McLaren Modified for top speed test

[TheRedOctober]

I was under the impression that nothing out of the ordinary was done to XP5 at Ehra-Lessien. It was common knowledge that the car was in standard production trim , and the only remaining differences were the increase in the rev-limiter and the polish on it's underbody. I recieved some pictures which contradcit this, and it seemed this was not in the spirit of the top speed test as the picture shows the car is modified. Apparently the windshield wiper was taken off, as well as the front panel gaps being taped over and the marker lights being taped as well. Can anyone share some insight on this. McLaren have always claimed otherwise.

[Peloton25]

You're a little late on this one:

Originally Posted by Peloton25

Sorry Gustav, the mirrors were firmly attached that day:



Now in this photo, you can see that both the shut line around the front compartment and the turn signal indentations appear to have both been covered over with clear tape.



A keen eye would also notice that the windscreen wiper has been removed, and I suspect that front license plate is really a sticker, and not a true hard plate.

Here's another close-up shot of the car from that day. The tape has been removed at this point, but the windscreen wiper is still missing and you can more clearly see what I mean about the plate being a sticker.

Taken from here:
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...1&postcount=21


Personally I don't really care one way or the other. The F1s speed record is but a footnote in it's incredible history and not really something to get all wrapped up in as far as I am concerned.

>8^)
ER

[Peloton25]

You're a little late on this one:

Originally Posted by Peloton25

Sorry Gustav, the mirrors were firmly attached that day:



Now in this photo, you can see that both the shut line around the front compartment and the turn signal indentations appear to have both been covered over with clear tape.



A keen eye would also notice that the windscreen wiper has been removed, and I suspect that front license plate is really a sticker, and not a true hard plate.

Here's another close-up shot of the car from that day. The tape has been removed at this point, but the windscreen wiper is still missing and you can more clearly see what I mean about the plate being a sticker.

Taken from here:
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...1&postcount=21


Personally I don't really care one way or the other. The F1s speed record is but a footnote in the history of an incredible automobile and not really something to get all wrapped up in as far as I am concerned.

>8^)
ER

[_RicH_24]

minor differences realy.. but look at the quarter-window thingy behind door window, its curved at the corner?

[TheRedOctober]

Thanks for the reply. I am not hung up on it, and as we all know it was just another stepping stone into the history book, and provided further recognition with the non-enthusiast. However me personally being a McLaren enthusiast, it skews my view of this event slightly. We have come to take McLarens word as truth or near truth when it comes to the F1. However insignificant the taping of shutlines and panel gaps along with lights may be in the reality of things, it is still a dissapointment to learn that McLaren repeatedly published the event with the car having "nothing" done to it to increase it's aerodynamic efficencies. It is a minor detail yes, but it was purposefully left out because that was not the PR they were looking for. The car was modified to be more aerodynamic plain and simple. Miniscule compared to what other manufacturers have done to make their claims, yes, but the "spirit" of the event seems to have diminished a little. Just as an example, if the F1 that was tested by Autocar for performance #'s was found out to be fitted with a special lightweight battery, smaller and lighter brake rotors and 1/4 tank of gas and other small tricks contributing to less overall weight would we think differently of the accomplishment? I think not, and at the moment just playing Devils Advocate. It is just these little nuances between what is stated and what is actual that annoys me. I do not take it personal though, just as a minor detail that grew into an interest of finding the truth.

[amanichen]

Originally Posted by TheRedOctober

Miniscule compared to what other manufacturers have done to make their claims, yes, but the "spirit" of the event seems to have diminished a little.

I don't think any manufacturer has ever been totally "honest" about the conditions of their internally-performed testing.

In another thread I stated that you can't compare two test numbers unless the method and circumstances behind both are thoroughly documented, which doesn't necessarily disqualify results, but it makes them less comparable with one another.

Anyway, so far we know that the F1 is capable of going faster than the 231 mph set by XP3 (albeit with greatly increased wear on some of the transmission) so I wonder if any other manufacturers will do a "rev limiter disabled"-style test.

[F1 monster]

TheRedOctober--well said, probably the best post on the matter!

Rich_24, I suspect that is a light/shadow effect, or a JPEG effect, or some computer/camera artefact. Can't really see any aerodynamic advantage gain from rounding that out...regardless of what it is, brilliantly spotted.

