Bad PASSlock! Help me get a recall going, please!

[nightcat]

I have a 2001 Grand Am. I began buying it this past June ($8k still owed) and a problem generated by the PASSlock system has made my life, for the past two months, a living HELL. Before it became clear why my car was stalling at freeway speed or at 20MPH and having hard starts, crank/no-starts and start/stalls (the "security" lamp didn't begin coming on until just this week and the problem began in late October...) I'd already had the fuel pump and fuel filter replaced, spent (lost) money for three inconclusive diagnostics and several tows, had my car at the dealer I bought it from for over a week (and they couldn't figure it out..) and have been unable to drive anywhere beyond work for fear of it stalling in the middle of the road again!

Finally, the security lamp began coming on with each malfunction.

I've spoken to several mechanics locally who say that this problem is so pervasive and common in Grand Ams that they're AMAZED there isn't a recall. These same mechanics won't work on it. They warned me to be very leery of anyone except Pontiac dealers who will "fix" it...

I've read hundreds of Internet posts about PASSlock malfunction. It seems outrageously common. Last night I spoke on the phone to a Pontiac rep who is going to try to get me reimbursed for my repairs after I get the car to a dealer tomorrow (now I've only got to figure out how to get the grand or so a new engine computer and PASSlock interface - the prob is in the wiring harness and, if driven while malfunctioning ruins the engine computer - will cost me. it'll be this car's second engine computer replacement...).

I'm trying to get a recall petition going. Who's with me? If you've had PASSlock probs with a GA write me:

[email protected]

[nova_gh]

Sounds good to me, although with the way GM is going these days financially and having just recalled only 2 million trucks on a rear seat-belt issue, I think someone would have to actually be hurt or worse before they'd consider the passlock issue. its been going on since 99, six-seven years later, and not only the grand ams, but chevy malibus and olds aleros. nothing done about it.

And they still can't figure out why the japanesse are doing so much better. Maybe they should stop building stupid concept cars like the new Solstice from Pontiac or that truck/car thing from Chevy and focus on cars people actually want and can afford. And maybe not building them over seas in Australia and China and put their money into the Americans who need job desperately so they can afford a hot new Pontiac someday.

Thats my beef.

[nova_gh]

"This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients failed.

[email protected]"

[catback23]

not to say your diagnosis is incorrect but it's my understanding that passlock only does it's security check during pre-start and/or start sequence afterwards it remains passive. The computer could have internal or wiring problems to cause your problems but the car seems too new for the typical corrosion problem. And isn't there a recall on the ignition cylinder already in response to a passlock problem, not sure on what cars it's on but I know there is one on some gm model.

[xeroinfinity]

nightcast, heard of the lemon law? if i were u, i would threaten to sue, they'll change thier tune, and demand all your money back you paid for the car and labor/parts money and tell them to stick the car up thier asses. 2001s(and other gm models) are notorious for pass lock trouble, my suggestion is TURN IT OFF, DISABLE it.

i think catback23s right, there is a ignition cylinder recall, not sure what it intails. Goto Advance Auto or autozone web site they hav recall info upto date.

[Ridenour]

XI... man.... how the HELL did you manage to dig up this old of a thread? lol

[xeroinfinity]

HEY Ride! I didnt dig this up....Hummm... I havnt even been here for a couple days doing the damn holiday crapola.

[one_red_GTO]

Originally Posted by nightcat

I have a 2001 Grand Am. I began buying it this past June ($8k still owed) and a problem generated by the PASSlock system has made my life, for the past two months, a living HELL. Before it became clear why my car was stalling at freeway speed or at 20MPH and having hard starts, crank/no-starts and start/stalls (the "security" lamp didn't begin coming on until just this week and the problem began in late October...) I'd already had the fuel pump and fuel filter replaced, spent (lost) money for three inconclusive diagnostics and several tows, had my car at the dealer I bought it from for over a week (and they couldn't figure it out..) and have been unable to drive anywhere beyond work for fear of it stalling in the middle of the road again!

Finally, the security lamp began coming on with each malfunction.

I've spoken to several mechanics locally who say that this problem is so pervasive and common in Grand Ams that they're AMAZED there isn't a recall. These same mechanics won't work on it. They warned me to be very leery of anyone except Pontiac dealers who will "fix" it...

