan, and the body roll is excessive.

The 330i is, well, a BMW. It's beautifully engineered, extremely quick, and a blast to drive. However, it's also the most expensive car in this test (with some common options, they can top 38K), and I have a bad feeling that a good portion of that money is going towards the badge on the hood. Also, BMW customer support is pretty piss-poor in my experience. They are haughty, rude, and uncaring. It's as if being the best for so long has gone to their heads, and they've forgotten about what made them the best: the customers who bought their products.

Edmunds.com stats/feature content here

[drunken monkey]

what?
330i?
the top 3 series bar the M car is an entry level car?

[kman10587]

Here in America, it's BMW's entry-level car. I picked the top trim level because it's the most evenly matched to the rest in power and performance. I could have picked the 325i, and then the price would have been more in line with the rest, but it would have been outperformed pretty badly.

[gti1689]

G-3-5

There have been alot of threads about this topic, so see my reasoning there. I don't feel like typing up another long post.

[drunken monkey]

the 330i is quite a bit faster than the is300 and c320.
the 0-62 for the 330i is around 6.5secs and costs from £30,000
the C320 does the 0-62 in around 7.7 and costs from £25,000
the IS300 does the 0-62 in around 8.2, costs around £27,000 and i'm not sure if we ever got the manual 'box with the 300.

as you can see, the 330i is faster and costs more.
the 325i se does the 0-62 in 7.3 and costs £27,500 and the 320i does 0-62 in 8.3 and costs £24,000.
(numbers come from car magazine)

the really interesting one in the listings is the 330D same numbers as the 325 except that it has a much greater torque than even the M3 which means the 330i that beat you at the lights won't be able to keep up with you on motorways/overtaking situations.
AND 42mpg.

[SuperHighOutput]

I'll take the CTS. It looks great, the price is right, It performs more than well enough for my needs, and it has Cadillac reliability. My second choice would have to be the G35, it's just a great all around car.

[crayzayjay]

Originally Posted by drunken monkey

the really interesting one in the listings is the 330D same numbers as the 325 except that it has a much greater torque than even the M3 which means the 330i that beat you at the lights won't be able to keep up with you on motorways/overtaking situations.
AND 42mpg.

I can sense you're getting excited there, so i hate to break it to you mate, but they didn't make any Lotus diesels


As for the comparo, well, this one has been done a few times. However, '2005 model' implies that you're talking about the E90 BMW rather than the E46, as the new 3 is now on sale in the US and Europe (afaik).

And yes, the new 3 would definitely be my choice out of the cars listed in the poll (despite that bland rear end).

[kman10587]

The E90 is technically a 2006 model, so no, I'm talking about the E46. I realize that this comparo has been done before, but not with parameters as specific as mine. Also, many of the models have been changed or updated for 2005, so I think it warrants a new comparison. If not, go ahead and lock it.

[Jimster]

Definitely not the Cadillac CTS 3.6, the Alloytec engine from GM is a HUGE disappointment IMHO, it sounds crass when compared to the old 3.8 Pushrod lump, maybe it's just because it's a new engine and it'll improve over time, but I expected better given the specs and technology in the engine. At least it handles well, because the Interior plastics are typically crap GM stuff and there's bugger all space in the back.

Certainly not the IS300 either, while the chassis is better balanced than the E46, electronics completely kill the fun and put it behind the E46. It looks good, has a good engine but is let down by the Automatic, though a manual is available stateside so that doesn't really matter. I will always think of it as a 3 series clone though, a testament to a time when the Japanese simply copied the Europeans.

C320 is too much of a luxury car, more so than a sports sedan. It has a fantastic looking interior, it also looks the best of all these cars, but the engine and handling don't exactly scream at you that they want to come out and play. Maybe Mercedes'll take note from the fantastic SLK?

G35 is next to get the chop, an improvement over the AWFUL Skyline (No I'm not including the GTR, before you fanboys start bawling), but I myself find it rather ugly. At least it's comfy, reliable and has the fantastic VQ35 and a good transmission, handles well etc.

Which leaves the 330i, is everything the Z is except handsome and crisp (This is the E46 and not the E90 right?), still the benchmark in handling, has the legendary BMW reliabilty and is easy to work on. Though, I'd wait for the E90 myself, with the scorching new 3.0 I6 and even better chassis.

So my list'd go:
5. CTS
4. C320
3. IS300
2. G35
1. 330i

[drunken monkey]

.....not that excited.....
but the BMW diesels are really interesting bits of kit;
that 3.0 litre thing in the new 535d is amazing (413lb/ft!)
personally, i'm waiting to see what honda can pull out as a 2nd gen diesel engine if they ever do....

anyway.
i saw a new 3 on the road to southend yesterday. it might've been one on a test drive from the showroom on the A127 so i guess that means the first cars are in the uk?
personally, being a man of fine taste and being possessed of a head that isn't always firmly screwed on (did i really think of buying a £250 mini cos it'd be a laugh?), i'd find it hard for any of the cars listed to tempt me away from an alfa 156 GTA.
i know it's front drive but i've seen delivery milage cars for £22,000..... verrry tempting.

heck, what am i saying.
i can't afford any of these.
that's why i'm looking at ancient second hand cars....
variable valve timing?
double vanos?
what evil trickery is this?
Twin Cam! yeah! grrr.........

[porscheguy9999]

I heard Alfa's are not very good. The 156 looks sweet, but do they run well? And isn't it's main competitor the BMW 3? I don't know much about Alfa Romeo's since they don't sell them in the US (I wish they would).

[drunken monkey]

well.... the 156 is a mid-sized, four door family saloon car with a good range of engines, decent boot space, high quality materials inside (they have wonderful leather interiors if you tick that box) and out and the 'occasional' electrical gremlin.
i haven't heard of anything falling off them in ages.
(unless you are called michael and drive a battered 145 in which case you deserve it)

in that sense, any mid-sized four door family saloon is a competitor.

but really, like most cars italian, there isn't really anything else like it on the roads.
you could say that there are better looking cars but in most cases, nothing comes close in terms of road presence but this could just be the relative rarity of them, even in the uk.
when a bright red 156 comes along on them telephone dial alloys of theres, it's like the clouds part to make way for it.

i really don't think there's anything for £20,000-25,000 that can draw me away from a 156 GTA if i was looking for that kind of car and you'd struggle to find a car better equiped for a similar price.
which puts the mazda RX-8 in a strange place for me.
it offers pretty much the same as the 156 GTA except it isn't built as well as the alfa, not as high-quality, doesn't have an engine to match it (but i guess they're both very different: whiney 1.3 twin rotary vs bellowing 3.2 V6) and while it might look more like a sports car, it doesn't look as good.

and y'know what?
i never knew that alfas weren't available in the U.S.

sorry for bastardising the thread....

[kman10587]

Nope, we haven't had Alfas in the U.S. for a while. The closest thing we have to a FWD luxury-sports sedan is probably the Saab 9-3 Turbo, or maybe the Volvo S60 T5.

[DinanM3_S2]

Originally Posted by kman10587

Nope, we haven't had Alfas in the U.S. for a while. The closest thing we have to a FWD luxury-sports sedan is probably the Saab 9-3 Turbo, or maybe the Volvo S60 T5.

Well we also have the Acura TSX and TL

[kman10587]

Oh yeah, I forgot about the TSX. That's definitely a sporty-feeling car.