Edit, since it is XP5, it may have been McLaren's trying out different window treatments to subtly alter the car's lines--I am only speculating here, but I would venture that the only thing it affects are the aesthetics (and those too, in a very minor way).

Mr. Bernoulli, Amanichen, anyone else--any info, other guesses?

[amanichen]

Originally Posted by _RicH_24

minor differences realy.. but look at the quarter-window thingy behind door window, its curved at the corner?

It looks like a light and shadow effect which makes the curve look more prounounced than it really is.

Here's a shot of a very-familiar road car from a similar angle:

http://s94779296.onlinehome.us/sdff113.jpg

Both windows have a curve there, but the shadowing is different on it.

[_RicH_24]

never noticed that curve before.. strange :P

[Mclaren240!]

Err i still cant spot it can somebody higlight it for me?

In trut all manufactures fiddle these things if you look real cloose in driving ambition you can see the tape i comented on the tape befor Peloton whe did you get those shots from first? The windscreen wiper may have been a safty thing and remember Mclaren did go with a lowere read out which they didnt have two. A standard english numberplate would be bloody dangerious they are enormous and being positioned where it is i should imagen it would bugger the underbody aerodynamichs compleatily stickes can legally be used i thing and the T&C pics seam to show a car fited with motercicle or very undercised frount plate. Its still more standard than any outher record car since the F40.

[ArchangelGTR]

General Motors is notorious for this practice. They would send a mule to the magazines which in more than one way had more capabilities than normal production models in order to give it better ratings (0-60mph, HP, braking, top speed, etc.)

Ford did it with their last gen Mustang. So many owners complained that the actual production models made 20-30 HP less than what the factory claimed.

Even Mazda was guity of this with the RX8.

And a lot of manufacturers in the past would present their engine HP rating without accessories such as A/C belts, nor steering pump belts attached which untied a higher HP number... in some cases 10-15 extra HP.

Is it right?.. Well granted it is a bit dissapointing. But do we go with the official record of 231 or do we, Mac enthusiasts just look with smugness knowing that the Mac is really capable of 241.

Forget who originally said it.. but "Records are meant to be broken." And some how .. some way.. a company is going to try and break it.

[amanichen]

Originally Posted by ArchangelGTR

Is it right?.. Well granted it is a bit dissapointing. But do we go with the official record of 231 or do we, Mac enthusiasts just look with smugness knowing that the Mac is really capable of 241.

I'd say it's safe to say that the Koenigsegg CCR in stock form is faster than a F1 in stock form. The 240mph is done under conditions which a standard roadgoing F1 would not experience due to wear on one of the drivetrain components.

And, I'm led to believe that customer F1s are limited to 220mph. A couple magazine tests as well as anecdotal evidence from the German owner on Pistonheads seem to support this as none of the cars went beyond 220mph. I think the German owner even mentioned asking McLaren to raise the limiter on his car after it only hit 220, and they refused.

It took 12 years and 180 more hp than the F1 in order to barely edge out the previous speed record (what was that about the Koenigsegg having a lower drag coefficient? ) and I think that's proof that even today the F1 is a solid design.

[F1 monster]

Originally Posted by amanichen

It took 12 years and 180 more hp than the F1 in order to barely edge out the previous speed record (what was that about the Koenigsegg having a lower drag coefficient? )

That's something I have been wondering about too...once the Konigsegg has been federalized, perhaps some high speed runs on the Salt Flats (and hopefully not changed too much from its current form) will allow it to reach a higher speed.

[Mclaren240!]

What is it exactily that wrong with the gearbox and where does the ware thing come from i know the temp went very high but have herd nothing about ware except for at lemans.


220mph limit.... I have to agree seams likley how you mention it though im upset by that herd a story of a delivery driver doing that in the UK! The piston heads owner wanted them to remove the rev limiter and they wouldent as i recall. Intresting my fave XJ220 dosent look to shabby after all!!!!

And what the hell are you all talking about with that window can someone ring it for me looks totally standard to me am i gong nuts?

[_RicH_24]

its the area where the gas cap is on the other side.

it is standard.. its just reflecting funny so it looked like black plastic rather then part of the car bodypanel. ignore me