I've read hundreds of Internet posts about PASSlock malfunction. It seems outrageously common. Last night I spoke on the phone to a Pontiac rep who is going to try to get me reimbursed for my repairs after I get the car to a dealer tomorrow (now I've only got to figure out how to get the grand or so a new engine computer and PASSlock interface - the prob is in the wiring harness and, if driven while malfunctioning ruins the engine computer - will cost me. it'll be this car's second engine computer replacement...).

I'm trying to get a recall petition going. Who's with me? If you've had PASSlock probs with a GA write me:

[email protected]

This happened to me as well in my 2000 Grand AM SE. $400.00 later it was fixed, sounds like an ongoing problem.

[raycorri]

Originally Posted by one_red_GTO

This happened to me as well in my 2000 Grand AM SE. $400.00 later it was fixed, sounds like an ongoing problem.

My security light started coming on again about a year after paying the dealership $450 to replace a faulty Ignition lock cylinder. I was at my wit’s end. My wife and kids would be stuck at night in some shopping center parking lot waiting 10 minutes to reset the stupid thing. I was able to Bypass, Disable or Ghetto Hack my passlock II anti-theft system on my 2002 Oldsmobile Alero without relays or resistors. I had my local Auto wiring tech install a $5 on/off toggle switch under my dash that is connected into the yellow (key resistance/code/recognition) wire that can be cut while the engine is running to essientially bypass passlock I(1) or II(2) permanently.(I do not have nor intend to install a remote starter and I do not have an alarm on this car.) The toggle switch idea came about because of my concern that a dealership tech could possibly reset the security “fail- enable” mode or the battery could die or become disconnected for an extended period of time and reset the intended fault. All I need to do is flip a switch to break the circuit again while the car is running to take the passlock system offline. When the system is offline, the security light is on constantly.(Not flashing.) I don’t mind the light, but others may want to remove the bulb or black it out. Here’s how the setup works:
1)Switch On while engine is running – Security system is on.(Factory Setting) Security light is off. (Circuit is complete.)
2)Switch Off while engine is running – Security system goes into “fail-enable” mode and bypasses the passlock system.. Security light is illuminated.(Circuit is broken.)
3)Switch On while engine is off – Security system is on (Factory Setting)
4)Switch Off while engine is off – Security system detects this as a theft attempt
and will not allow you to start the car until you flip the switch On to complete the circuit.(Acts as a FUEL KILL SWITCH.)
Below you will find a thread and some supporting evidence of why this bypass actually works. The entire job took 25 minutes. There is an incredible link below with high resolution pictures of the wiring for your specific car. I included the actual photos that I used to gain access to my ignition lock cylinder wiring. *Special note: those with GM Class II Data Bus should leave your radio connected during the entire procedure so nothing weird happens. If you are unsure if your car is so equipped, it’s best to leave the radio connected and let it hang. Good luck and post with your success stories! 12/4/05

http://www.the12volt.com/installbay/...694&PN=1&TPN=1 Is this You? Get in your car....try to start it and find that the passlock II is screwed up again, you have to wait 10 minutes for it to reset. When it resets it starts up and runs fine. Fix-------Start the car, find the yellow wire that I'm sure you've read about, the rcode wire that is, and cut it. Shut off the car and you're done! The rcode wire on my 2001 alero is behind and to the left of the radio, you must take out the radio.....the yellow wire accompanies two other wires, the white and black, the 3 wires are alone and run inside what appears to be a cheap electrical tape that will fall apart in your hand when you start tugging on it, they are very thin wires, maybe 18 to 22. I taped off both ends of the yellow wire too.Took me about 14 days to find this out and reading no exageration 1000 posts. Forget all the relay, DEI and resister crap that I'm sure you've read about. All this writing assumes that this will continue to work.....i WILL be back here to post an update if it fails again. If you have doubts of me coming back to update a failure you can email me

http://www.insurorsservicebureau.com...cal/ISB_QA.pdf page 4, The PASS Key Module also has the ability to allow engine operation if it recognizes a system fault in the ignition key reference circuit while the engine is running. In this case the Module enters and remains in a mode which allows the engine to be started and run without reading the resistance chip. This mode requires that the original factory resistance chip key be in the ignition lock
cylinder at the time the fault occurs. During this mode, the
security light will be ON all the time. When the key reference circuit is repaired, the module will automatically reprogram itself to the mode requiring the original resistance chip.

