96 integra turbo question

[dbon-turboteg]

Ok... I have a 96 integra ls that I'm about to put a custom turbo kit on. It's a t3/t4 turbo, intercooled, 10:1 fmu and an HKS AFR. I've put the kit on before and I blew the last engine b/c I didn't have a an AFR. This time I plan on putting on an AFR and I'd like to run about 8 psi of boost, afterward I'll be dyno-tuning it. I don't want to get into internals quite yet so... Does anyone have any suggestions on what else I should do to make sure that I don't blow up this engine? What has worked for you guys? If you can help me out I'd really appreciate it. THX

[civickiller]

what is an hks afr, does it control timing ?

[dbon-turboteg]

An HKS AFR is an "air-fuel regulator" made by HKS. It controls the air fuel ratio

[CivicSpoon]

"The AFR was designed for vehicles that are lightly tuned (intake, exhaust system, etc.) and need only slight fuel adjustment." Straight from HKS' website.

You'd be better off with even a Apexi AFC than the HKS AFR, with a turbo. Turbo is far more than a lightly tuned modification. You should also have bigger injectors than the stock ones to make sure you don't run too lean. But personally I'd say get Hondata, it will cost quite a bit more but it will be worth it.

[civickiller]

you should get something that can control timing too, like hondata

[Schister66]

The last engine you had...did it die due to detonation or pre-ignition? The solution depends on why the last engine failed. If it is pre-ignition, then CivicSpoon is right, to lean of a fuel/air mix burned a hole in the top of a piston. But really what was wrong w/ it??

[97CivicX]

tell us what exactly went wrong with the other engine and we might be better able to help you. i'd say right now ditch the hole fmu route and get something electronic. afc works, converting to obdI and running hondata/uberdata is even better. almost all of the time its the tune that blows the engine, not the parts

[dbon-turboteg]

ok.... what happened with the last engine is that it I didn't tune it at all... just went with the stock. I'm not 100% sure what happened (whether it was too lean or what), but the second piston doesn't build up compression like the other ones now. I'm guessing that since I didn't tune it and I used the stock injectors that it went lean and fried the ring -- maybe because of an injector failure. I haven't opened up the other engine to check it out yet.

I bought some 440cc RC injectors, so I've got the injector problem covered. I had heard that if all I wanted to do was put the boost at 8 psi then the HKS AFR should be able to do that. So what do you guys think? It sounds like that's not right. I don't want to blow this engine, so what would be the best thing to install to manage the fuel/air ratio...(and timing?) Any comment is definitely welcomed. Thanks for your help.

[civickiller]

first of all you probably broke the ringlands, fried the piston rings, f&f style right there.

and since you didnt tune it, it would have gone lean and of course you would blow your motor. and it wasnt injector failure, its trying to run a turbo on an stock untuned injectors.

if you wanna run the hks thing then at least get an msd btm so it can retard some timing for you under boost.

[dbon-turboteg]

Originally Posted by civickiller

first of all you probably broke the ringlands, fried the piston rings, f&f style right there.

and since you didnt tune it, it would have gone lean and of course you would blow your motor. and it wasnt injector failure, its trying to run a turbo on an stock untuned injectors.

if you wanna run the hks thing then at least get an msd btm so it can retard some timing for you under boost.

I'm a little bit ignorant as to why I need to retard the timing... what does that do? When I put the turbo in the first time I researched that the ls engine could handle 7 lbs under stock conditions... even the injectors. But that was what I read and heard, after I blew the engine I learned that you need the control the fuel/air ratio, but I hadn't heard anything about retarding the timing. I'm interested to hear more.

[Schister66]

Your last engine detonated and that is why you broke the ringlands. If you don't retard the timing, the cylinder will fire when the piston is about 10 degrees before TDC (correct me if i'm wrong) and that is the perfect time so the gases are expanding just as the piston passes over TDC. If you don't retard the timing, you'll have incomplete burn...or is it that it will fire before TDC....i can't remember!!! Someone pick up where i left off.

[dbon-turboteg]

Well, I did some research on retarding the timing and what you're saying makes sense. So I'm planning on getting a msd 6btm... how should I retard the timing with that? Is the degree based on the amount of boost you want or is it based on something else? I need your guys' help so I don't blow another motor, so please any comment would be nice.

[casperGSR]

ignition timing is changed based on load and rpm... as you initially accelerate the timing advances, now as far as how much it advances is then determined by the load in relation to the rpm... now I know with my ignition map I hit a certain point on my map where my ignition will stop advancing and begin to retard a bit due to the boost.

[dbon-turboteg]

Originally Posted by casperGSR

ignition timing is changed based on load and rpm... as you initially accelerate the timing advances, now as far as how much it advances is then determined by the load in relation to the rpm... now I know with my ignition map I hit a certain point on my map where my ignition will stop advancing and begin to retard a bit due to the boost.

that makes sense... can I ask you what you are using for your timing?

[aznbmxxxer]

can you blow a motor if it runs too rich? i had a turbo b18b and i think the pistons melted cause the egt got too hot in 5th. but it neve ran lean at wot.