http://www.motorage.com/motorage/dat...09/article.pdf page 3, If the correct key is in the cylinder and that circuit
fails while the engine is running, this is considered a
malfunction, not a theft attempt. The “Security” light
may turn on to warn of a system malfunction, but even if
it doesn’t, a key recognition circuit failure with the proper
key in the lock will cause the TDM to enter what GM
calls a “fail-enable” mode. Essentially, the theft-deterrent
system goes offline and the engine will start and run
with any key that turns the lock.
http://www.directwholesale.net/diagr...4&link=BULLDOG
http://www.directwholesale.net/diagr...7&link=BULLDOG
http://www.bulldogsecurity.com/ and click on vehicle wiring diagrams to select your particular make.
Also how to disable Daytime Running Lamps http://www.lightsout.org/disable.html
2001 Olds Alero Locate the DRL relay in the main fuse box under the hood, it is #22 corresponding to the diagram on the underside of the fuse box cover. Remove the relay, snip pin 87, and re-insert.

[xeroinfinity]

I still havnt had this trouble myself but hav seen it prevelant on 01's and up. My wife had trouble with our 99' but after I told her to ditch the 100 things on her keychain and after she did, the prob went away.

A year later, thats when the warrnty on the part is up isnt it?
This does need to be addressed by the NHTSA for a recall, I agree on that . Along with some other GA issues with the intake gaskets.
But seeing how GM's going for broke, I dont see them addressing any issues on a car they've discontinued.
For this to work you/we all need to get signatures from every GA owner possible. Thats how you get their attention, with 100,000++ signatures. So start collecting, I'll sign it!

[Hoags]

I have not had the problem on my 96 GAGT but I have seen enough threads on this forum regarding the passloc that I feel that it should be taken care of. You may want to check out the other Forums IE: Oldsmobile/Chevy/Buick cars in the same body line to see if they too are having the problem. I would be willing to bet that they use the same ignition setup. I could be wrong But if your trying to get a recall started it would not hurt to get their names as well the more names the more attention you will get.

I'll sign it!

XI: I'm with you on the other issues as well.

[catback23]

Originally Posted by Hoags

I have not had the problem on my 96 GAGT

Most pre-99 Grand Am's don't have passlock, actually I've yet to run across a single one.

[ricland06]

the below actually works...

Heres more info on a fix of that passover module starting problem. If you try this fix, please report back the results.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^

n my opinion, used parts won't solve the problem either because they will just fail like the new part that I put on. There are literally thousands of posts on the internet of people with these same ignition lock cylinder problems. The N-body cars seem to be the leaders.(Malibu, Alero, Grand-Am) Yeah, I can see where this might seem a bit involved.... but it's really not. I just wanted to follow up with evidence of how it works. The quick simple fix is just to cut the yellow wire and tape up both ends. I took a screwdriver to pop the cover from around the stereo and took out 4 screws. Then, pulled out the stereo. The 3 wires from the ignition are right there on the left. Start the car and cut the yellow wire. That's it. You won't have to replace the ignition lock cylinder until it falls apart. I don't have to worry about my wife and kids being stuck somewhere. I certainly didn't mean for it to come across as being complicated at all. Enevitably, someone will ask why this works.
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http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t491067.html

[raycorri]

Originally Posted by ricland06

the below actually works...

Heres more info on a fix of that passover module starting problem. If you try this fix, please report back the results.

This fix actually originates from some documents from GM Engineering. They were written for GM fleet trucks and vans so they could add remote start. We just use this procedure to Permanently Disable Passlock. Here are the links to the original bulletins:
http://www.gmupfitter.com/publicat/bull/bull2wsA.pdf and
http://www.gmupfitter.com/publicat/bull/bull26.pdf

The procedure to cut the Yellow Data Wire (while the engine is running)triggers the "fail-enable" mode. This is great, but it doesn't address the issue of battery disconnection at a later date. The bulletin warns that a battery disconnect will reset the PCM and clear the intended "fail-enable" condition. This will cause a "no-start" condition at your next attempt. This makes the addition of the On/Off toggle switch the best choice because you will not have to enter the wiring harness at a later date to reconnect the Yellow Data Wire. Here is the document re-written so that it makes sense to car owners.

PASSLOCK I or II DISABLEMENT

The following is a procedure to disable Passlock I or II Systems for vehicles in which remote start/stop system installations are required. This procedure is required because a remote start system will not function with the current Theft Deterrent System (Passlock) which is included on many 1996 and up GM vehicles.

Please note that this modification is intended to be used only in conjunction with the installation of a remote start/stop system and does not provide a procedure to install a remote start/stop system.

CAUSE
If an attempt is made to start a vehicle by a means other than a key rotation in the ignition switch, the Body Control Module (BCM) will interpret this start as a vehicle theft and disable the fuel injectors.

CORRECTION
A minor wiring modification may be made to allow the vehicle to be started remotely. This modification includes adding a switch to allow the customer to select “ON” to disable Passlock or “OFF” for normal Passlock operation.

CAUTION: When this modification is performed and the switch is set to the ON position, the theft deterrent feature will be disabled. When the theft
deterrent is disabled the SECURITY or THEFT telltale will light up indicating that the theft deterrent system is NOT functioning.

PASSLOCK MODIFICATION
Refer to appropriate GM service manuals and/or SVMQP Electrical Guideline Manual for instruction on splicing and electrical connections.
1. Select a suitable on-off switch (see note below) which will be used to disable/enable the Passlock System. Mount the switch in a location such that it is accessible to the driver and will not interfere with normal vehicle operation.
NOTE: This is an extremely low current circuit (approx. 7mA), it is therefore very important that a high quality, low energy, fast acting switch be utilized
for this application.
2. Turn the ignition switch to the OFF position.
3. Locate the Main Ignition Switch Harness. GM's Passlock System wires exit the Ignition Switch Tumbler together and then join with the Main Ignition Switch Harness. (See http://www.bulldogsecurity.com/ or http://64.85.6.118/diagrams/diagrams.asp and select your Make, Model and Year for wire colors and clues on the quickest way to access these wires.)
4. Locate the Yellow Passlock Data Wire which is included in a bundle of three tiny (20 GA) wires wrapped in friction tape.
Cut this wire and splice a 0.5mm2 (20 GA) yellow wire to each end of the cut wire.
Keep wire length to a minimum. Route modification wires clear of moving parts.
Connect the yellow wires to the switch such that the contacts are OPEN when the switch is in the ON position.
5. Turn modification switch to the OFF postion (contacts closed).
6. Start vehicle to verify normal operation. If engine “cranks but will not start"
recheck the switch position (contacts should be closed), wire connectors and
modification wiring.

SWITCH OPERATION

To enable remote start:
Start the engine with the ignition key (modification switch must be in the OFF
position). Turn modification switch to the ON position (contacts open). The
SECURITY or THEFT telltale will light up indicating that the Passlock System is inoperative.Once the SECURITY or THEFT telltale has been on for at least 5 seconds the vehicle can be turned off and then remotely started.

To disable remote start:
The Passlock System can be reactivated by turning the modification switch OFF(contacts closed). Vehicle can either be running or off when this is done.

Please note that the VCM/PCM will record Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTCs) related to the security system when the modification switch is in the ON position (circuit open). This is due to the way that the VCM/PCM interprets this condition.

NOTICE
Any condition which removes battery power from the Vehicle Control Module/Powertrain Control Module (VCM/PCM) (e.g. dead battery, disconnected harness connectors, etc.) will prevent the vehicle from being restarted. If the engine exhibits a “cranks but will not start” symptom, place the modification switch in the OFF (contacts closed) position. This will reactivate the Passlock System and allow the vehicle to be started with the ignition key.


Ray

Proud Member of The Anti-Passlock Club

[xeroinfinity]

Still is something that shouldnt hav to be done AT all. So it seems their is fault in the gm code with controls passlock? Glad mines not given me any trouble, you guys are useing the right keys(w/chip)?

Good Luck on your Recall.